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Woes of an aging Hyundai

Posted By: Fifth87

Woes of an aging Hyundai - 06/16/19 06:08 PM

Vehicle in question is my fiancée's '05 Sonata
She has owned since new, maintained either by an independent or myself.
130K, runs and drives fine, (surprisingly) body and interior in good shape
Replacement is not an option at this point.

First issue is an electrical issue that has gotten progressively worse.
Power locks intermittently lock/unlock on their own, worse in cold weather. Sometimes closing the door hard triggers it, sometimes not. Makes for a real challenge at times as you can unlock it, and it will lock you out instantly. Clock also has become intermittent, but does not lose time. Battery is a 3yr old dealer replacement battery installed by someone other than myself.

Second issue, and one that I am more worried about.
Due to her complete refusal to wash the car, the front subframe is getting tender. I have been keeping an eye on it and have been surprised twice now that it had not been caught in the State Inspection process.
Doing an oil change yesterday, I tapped on a portion of the subframe and the end of my ratchet went right through, creating a clean hole.
Foolish me, I tapped on another portion and created another hole. I did not think to take pictures and the car is not here at the moment.

Any thoughts or suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
Posted By: eljefino

Re: Woes of an aging Hyundai - 06/16/19 06:18 PM

Subframes can be changed-- I used to do this all the time with saturn s-series.

The door locks are probably a pinched wire in the door hinge, or a grimy switch. I'd pull the fuse if you don't want to put the work in.
Posted By: Danno

Re: Woes of an aging Hyundai - 06/16/19 06:19 PM

Replacement needs to be an option.
That subframe issue is telling me the car is on borrowed time, or past time.
One big pothole and its done, never mind what that corrosion does to crashworthiness.
Posted By: caprice_2nv

Re: Woes of an aging Hyundai - 06/16/19 06:22 PM

We replaced a few subframe/engine cradles in the garages I've worked at. It's $1000 repair but cheaper than a new vehicle. If he rest of it isn't rusted out it may be worth doing.
Posted By: atikovi

Re: Woes of an aging Hyundai - 06/16/19 06:31 PM

Originally Posted by caprice_2nv
We replaced a few subframe/engine cradles in the garages I've worked at. It's $1000 repair but cheaper than a new vehicle. If he rest of it isn't rusted out it may be worth doing.


If the subframe is so rusted out that it requires replacement, isn't the body it's attached to going to be just as bad?
Posted By: Mad_Hatter

Re: Woes of an aging Hyundai - 06/16/19 07:23 PM

Originally Posted by atikovi
Originally Posted by caprice_2nv
We replaced a few subframe/engine cradles in the garages I've worked at. It's $1000 repair but cheaper than a new vehicle. If he rest of it isn't rusted out it may be worth doing.


If the subframe is so rusted out that it requires replacement, isn't the body it's attached to going to be just as bad?


At minimum the drivetrain and suspension should be inspected, front and rear. A rusted out subframe as is being described, can be a safety problem. But before deciding to replace it i would inspect everything else, including the rear end.

Replacing a subframe is not particularly hard. You just have to be sure to properly support everything. It's something you can do if you have/have access to the necessary tools.
Posted By: eljefino

Re: Woes of an aging Hyundai - 06/16/19 07:44 PM

The worst issue I have with switching subframes is getting the exhaust apart in a way that it can be put back together later.

That, and the captive nuts inside the unibody frame rails get bent if one uses a rattle gun. Start the old bolts out nice and easy, by hand.

There are plenty of cars with good floorboards and bad subframes. IDK about your hyundai, but the way they seal up and zinc-coat car bodies vs black-painted subframes is sometimes not comparable.
Posted By: Nitronoise

Re: Woes of an aging Hyundai - 06/16/19 08:03 PM

My Sons 03 Santa FE had the subframe replaced by Hyundai up in Minnon a recall /TSB you might want to check into it with the dealership
Posted By: Linctex

Re: Woes of an aging Hyundai - 06/16/19 08:06 PM

Originally Posted by eljefino
That, and the captive nuts inside the unibody frame rails get bent if one uses a rattle gun. Start the old bolts out nice and easy, by hand.


Even doing that, I have never had good luck getting them out.


Originally Posted by atikovi
If the subframe is so rusted out that it requires replacement, isn't the body it's attached to going to be just as bad?


Sometimes it is just as bad, yes
Posted By: Mad_Hatter

Re: Woes of an aging Hyundai - 06/16/19 08:17 PM

Originally Posted by Nitronoise
My Sons 03 Santa FE had the subframe replaced by Hyundai up in Minnon a recall /TSB you might want to check into it with the dealership


The recall didn't effect '05 Sonata's.
Posted By: Lapham3

Re: Woes of an aging Hyundai - 06/16/19 08:22 PM

I'm in the rust belt and have an '05 Elantra bought years ago from the original local owner. At purchase the mechanical maintenance was up to date or early done by the selling dealer. There was just a tad of light rust started in a few spots, so each spring I spend a couple hours with a wire brush and the Rustoleum rust converter. So far, so good and the mechanicals are also doing well at 138k miles. A little time with preventative can be well worth it. Lots of cars up here can look pretty good until you get underneath.
Posted By: Mad_Hatter

Re: Woes of an aging Hyundai - 06/16/19 08:42 PM

Originally Posted by Danno
Replacement needs to be an option.
That subframe issue is telling me the car is on borrowed time, or past time.
One big pothole and its done, never mind what that corrosion does to crashworthiness.


If he's able to punch a hole just by tapping on it, it's not a question of if but when. Pray it gives out while parked in the garage and not on the highway.
Posted By: maxdustington

Re: Woes of an aging Hyundai - 06/16/19 09:10 PM

If you can get the SF from a upic yard and install it yourself, do it. Otherwise that car ain't worth it with the problems it has.
Posted By: Fifth87

Re: Woes of an aging Hyundai - 06/16/19 10:36 PM

Thanks to all that have replied so far.
After some research Hyundai still sells the subframe. Anything from a yard is likely to be junk. I intend on farming out this job, as this is beyond the scope of my skills having limited time to do it. Even with the cost, still cheaper than a decent used car that she would agree to drive.
Posted By: eljefino

Re: Woes of an aging Hyundai - 06/16/19 11:51 PM

Good idea! Almost always cheaper to keep it, and you'll be happy you got through this vehicular midlife crisis a year from now.

This sort of job is a 7/10 on the frustration factor.
Posted By: Mad_Hatter

Re: Woes of an aging Hyundai - 06/17/19 12:14 AM

Originally Posted by Fifth87
Thanks to all that have replied so far.
After some research Hyundai still sells the subframe. Anything from a yard is likely to be junk. I intend on farming out this job, as this is beyond the scope of my skills having limited time to do it. Even with the cost, still cheaper than a decent used car that she would agree to drive.


Smart man and nothing wrong with having a shop do it and get under there and look at the whole underside.

That salts a biyach, eh? Glad they don't use it in these parts.
Posted By: MrMoody

Re: Woes of an aging Hyundai - 06/17/19 12:35 AM

Originally Posted by Fifth87
First issue is an electrical issue that has gotten progressively worse.
Power locks intermittently lock/unlock on their own, worse in cold weather. Sometimes closing the door hard triggers it, sometimes not. Makes for a real challenge at times as you can unlock it, and it will lock you out instantly.
As though some prankster was inside pushing the button. smile

Try unplugging the switch pod(s) that lock/unlock them from the inside and see if that cures it. I bet you have a broken switch.
Posted By: John_K

Re: Woes of an aging Hyundai - 06/17/19 01:11 AM

I had the lock issue once. Then the battery died. New battery, no more problem.
Posted By: edwardh1

Re: Woes of an aging Hyundai - 06/17/19 01:35 AM

they made the metal too thin for rust belt driving
Posted By: eljefino

Re: Woes of an aging Hyundai - 06/17/19 01:48 AM

Originally Posted by MrMoody

Try unplugging the switch pod(s) that lock/unlock them from the inside and see if that cures it. I bet you have a broken switch.


True, but most power window switches are like a 3-way circuit with a "floating" +/- and removing any switch could render things inoperable.

May still have diagnostic value. And as it is, they sound pretty broken anyway.
Posted By: MarkM66

Re: Woes of an aging Hyundai - 06/17/19 01:55 PM

Originally Posted by Fifth87
Thanks to all that have replied so far.
After some research Hyundai still sells the subframe. Anything from a yard is likely to be junk. I intend on farming out this job, as this is beyond the scope of my skills having limited time to do it. Even with the cost, still cheaper than a decent used car that she would agree to drive.


How much is a new one?

There are a few rust free used ones on ebay.
Posted By: Fifth87

Re: Woes of an aging Hyundai - 06/17/19 02:37 PM

The new one is $676.00
Posted By: AC1DD

Re: Woes of an aging Hyundai - 06/17/19 06:21 PM

I agree with others that if the subframe is rotting through and the car has not been washed on a regular basis the unibody is likely ready for the scrapyard as well.
She better start saving her money. crackmeup
Posted By: Mad_Hatter

Re: Woes of an aging Hyundai - 06/17/19 06:33 PM

Originally Posted by Fifth87
The new one is $676.00


Check eBay and LKQ and your local junker. (Pick n pull) Try and find a West coast car...I bet you can do waaay better than the $600+ of a new one. That'll help offset the cost of the install labour. On some cars you can do the subframe in 2-3hrs...but my guess is shop time is gonna be twice that. And do shop around for shop prices.
Posted By: meep

Re: Woes of an aging Hyundai - 06/17/19 08:32 PM

I'd factor in the price of an alignment also - lower control arms often tie into that piece. We had an 02 accord that had multiple alignment issues until they loosened and shoved the subframe over a hair.
Posted By: ad244

Re: Woes of an aging Hyundai - 06/17/19 11:00 PM

http://www.car-part.com/
Posted By: racin4ds

Re: Woes of an aging Hyundai - 06/18/19 01:40 PM

Maybe now she'll see why regular washing and undercarriage cleaning is a necessity when you live up north. But my suspicions are the rest of the frame isn't far behind if the subframe is already this bad...

Our 05 Tucson is at 156,000 miles and doesn't have a spot of rust anywhere (original Florida car) but there are other small things starting to show up that are nickle and diming me lately....
Posted By: maxdustington

Re: Woes of an aging Hyundai - 06/18/19 02:31 PM

Originally Posted by racin4ds
Maybe now she'll see why regular washing and undercarriage cleaning is a necessity when you live up north.
It's not. Lots of cars here get oil sprayed more often than they are washed.
Originally Posted by edwardh1
they made the metal too thin for rust belt driving
Bingo, Hyundai was a value brand that cheapskates or homesick Koreans bought in 2005.
Posted By: JTK

Re: Woes of an aging Hyundai - 06/18/19 03:20 PM

Assuming this Sonata spent it's life in the rust belt, ~15yrs is a good run for it if this is the only real corrosion damage.
Posted By: caprice_2nv

Re: Woes of an aging Hyundai - 06/21/19 02:33 AM

My bosses wife had a ~2008ish Tuscon and it was bought brand new with a lifetime rustproofing/warranty on it through the Hyundai dealer. This winter he found it the unibody was rusted away, not much left, went to Hyundai and they said take it to a body shop and get an estimate. Nobody would repair it because of the extent of the rust.

They ended up trading it on a newer Tuscon despite basically getting screwed on the deal. Hyundai is very lucky to have some very forgiving customer's. They were given $1500 on the trade in at least when it was probably worth about $500 for scrap.

That said I have seen lots of subframes rusted out while the rest of the car was still okay. Neons and cavalier's were known for it.
Posted By: JTK

Re: Woes of an aging Hyundai - 06/21/19 02:37 AM

Originally Posted by caprice_2nv


That said I have seen lots of subframes rusted out while the rest of the car was still okay. Neons and cavalier's were known for it.


Oh for sure. It's common to find rear subframes rusted away on 2005ish Subarus in my area as well. It's that magic 15yr point when most vehicles are about shot from corrosion.
Posted By: thooks

Re: Woes of an aging Hyundai - 06/21/19 01:48 PM

Originally Posted by MarkM66

How much is a new one?



$9995
Posted By: caprice_2nv

Re: Woes of an aging Hyundai - 06/21/19 10:43 PM

We were getting used engine cradles from the wreckers for like 600 our cost, 800 or something customer plus labor. So over a $1000 all in, but sometimes people just wanted their car fixed and went for it.
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