Don't discount coal for a long while yet...
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Originally Posted By: SHOZ
Doesn't get around the environmental damage that comes from using coal.
Someone will figure out a use for ash. And technology will improve to clean up the emissions.
Doesn't get around the environmental damage that comes from using coal.
Someone will figure out a use for ash. And technology will improve to clean up the emissions.
Coal fired power plant fly ash has been reycled as feedstock for Portland cement for decades here. Same for petroleum refinery FCCU catalyst.
It's a win-win. Trucks that are empty after a Portland cement powder delivery pick these materials up as a backhaul on their way back to the cement plant typically.
I can honestly say I recycled tons per day of spent catalyst, a greater quantity than anyone else I know.
http://digital.csic.es/bitstream/10261/18626/1/S04_19.pdf
However we'll see if this is allowed to continue.
http://precast.org/2013/11/the-future-of-fly-ash-use-concrete/
It's a win-win. Trucks that are empty after a Portland cement powder delivery pick these materials up as a backhaul on their way back to the cement plant typically.
I can honestly say I recycled tons per day of spent catalyst, a greater quantity than anyone else I know.
http://digital.csic.es/bitstream/10261/18626/1/S04_19.pdf
However we'll see if this is allowed to continue.
http://precast.org/2013/11/the-future-of-fly-ash-use-concrete/
Originally Posted By: Nyogtha
However we'll see if this is allowed to continue.
http://precast.org/2013/11/the-future-of-fly-ash-use-concrete/
Yes, I alluded to that earlier in the thread.
No nothing's who listen to certain agenda driven groups stop the perfectly safe and benign beneficial re-use of these products (Rome was built with ash based concrete, and ash makes Portland based concrete even better)...
Those with an agenda are using this lobbying as a means to close coal down, as that's their stated and ultimate goal...and some are willing to believe them.
Australia, virtually every black coal station has the ability to load straight from the DCP to vacuum tankers...
WHEN we follow the US path, that may well change diverting another few MT to landfill.
However we'll see if this is allowed to continue.
http://precast.org/2013/11/the-future-of-fly-ash-use-concrete/
Yes, I alluded to that earlier in the thread.
No nothing's who listen to certain agenda driven groups stop the perfectly safe and benign beneficial re-use of these products (Rome was built with ash based concrete, and ash makes Portland based concrete even better)...
Those with an agenda are using this lobbying as a means to close coal down, as that's their stated and ultimate goal...and some are willing to believe them.
Australia, virtually every black coal station has the ability to load straight from the DCP to vacuum tankers...
WHEN we follow the US path, that may well change diverting another few MT to landfill.
Originally Posted By: SHOZ
Doesn't get around the environmental damage that comes from using coal.
Originally Posted By: SHOZ
It totally destroys
Originally Posted By: SHOZ
totally can destroy the environment.
I see that you are getting your info from rational sources, and have formed a rational opinion based on those sources.
Do we have to mine for silica ?
Do we have to mine for lithium ?
What about the quarrying for stone, sand and limestone, and the GHG that are produced making cement...that coal ash can immediately replace (unless of course, you get your way and get it declared hazardous waste).
Doesn't get around the environmental damage that comes from using coal.
Originally Posted By: SHOZ
It totally destroys
Originally Posted By: SHOZ
totally can destroy the environment.
I see that you are getting your info from rational sources, and have formed a rational opinion based on those sources.
Do we have to mine for silica ?
Do we have to mine for lithium ?
What about the quarrying for stone, sand and limestone, and the GHG that are produced making cement...that coal ash can immediately replace (unless of course, you get your way and get it declared hazardous waste).
Price of export coal down;
http://www.bcbusiness.ca/natural-resources/tecks-coal-problem
When the last coal fired power plant closes in Canada, this company will have to import ash;
http://www.lafarge.com./en
http://www.bcbusiness.ca/natural-resources/tecks-coal-problem
When the last coal fired power plant closes in Canada, this company will have to import ash;
http://www.lafarge.com./en
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: Shannow
Originally Posted By: SHOZ
Doesn't get around the environmental damage that comes from using coal.
Originally Posted By: SHOZ
It totally destroys
Originally Posted By: SHOZ
totally can destroy the environment.
I see that you are getting your info from rational sources, and have formed a rational opinion based on those sources.
Do we have to mine for silica ?
Do we have to mine for lithium ?
What about the quarrying for stone, sand and limestone, and the GHG that are produced making cement...that coal ash can immediately replace (unless of course, you get your way and get it declared hazardous waste).
Years of brain washing from watching Saturday morning children's TV programming seems to have worked for promoting tree hugging.
Originally Posted By: SHOZ
Doesn't get around the environmental damage that comes from using coal.
Originally Posted By: SHOZ
It totally destroys
Originally Posted By: SHOZ
totally can destroy the environment.
I see that you are getting your info from rational sources, and have formed a rational opinion based on those sources.
Do we have to mine for silica ?
Do we have to mine for lithium ?
What about the quarrying for stone, sand and limestone, and the GHG that are produced making cement...that coal ash can immediately replace (unless of course, you get your way and get it declared hazardous waste).
Years of brain washing from watching Saturday morning children's TV programming seems to have worked for promoting tree hugging.
Originally Posted By: SHOZ
Doesn't get around the environmental damage that comes from using coal.
If 60% of the Earths population would leave the surface of the earth we wouldn't have the enviromental problems we seem to be having. I haven't found large numbers that want to volunteer.
Doesn't get around the environmental damage that comes from using coal.
If 60% of the Earths population would leave the surface of the earth we wouldn't have the enviromental problems we seem to be having. I haven't found large numbers that want to volunteer.
Originally Posted By: SHOZ
Originally Posted By: fdcg27
Coal makes tremendous sense for power generation.
It's cheap, widely available, easily extracted and easy to ship safely.
Mining accidents?
Probably fewer deaths than those that are attributable to the exploration, extraction, transportation and refining of any petroleum fuel. Houses never blow up due to coal leaks either.
It's good to know that technical developments actually make coal an environmentally sound and efficient choice for power stations.
It seems wasteful to use liquid and gaseous fuels so well suited to use in other applications to generate power.
I don't know how anyone can say coal is environmentally sound. It totally destroys the environment it is mined from. The ash if not properly disposed of (as most is not) totally can destroy the environment.
My electric coop gets 60% of it's power from the most advanced and latest opened coal generator in the USA. It cannot compete against cheap natural gas anymore than the nuclear plants can.
http://www.prairiestateenergycampus.com/
Gas will not always remain cheap when the competition goes away.
Originally Posted By: fdcg27
Coal makes tremendous sense for power generation.
It's cheap, widely available, easily extracted and easy to ship safely.
Mining accidents?
Probably fewer deaths than those that are attributable to the exploration, extraction, transportation and refining of any petroleum fuel. Houses never blow up due to coal leaks either.
It's good to know that technical developments actually make coal an environmentally sound and efficient choice for power stations.
It seems wasteful to use liquid and gaseous fuels so well suited to use in other applications to generate power.
I don't know how anyone can say coal is environmentally sound. It totally destroys the environment it is mined from. The ash if not properly disposed of (as most is not) totally can destroy the environment.
My electric coop gets 60% of it's power from the most advanced and latest opened coal generator in the USA. It cannot compete against cheap natural gas anymore than the nuclear plants can.
http://www.prairiestateenergycampus.com/
Gas will not always remain cheap when the competition goes away.
The taxpayers in the USA pay for the cleaning up of the ash ponds and mine waste. Talk to Duke power and the 100s of millions of pounds of ash waste sitting outside their closed down coal generators.
http://www.southeastcoalash.org/?page_id=2417
http://www.catawbariverkeeper.org/issues...we-need-to-know
Or look at the mountain tops that have been totally removed to get to the coal.
https://www.google.com/search?q=mountain...AUICSgC#imgrc=_
http://www.southeastcoalash.org/?page_id=2417
http://www.catawbariverkeeper.org/issues...we-need-to-know
Or look at the mountain tops that have been totally removed to get to the coal.
https://www.google.com/search?q=mountain...AUICSgC#imgrc=_
Originally Posted By: SHOZ
The taxpayers in the USA pay for the cleaning up of the ash ponds and mine waste. Talk to Duke power and the 100s of millions of pounds of ash waste sitting outside their closed down coal generators.
http://www.southeastcoalash.org/?page_id=2417
You really love the koolaid that these sites provide you don't you ?
WHEN those people get their way, recycling of the ash will cease leading to a LARGER problem...
* and more mining for virgin stone
* and more CO2 from cement production.
They have a loosely veiled agenda which is to stop coal full stop, and then create angst in the feeble minded to lobby and sign petitions, and get even feebler minded politicians to pander to them.
As to Duke ?
watch that space over the next decade...they ARE doing stuff, and it WILL involve recycling, and a reduction in the mining of virgin materials...if the greenies don't get their way that is.
Because you personally feel justified in tipping used oil on your driveway, the mentality of these people would be to ban all home oil changes...they are the people feeding you ideas.
On THAT topic, hotmix made with fly ash instead of virgin limestone chip is handlable for twice as long after mixing, and makes a more compact, dense, and druable road.
5% flyash in the road base prvides fines that are needed to make high impact road bases, and the pozzolanic effects enable it to "set-up" over 60-90 days...have handled a section of roadbase that was made incorporating fly ash, broken glass, and demolition residue (bricks), that had a compressive strength of 25MPa, near that of low strength Concrete...facilitated another section of roadbase trial with ash and coal mine rejects, no potholes after 5 years.
The taxpayers in the USA pay for the cleaning up of the ash ponds and mine waste. Talk to Duke power and the 100s of millions of pounds of ash waste sitting outside their closed down coal generators.
http://www.southeastcoalash.org/?page_id=2417
You really love the koolaid that these sites provide you don't you ?
WHEN those people get their way, recycling of the ash will cease leading to a LARGER problem...
* and more mining for virgin stone
* and more CO2 from cement production.
They have a loosely veiled agenda which is to stop coal full stop, and then create angst in the feeble minded to lobby and sign petitions, and get even feebler minded politicians to pander to them.
As to Duke ?
watch that space over the next decade...they ARE doing stuff, and it WILL involve recycling, and a reduction in the mining of virgin materials...if the greenies don't get their way that is.
Because you personally feel justified in tipping used oil on your driveway, the mentality of these people would be to ban all home oil changes...they are the people feeding you ideas.
On THAT topic, hotmix made with fly ash instead of virgin limestone chip is handlable for twice as long after mixing, and makes a more compact, dense, and druable road.
5% flyash in the road base prvides fines that are needed to make high impact road bases, and the pozzolanic effects enable it to "set-up" over 60-90 days...have handled a section of roadbase that was made incorporating fly ash, broken glass, and demolition residue (bricks), that had a compressive strength of 25MPa, near that of low strength Concrete...facilitated another section of roadbase trial with ash and coal mine rejects, no potholes after 5 years.
Originally Posted By: Shannow
Originally Posted By: SHOZ
The taxpayers in the USA pay for the cleaning up of the ash ponds and mine waste. Talk to Duke power and the 100s of millions of pounds of ash waste sitting outside their closed down coal generators.
http://www.southeastcoalash.org/?page_id=2417
You really love the koolaid that these sites provide you don't you ?
WHEN those people get their way, recycling of the ash will cease leading to a LARGER problem...
* and more mining for virgin stone
* and more CO2 from cement production.
They have a loosely veiled agenda which is to stop coal full stop, and then create angst in the feeble minded to lobby and sign petitions, and get even feebler minded politicians to pander to them.
As to Duke ?
watch that space over the next decade...they ARE doing stuff, and it WILL involve recycling, and a reduction in the mining of virgin materials...if the greenies don't get their way that is.
Because you personally feel justified in tipping used oil on your driveway, the mentality of these people would be to ban all home oil changes...they are the people feeding you ideas.
On THAT topic, hotmix made with fly ash instead of virgin limestone chip is handlable for twice as long after mixing, and makes a more compact, dense, and druable road.
5% flyash in the road base prvides fines that are needed to make high impact road bases, and the pozzolanic effects enable it to "set-up" over 60-90 days...have handled a section of roadbase that was made incorporating fly ash, broken glass, and demolition residue (bricks), that had a compressive strength of 25MPa, near that of low strength Concrete...facilitated another section of roadbase trial with ash and coal mine rejects, no potholes after 5 years.
You can call it Kool-aid. I call it the way it is in the USA. Doesn't make any difference to those in the USA how it is where you are.
Originally Posted By: SHOZ
The taxpayers in the USA pay for the cleaning up of the ash ponds and mine waste. Talk to Duke power and the 100s of millions of pounds of ash waste sitting outside their closed down coal generators.
http://www.southeastcoalash.org/?page_id=2417
You really love the koolaid that these sites provide you don't you ?
WHEN those people get their way, recycling of the ash will cease leading to a LARGER problem...
* and more mining for virgin stone
* and more CO2 from cement production.
They have a loosely veiled agenda which is to stop coal full stop, and then create angst in the feeble minded to lobby and sign petitions, and get even feebler minded politicians to pander to them.
As to Duke ?
watch that space over the next decade...they ARE doing stuff, and it WILL involve recycling, and a reduction in the mining of virgin materials...if the greenies don't get their way that is.
Because you personally feel justified in tipping used oil on your driveway, the mentality of these people would be to ban all home oil changes...they are the people feeding you ideas.
On THAT topic, hotmix made with fly ash instead of virgin limestone chip is handlable for twice as long after mixing, and makes a more compact, dense, and druable road.
5% flyash in the road base prvides fines that are needed to make high impact road bases, and the pozzolanic effects enable it to "set-up" over 60-90 days...have handled a section of roadbase that was made incorporating fly ash, broken glass, and demolition residue (bricks), that had a compressive strength of 25MPa, near that of low strength Concrete...facilitated another section of roadbase trial with ash and coal mine rejects, no potholes after 5 years.
You can call it Kool-aid. I call it the way it is in the USA. Doesn't make any difference to those in the USA how it is where you are.
The Weekly Coal Production Report has been updated for the week ended
June 25, 2016.
• Estimated U.S. coal production totaled approximately 13.7 million short tons (mmst)
• This production estimate is 2.5% higher than last week's estimate and 11.9% lower than the production estimate in the comparable week in 2015
• East of the Mississippi River coal production totaled 5.2 mmst
• West of the Mississippi River coal production totaled 8.4 mmst
• U.S. year-to-date coal production totaled 316.6 mmst, 28.2% lower than the comparable year-to-date coal production in 2015
For more information:
http://www.eia.gov/coal/production/weekly
June 25, 2016.
• Estimated U.S. coal production totaled approximately 13.7 million short tons (mmst)
• This production estimate is 2.5% higher than last week's estimate and 11.9% lower than the production estimate in the comparable week in 2015
• East of the Mississippi River coal production totaled 5.2 mmst
• West of the Mississippi River coal production totaled 8.4 mmst
• U.S. year-to-date coal production totaled 316.6 mmst, 28.2% lower than the comparable year-to-date coal production in 2015
For more information:
http://www.eia.gov/coal/production/weekly
Originally Posted By: SHOZ
The Weekly Coal Production Report has been updated for the week ended
June 25, 2016.
• Estimated U.S. coal production totaled approximately 13.7 million short tons (mmst)
• This production estimate is 2.5% higher than last week's estimate and 11.9% lower than the production estimate in the comparable week in 2015
• East of the Mississippi River coal production totaled 5.2 mmst
• West of the Mississippi River coal production totaled 8.4 mmst
• U.S. year-to-date coal production totaled 316.6 mmst, 28.2% lower than the comparable year-to-date coal production in 2015
For more information:
http://www.eia.gov/coal/production/weekly
That is because?
The Weekly Coal Production Report has been updated for the week ended
June 25, 2016.
• Estimated U.S. coal production totaled approximately 13.7 million short tons (mmst)
• This production estimate is 2.5% higher than last week's estimate and 11.9% lower than the production estimate in the comparable week in 2015
• East of the Mississippi River coal production totaled 5.2 mmst
• West of the Mississippi River coal production totaled 8.4 mmst
• U.S. year-to-date coal production totaled 316.6 mmst, 28.2% lower than the comparable year-to-date coal production in 2015
For more information:
http://www.eia.gov/coal/production/weekly
That is because?
Originally Posted By: CT8
That is because?
NG is temporarily at a low price as per my link...
Here in Oz, 2 years ago NG was $4.50/GJ, and had been stable for ages...last week, I saw $34.50 for a few half hour periods, and sustained $10...with the number of coal plants shut down due to the disruptive power of wind, last week Oz companies were trying to balance the value of gas for home and industry versus the wholesale price of electricity being generated from that gas...it was a farce, watching both gas and wholesale electricity chasing each other to the moon.
It WILL displace coal, and then you won't be able to afford power.
That is because?
NG is temporarily at a low price as per my link...
Here in Oz, 2 years ago NG was $4.50/GJ, and had been stable for ages...last week, I saw $34.50 for a few half hour periods, and sustained $10...with the number of coal plants shut down due to the disruptive power of wind, last week Oz companies were trying to balance the value of gas for home and industry versus the wholesale price of electricity being generated from that gas...it was a farce, watching both gas and wholesale electricity chasing each other to the moon.
It WILL displace coal, and then you won't be able to afford power.
The premier of BC said "put on a sweater if you're cold".
Next it will be "build a campfire if you need to cook a meal", as another LNG ship is set to sail.
Next it will be "build a campfire if you need to cook a meal", as another LNG ship is set to sail.
The premier of BC should winter anywhere in rural Saskatchewan where they don't have natural gas; she should, ideally, choose a farm with an outhouse and have fun with it in the winter.
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