Blizzak tires year round?

[SubLGT]

To get an idea of how well a V rated winter can do in hot temps, read this short article: http://www.hendonpub.com/resources/articlearchive/details.aspx?ID=574

"......................the Los Angeles County Sheriff’s Department tested a Pirelli V-rated, 17-inch snow tire on a Ford CVPI. This test was part of Ford’s ongoing brake pad development. The snow tire was Pirelli’s Sottozero Winter 240, a Severe Snow Service-rated tire, and embossed as such with the snowflake-on-the-mountain symbol."

"In the 90-degrees F heat of Los Angeles, the snow compound did not have the same dry traction as the factory original Goodyear Eagle RS-A. However, it was close."

"The Sottozero snow tires were a little less responsive than the All-Season tires on the initial turn-in for the corners. The drivers had to turn in a bit sooner because the turn-in took a bit longer. However, the Sottozero tires were stable and predictable while cornering, according to both LAPD and LASD drivers."

 

[Craig in Canada]

I don't run Sottozero 240s (and I doubt that anyone asking if they can run snows all year round to save money would be either), but I can tell everyone that no matter what snow tires I've had (sport or regular) I dread putting them on in the fall and can't wait for the first possible second I can safely get them off in the spring because of the detrimental handling. This applies even well below the "marketing limit" of 7C as the switchover point let alone in summer-like weather.

The difference in grip, wear, performance, communication, braking and all around surefootedness is like night and day. I'm not a late braker or tailgater but the first thing I notice when putting the snows on is a dramatic increase in braking distance - enough for me to have to consciously adjust my driving. My conclusion after experience with several cars and various tire combos is that anyone saying they "didn't notice much of a difference" is comparing against pretty poor summer/all season tires or simply isn't paying much attention, IMO.

On the other hand my parents are snowbirds and drive down to FL with their snow tires on (usually a Pilot Alpin variant) and do OK in the pan handle area (mild but not hot) for a couple of months. They wear fairly well, but they are a sport-oriented high silica compound and not a multicell compound. The handling is definitely inferior but in their situation it's an understood compromise because they need to handle full winter conditions before leaving, while underway, and after they return. If I was snowbirding I would be looking for a small storage area to stash a set of wheels and summer tires (and other supplies) from year-to-year and change over when I arrived.

I fully understand the economics of running a dead set of snows through a summer to get the most out of them but, frankly, to me the difference in character is so great that I don't think you could pay me to do that... My observations don't just apply to summer vs. winter tires on my current car, but also to all season vs. winter tires more than 15 years ago on previous cars. When I ran all seasons as "summers" I couldn't wait to get the snows off and back to the sporty (by comparison) all seasons for the spring/summer/fall.

 

[JHZR2]

Im suprised that the snows didnt perform to the spec of the RS-A, which is a hard tire with relatively poor traction in my experience.

The whole reason that snows are used in tropical climates is for the climbing traction afforded by the soft compound.

The current set of BFG winterforce tires have nearly 20k and is nowhere near the wear indicators. All tropical use.

 

[Craig in Canada]

Originally Posted By: JHZR2
Im suprised that the snows didnt perform to the spec of the RS-A, which is a hard tire with relatively poor traction in my experience.


This is one of the things I was driving at: sure the study says that the (most expensive and most sporty in the world) snows were "almost" as good as the control tire. But the control tire turns out to be junk.

If anything, the cited report may prove the opposite of what was intended by the poster referencing it: If the most "summery" snow tire could not even equal the performance of a relatively poor regular tire, then snow tires are not recommended for all year use.

 

[Smokescreen]

Originally Posted By: JHZR2
Originally Posted By: Smokescreen
Blizzaks will melt like a snowcone in Phoenix in hot temps..


No they will not, not at all.


Its a figure a speech, I drove with a guy who had them on in the summer (he was finishing them off after a couple of winter only applications) up here in Canada its was about 85F, we just came off the freeway to go to restaurant, I got out of the car and all you could smell was warm rubber. I can only imagine what warmer temps would impact on wear.

 

[unDummy]

I run them year round. Summer is too short in New England to worry about it. I don't want the hassle of having tires mounted/balanced every season because of tire shop incompetence, and don't have the room for a spare set of wheels.

Run higher PSI in the warmer mounts will help with Blizzak's squirmy softness. I'm usually pushing 36-38psi on them in the summer but maybe 32-33psi in the snow. Drive a little slower. There is no need to go 80mph in them during the summer.

My all season Toyo Open Country A20's lasted 25k miles. The Blizzaks are at 25k miles and are 2 worn. I plan on changing the DM-Z3's with the newer DM-V1's at the 50k mark.

 

[JHZR2]

Originally Posted By: Smokescreen
Originally Posted By: JHZR2
Originally Posted By: Smokescreen
Blizzaks will melt like a snowcone in Phoenix in hot temps..


No they will not, not at all.


Its a figure a speech, I drove with a guy who had them on in the summer (he was finishing them off after a couple of winter only applications) up here in Canada its was about 85F, we just came off the freeway to go to restaurant, I got out of the car and all you could smell was warm rubber. I can only imagine what warmer temps would impact on wear.


Thing is, I would have thought that the exact same thing would happen with the subject tires that Ive driven on/rode around on and have seen for the last while (few years at this point). Im suprised they havent done just that, as I would have said the same as you if I didnt know the situation and see it first hand...

 

[Audi Junkie]

My nephew blew a Blizzak running in the summer.

 

[JHZR2]

What's to say he wouldnt have blown another non-winter tire in that situation?

 

[Audi Junkie]

I'd rather consider the facts of the situation than hypotheticals.

 

[JHZR2]

Originally Posted By: Audi Junkie
I'd rather consider the facts of the situation than hypotheticals.



I have firsthand facts. I've driven, rode on and tracked time and use on Winter tires in a tropical climate with tropical temperatures and UV.

The only hypothetical is that it was the tire, not a pothole or debris that would have caused the situation you cite. It is only hypothetical that the fact it was a winter tire had any bearing on the situation.

 

[CapriRacer]

I feel obligated to point out that operating a vehicle on a tropical island where there is hardly a straight stretch of highway is a bit easier on tires than operating one in the midwest where you can run for hours at high speed - the one area where winter tires are very likely to fall short.

 

[Audi Junkie]

Don't overthink it.

 

[mva]

You can lay black rubber patches on ice with Blizzak WS60.

My wife just did this a couple of days ago when she towed my car out of a snowbank with her van. Outside temperature was -10C and the road was covered with shear ice about 1/2" thick.

The blizzaks will wear very fast in the summer.

 

[IndyIan]

I think running a stud-able winter tire year round wouldn't be a bad idea, I have cheap goodyear nordics that have work well in the winter but also seem to be wear resistant. I'd guess we have 30K miles of Nov. to Apr driving on them with maybe 1/4 tread depth gone and 95% of the time we are driving on wet or dry pavement.
They aren't as good in snow as the best winter tires but they cost half as much and don't drive much different than my all-seasons in the shoulder seasons except for having far better wet traction and off road traction.

 

[Mr_Joe]

I can see driving during the summer with your Winter tires when they are about done for. That's when you plan to get new ones next fall. In that case you may as well get more out of them.

 

[D Hill]

I ran Dunlop Winter Sports year round on a '95 Thunderbird LX v8 I owned. They were a High Performance snow tire though, and honestly didn't give much up in warmer temps or at high speed. Their dry performance was commendable and better than more than a few all season tires I've had the displeasure of running. The car was one of two vehicles I used while I was a sales rep in the outdoor industry ( I also had a 98 Civic LX that I used for the same purpose).

My primary reason for running high perf snows year round was that most of my territories (The Dakotas, Montana, Idaho, Washington , Oregon, N California and Vancouver BC) had the possibility of snow from September to late May. I put 75K over 18 months on those tires (plus 50K on identical tires on the civic in the same time) and they always worked well in all weather conditions. Granted, I also rotated them religiously every 5K on the T-bird and every 3K on the civic (front wheel drive cars are always harder on tires) and always kept my vehicles in alignment.

The above being said you couldn't pay me to drive year round on a blizzak. They are extremely soft, noisy as [censored] and honestly would be too skittish on hot days. I think that unless you went with a euro style high performance snow tire (like the dunlop winter sports, if they even make them anymore) with higher speed travel in inclement mixed weather conditions considered in their design, you'd find yourself with a tire that would offer mediocre performance in the dry followed with poor performance the next winter due to all of the gummy top compound being used up while driving in the summer. Having had a set of blizzaks on a '97 540i for less than a winter I pulled them off due to how poorly they rode on anything other than snow conditions. Granted, I'm sure 8 or 9 years later they are a better tire than they were back then, but I'm pretty sure they still don't fall into the higher performance snow tire category even now. If you live someplace where you're thinking about dedicated snow tires Its honestly worth the extra money and hassle to have dedicated snow and summer tire sets. Just like most all season tires suck in the snow and slush I daresay that most snow tires are completely out of their element come a 90 degree day. Just my 2 Sesterce, mind you.

 

[Craig in Canada]

Originally Posted By: D Hill
I ran Dunlop Winter Sports year round on a '95 Thunderbird LX v8 I owned. They were a High Performance snow tire though, and honestly didn't give much up in warmer temps or at high speed. Their dry performance was commendable and better than more than a few all season tires I've had the displeasure of running.


As you mention farther down in your post, "high performance" winter tires are far more likely to give passable summer performance than "max" winter tires like your typical Blizzak WS series. If you're going to make a conscious decision to do this you should at least shop in the high-silica, high-performance end of the spectrum as you have done.

That being said, for years I used Dunlop Winter Sport M3s as winter tires and couldn't wait to get them off as early as possible in the spring. They really are pathetic compared to a set of summers or even a good set of all seasons. For me, Dunlop winter sports are also in the "you couldn't pay me to run them through the summer" category. Well, I suppose it would depend on just how much you wanted to pay me.... The vehicle in question is a 1998 528i sport - similar in character to the '97 540i you reference, so I thought I'd mention it.

I'm already counting down the days to shedding my winter tires (presently Hakkapeliitta RSi)...

 

[unDummy]

Originally Posted By: Audi Junkie
I'd rather consider the facts of the situation than hypotheticals.



So, what are the facts? what did he hit? what was the tire pressure? how fast was he going? what was the tread depth?

 

[dailydriver]

Originally Posted By: Craig in Canada
I'm already counting down the days to shedding my winter tires (presently Hakkapeliitta RSi)...


Yes, I would NOT want to shread/burn up those max winter beauties either, in the warm/hot spring/summer. $$$$