No block and battery heaters?
Battery Replacement - Time Interval
- Thread starter RamFan
- Start date
Not at work. It sits there for 9 hours and then gets a cold start. It does have a block heater but is in a heated garage over night.
Wow. That’s a good run. Like someone said, heat injures batteries and cold kills them. I find if you ever get a slow start, replace it. ( of course knowing someone didn’t accidentally leave the lights on ). I hate replacing batteries in a cold dark parking lots. Having said that, I like using a battery tester ( $50 bucks). I just posted that I have a seven year old 770 CCA battery that fades to 500 CCA in 24 hours after fully charging. That’s good enough for 32 F, but I have -25 F coming in January ( and I take it, so do you). Plus it’s my wife’s vehicle. Happy wife, happy life.
Wife’s OEM Yukon battery which is AGM and underhood died at just over 3 years. She idles a lot so it gets a lot of heat and it just quit when we came out of a store. No slow cranks or anything else to indicate it was failing. That’s the shortest life I’ve gotten out of a new battery.
I've had good luck with my batteries. They usually last 8 plus years. This year due to low amount of driving, I've been charging batteries every 2-3 weeks. Every fall I make sure to clean the battery terminals and top up the cells with distilled water.
Evening folks, rather than start a new thread I figured I’d ask here since it’s related.
After charging up the Giulia’s battery, I realized that getting the load tester on the battery itself (in the trunk) is going to be a PITA. I can’t find a straight answer online so am going to you fine folks. Can I use the remote posts in the engine bay to load test?
After charging up the Giulia’s battery, I realized that getting the load tester on the battery itself (in the trunk) is going to be a PITA. I can’t find a straight answer online so am going to you fine folks. Can I use the remote posts in the engine bay to load test?
My wife was a school teacher before she retired and I always just replaced the battery in her car every 4 years. She had a 100 mile commute to school and back through sparsely populated areas. I just didn't want her to be a victim of a person that "Stopped to help".
Of course. The starter is in the engine bay as well, no?
Fair point!I'd not use a carbon pile load tester on remote posts.
I'd not want to use one on a battery still electrically connected to the vehicle.
Perhaps it would be fine.
Perhaps some expensive electronic component might get all irritated, and release its magic smoke.
It could be an expensive assumption, that it would be 'just fine'.
Your vehicle, your decision.
A conductance tester, on remote posts, does not know there is X amount of circuit distance between its clamps and the battery terminals . It calculates resistance by putting a small load on the battery, seeing how much voltage drops, calculates battery resistance, and correlates that to a resistance/CCA algorithm and hopefully includes temperature into that equation.
Conductance tester AND carbon pile testers, can have their results manipulated with the amount of clamp pressure, and the amount of surface area of the clamp's jaws are in direct contact with the battery terminal or post clamp exterior.
Recently applied charging sources, or loads, can greatly affect conductance/ carbon pile testers results, as will actual battery temperature.
Got a big 2 inch spring clamp that can fit atop the testers clamps to exert a lot more pressure? Try it, and expect to see 50 more CCA displayed on a conductance tester, and if a carbon pile, the voltage will likely remain higher, and the clamps will stay cooler..
I view each engine start as a load test. I have a 3 wire 2 decimal voltmeter which comes on with key to on, and its voltage sense lead and ground go right to the battery.
Warm restarts are pretty useless as engine catches so quickly, but an overnight cold start, the minimum voltage seen, as the battery ages, keeps dropping.
When it falls to the low 8 volt level, assuming it has not been depleted by leaving the lights on or something, the battery is soon destined to not be able to start the engine at that same battery/engine temperature.
A healthy newish battery likely stays 11.5v or above, when starting overnight cold engine.
A battery dropping to 7.75v is almost certainly causing the dreaded click click / no start.
The true CCA test is 1/2 the CCA rating of the battery applied to the battery, and it must remain above 7.75v after 30 seconds.
This test is incredibly abusive to the battery, but can do a service by pushing a weak battery to failure, when convenient.
This test was developed long ago when a carb'd engine might struggle to start over repeated attempts, and before they decided to maxprofit battery manufacturing, using as little lead(pb) as they can get away with, and current fuel injected vehicles require a fraction that of older carb'd improperly tuned engines.
Few load testers, can one dial in 1/2 the rated CCA of the battery. Most apply an ~150 amp load and have an analog voltmeter, and the higher the voltage remains, and the needle likely stays in the green.
My 1.4KW( output) rated starter draws close to 1800 watts.
If the battery can maintain 10 volts, during that 1800 watt load, that is 180 amps.
So you can see that if a carbon pile load tester is only capable of 150 amps, and one's starter motor is also in that range, then all one needs is a voltmeter to see how much the voltage falls each time they start their overnight cold engine, and with experience gained at different battery/engine temperatures, can easily see how their battery is performing, and gauge when they would be wise to replace as a precautionary measure.
I've view a conductance tester's data/ reading/results, as secondary to actual voltage drop during engine starting.
The 150 amp carbon pile testers, at least mimic the load of a starter motor.
Why use mimicry?
Put your DMM leads on the battery terminals, and have a helper start the engine.
11v+ excellent
9.5v+ good
9.0 to 9.5 fair to good
8.5 to 9.0v fair to poor
less than 9.0v, one should begin battery shopping.
less than 8.25v, if 10 degrees colder it likely would not start.
As the weather coold, and battery and engine temperature also drop, these start voltages will also fall, so summer readings can make one think all is well then one cold morning can reveal the poor condition of the battery.
Slow cranking might be noticed only when it is falling to 9 or below, it depends on the specific vehicle.
Those insisting on getting max lifespans from their lead acid batteries, whether flooded, AGM, or the actual rare gelled electrolyte battery, should insure regular full charges are achieved, and not assume the vehicle itself is capable, or even attempting, to achieve this ideal.
The older/more abused the battery, the longer it requires at high charge voltages for specific gravity of the electrolyte to max out.
When the aging battery needs this extra time at higher voltages, and does not get it, it degrades even faster.
Such a battery can be nursed for a long while, with an owner regularly applying a top charge, or it can jump off a cliff with an owner who blasts the stereo, engine of, for 5 minutes, and thinks a trip around the block restores that which their stereo consumed.
80 to 100% charged is in the order of 3 to 3.5 hours with a healthy battery being held int the 14.2 to 14.8v range
80% to 100% charged is in the order of 5 to 15 hours, with an unhealthy battery being held at the same voltage.
Lower charge voltages can increase the time to full by a factor of 3, and some older batteries will never have their specific gravity maxed out at lesser charge voltages.
Most vehicles will not hold these higher voltages, even if the driver drives for that amount of time.
So assuming the vehicle is top charging the battery each time it is driven, can be considered unwise in the extreme, but alternatively, the battery is only rented, is destined to fail, so why bother shiving a git?
Modern vehicles voltage regulation, can basically sacrifice the battery, in order to squeeze out a smidge more MPG.
Older vehicles, with largely static voltage regulation, can take far better care of the battery, in average use, even if the average voltage is un-ideal for long drives in hot ambient temperatures, or too low to semi quickly recharge a well depleted battery in freezing temps, to 80% or above.
Charging from 80% to 100% state of charge, is always, an hours long process with lead acid batteries, and ideally for maximum longevity, they always want to be 100%, and kept cool.
I'd not want to use one on a battery still electrically connected to the vehicle.
Perhaps it would be fine.
Perhaps some expensive electronic component might get all irritated, and release its magic smoke.
It could be an expensive assumption, that it would be 'just fine'.
Your vehicle, your decision.
A conductance tester, on remote posts, does not know there is X amount of circuit distance between its clamps and the battery terminals . It calculates resistance by putting a small load on the battery, seeing how much voltage drops, calculates battery resistance, and correlates that to a resistance/CCA algorithm and hopefully includes temperature into that equation.
Conductance tester AND carbon pile testers, can have their results manipulated with the amount of clamp pressure, and the amount of surface area of the clamp's jaws are in direct contact with the battery terminal or post clamp exterior.
Recently applied charging sources, or loads, can greatly affect conductance/ carbon pile testers results, as will actual battery temperature.
Got a big 2 inch spring clamp that can fit atop the testers clamps to exert a lot more pressure? Try it, and expect to see 50 more CCA displayed on a conductance tester, and if a carbon pile, the voltage will likely remain higher, and the clamps will stay cooler..
I view each engine start as a load test. I have a 3 wire 2 decimal voltmeter which comes on with key to on, and its voltage sense lead and ground go right to the battery.
Warm restarts are pretty useless as engine catches so quickly, but an overnight cold start, the minimum voltage seen, as the battery ages, keeps dropping.
When it falls to the low 8 volt level, assuming it has not been depleted by leaving the lights on or something, the battery is soon destined to not be able to start the engine at that same battery/engine temperature.
A healthy newish battery likely stays 11.5v or above, when starting overnight cold engine.
A battery dropping to 7.75v is almost certainly causing the dreaded click click / no start.
The true CCA test is 1/2 the CCA rating of the battery applied to the battery, and it must remain above 7.75v after 30 seconds.
This test is incredibly abusive to the battery, but can do a service by pushing a weak battery to failure, when convenient.
This test was developed long ago when a carb'd engine might struggle to start over repeated attempts, and before they decided to maxprofit battery manufacturing, using as little lead(pb) as they can get away with, and current fuel injected vehicles require a fraction that of older carb'd improperly tuned engines.
Few load testers, can one dial in 1/2 the rated CCA of the battery. Most apply an ~150 amp load and have an analog voltmeter, and the higher the voltage remains, and the needle likely stays in the green.
My 1.4KW( output) rated starter draws close to 1800 watts.
If the battery can maintain 10 volts, during that 1800 watt load, that is 180 amps.
So you can see that if a carbon pile load tester is only capable of 150 amps, and one's starter motor is also in that range, then all one needs is a voltmeter to see how much the voltage falls each time they start their overnight cold engine, and with experience gained at different battery/engine temperatures, can easily see how their battery is performing, and gauge when they would be wise to replace as a precautionary measure.
I've view a conductance tester's data/ reading/results, as secondary to actual voltage drop during engine starting.
The 150 amp carbon pile testers, at least mimic the load of a starter motor.
Why use mimicry?
Put your DMM leads on the battery terminals, and have a helper start the engine.
11v+ excellent
9.5v+ good
9.0 to 9.5 fair to good
8.5 to 9.0v fair to poor
less than 9.0v, one should begin battery shopping.
less than 8.25v, if 10 degrees colder it likely would not start.
As the weather coold, and battery and engine temperature also drop, these start voltages will also fall, so summer readings can make one think all is well then one cold morning can reveal the poor condition of the battery.
Slow cranking might be noticed only when it is falling to 9 or below, it depends on the specific vehicle.
Those insisting on getting max lifespans from their lead acid batteries, whether flooded, AGM, or the actual rare gelled electrolyte battery, should insure regular full charges are achieved, and not assume the vehicle itself is capable, or even attempting, to achieve this ideal.
The older/more abused the battery, the longer it requires at high charge voltages for specific gravity of the electrolyte to max out.
When the aging battery needs this extra time at higher voltages, and does not get it, it degrades even faster.
Such a battery can be nursed for a long while, with an owner regularly applying a top charge, or it can jump off a cliff with an owner who blasts the stereo, engine of, for 5 minutes, and thinks a trip around the block restores that which their stereo consumed.
80 to 100% charged is in the order of 3 to 3.5 hours with a healthy battery being held int the 14.2 to 14.8v range
80% to 100% charged is in the order of 5 to 15 hours, with an unhealthy battery being held at the same voltage.
Lower charge voltages can increase the time to full by a factor of 3, and some older batteries will never have their specific gravity maxed out at lesser charge voltages.
Most vehicles will not hold these higher voltages, even if the driver drives for that amount of time.
So assuming the vehicle is top charging the battery each time it is driven, can be considered unwise in the extreme, but alternatively, the battery is only rented, is destined to fail, so why bother shiving a git?
Modern vehicles voltage regulation, can basically sacrifice the battery, in order to squeeze out a smidge more MPG.
Older vehicles, with largely static voltage regulation, can take far better care of the battery, in average use, even if the average voltage is un-ideal for long drives in hot ambient temperatures, or too low to semi quickly recharge a well depleted battery in freezing temps, to 80% or above.
Charging from 80% to 100% state of charge, is always, an hours long process with lead acid batteries, and ideally for maximum longevity, they always want to be 100%, and kept cool.
Well I got my longevity answer
After just charging up and testing the battery in Sept, I thought I could get one last season out of it, but admittedly the results were borderline so I should have just replaced it then instead of gambling. My gamble did not pay off. The car sat outside for five days during a recent trip, average temp during this time was 34*. No start at 1230a after getting off a 3.5hr flight. Not messing around with it, grabbed an Uber home then replaced it in the morning w/ an Interstate from Costco.
Almost 6yrs and a tad over 90k miles. It had a good run.
After just charging up and testing the battery in Sept, I thought I could get one last season out of it, but admittedly the results were borderline so I should have just replaced it then instead of gambling. My gamble did not pay off. The car sat outside for five days during a recent trip, average temp during this time was 34*. No start at 1230a after getting off a 3.5hr flight. Not messing around with it, grabbed an Uber home then replaced it in the morning w/ an Interstate from Costco.
Almost 6yrs and a tad over 90k miles. It had a good run.
Pretty sure airport parking gives free jump starts. This happens often there.
Yeah, was parked at my office building a few min away from the airport. Uber driver graciously offered his car as a jump, wasn’t quite up to snuff unfortunately. Didn’t want to keep him waiting too long so I didn’t have it hooked up for too long before giving it a shot.
Should this happen again and I’m at the airport lot, I’ll definitely remember your suggestion.
Next time I’ll just stop being cheap and try to squeeze every half cent out of parts.
I've recently replaced my battery on time interval at 12 years old.
I didn't want to risk the battery making it through another winter even though it had never come near to failing to start. I could tell it was on the way out though as the fully charged rested voltage was dropping faster than it had been. If you charge a battery regularly you get to know it's behavior and notice when something changes. This is the 2nd time I've had a battery last 12 years but I pushed the first one too far and was rewarded with finding it had failed totally one morning with not even a click. I wasn't about to let that happen again. My motorcycle battery is 8 years old but showing no signs of failure yet other than a modest reduction in rested voltage.
I didn't want to risk the battery making it through another winter even though it had never come near to failing to start. I could tell it was on the way out though as the fully charged rested voltage was dropping faster than it had been. If you charge a battery regularly you get to know it's behavior and notice when something changes. This is the 2nd time I've had a battery last 12 years but I pushed the first one too far and was rewarded with finding it had failed totally one morning with not even a click. I wasn't about to let that happen again. My motorcycle battery is 8 years old but showing no signs of failure yet other than a modest reduction in rested voltage.
CleanSump
Site Donor 2022
Timely thread. I replaced the battery in the 2008 Mercedes today. 13 years is a record for me!
Normally she cranked right over, no real cranking. Even in Winter just glow the plugs and vroom.
It just cranked slow Monday and Wednesday mornings when it was about 30 F. So I got one today. She had a good run.
The Blazer usually needs one every 5 or 6 years, as have most of my past vehicles.
Normally she cranked right over, no real cranking. Even in Winter just glow the plugs and vroom.
It just cranked slow Monday and Wednesday mornings when it was about 30 F. So I got one today. She had a good run.
The Blazer usually needs one every 5 or 6 years, as have most of my past vehicles.
This should be stickied for all those that suggest a working four, five or six year old battery should automatically be replaced just because it's four, five or six years old.
Did you get rid of the battery? You can switch to the temperature display and with the car off, hit the reset button 3 times and it will display the voltage of the battery. Mine is also a 2008 and it has the date code on the terminal post. Mine was made in November so it's 14 years old now. Mine died on me last year, gave it a good charge and it's still going a year later. Still ok so far, display ranges from 11.5-11.9. I don't linger though.
CleanSump
Site Donor 2022
Looks like you have the record!
I traded the battery in for $26. My voltage was down to 11.2 V so I just decided to go ahead and feel good about it.
A new MB battery makes the car run better too!
Redline makes it run quieter, and Prestone makes it run cooler. (Actually I've been using Castrol oil and she still has OE coolant)
When it died last year, it was down to 11.2 volts. With the seat heater on and the lights and radio, you can watch it drop by .1 volts every minute or so with the engine off.Looks like you have the record!
I traded the battery in for $26. My voltage was down to 11.2 V so I just decided to go ahead and feel good about it.
A new MB battery makes the car run better too!
(Actually I've been using Castrol oil and she still has OE coolant)
