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Re: Is BITOG syndrome relevant to short term owners? [Re: JoelB] #5354304 02/19/20 10:19 AM
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When I get a vehicle there’s a good chance I’m keeping it 5 years to 8 years but seldom 10 years. However I might sell or gift it to friends or family. They all get at or above OM’s maintenance.
I also figure the next owner (if a stranger) could be someone with less money who does not need a repair job caused by neglect. I do what keeps my mind clear = many of us are here for that feeling.

Re: Is BITOG syndrome relevant to short term owners? [Re: Astro14] #5354336 02/19/20 10:45 AM
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Originally Posted by Astro14
One of my best friends simply doesn't care about oil or maintenance.

He finds the very existence of this site/board bizarre.

He leases a new car through his company. Trades it in every three years. Car, insurance, even gas, are paid through his business.

He hasn't worried about an oil change, or tires, or any of the things that we discuss for a long time. He brings it in for service when required, but doesn't really care what they do to it, because he's driving a loaner that day. Never worries about maintenance details, or longevity.

He picks a car he likes. Negotiates the deal. Enjoys it for a few years.

Then gets a new one.

I (business owner) would never let one of my employee's negotiate the purchase-price of a vehicle I'm going to pay for.


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Re: Is BITOG syndrome relevant to short term owners? [Re: Triplicate] #5354338 02/19/20 10:47 AM
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Originally Posted by Triplicate
Originally Posted by BMWTurboDzl
Originally Posted by JoelB
I was thinking about this yesterday. Most topics discussed regularly here (Carbon build up, sludge, fuel dilution, wear metals) really only matter over a long period of time.

For example I like commuter cars for whatever reason. My habit is to buy one new and drive it a few years then trade it in on another one. If i never keep a car over 5 years, are any of these topics even relevant? Even with sub-par maintenance any new vehicle should make it 5 years I would think.


You would be correct however the "trade in" value or "time to sell" and resale value might be impacted by the lack of maintenance.


Documentation of maintenance is more important during resale than maintenance.

Hypothetically speaking, a car could be impeccably maintained by its owner but see no benefit at resale if there are no receipts. Conversely, the car could have every oil change and tire rotation badly done by HS age kids at a quickie lube but have a stack of papers attesting to the "care" given to the vehicle.

The vast majority of car buyers haven't a clue about how their vehicle works. They care about price, age, mileage, and physical condition first, and if the car drives normally of course. Most consumers would rather have a warranty than a well maintained car, which is baffling to me. It's like not caring if your food was made by people with clean hands because you have a big stockpile of Pepto Bismol at home.


There are no benefits even if there are receipts. There have been numerous stories on here and elsewhere where a folder of receipts (maintenance history) went right in to the trash can at the dealer-at trade in time.

Re: Is BITOG syndrome relevant to short term owners? [Re: Triple_Se7en] #5354343 02/19/20 10:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Triple_Se7en
Originally Posted by Astro14
He leases a new car through his company....

I (business owner) would never let one of my employee's negotiate the purchase-price of a vehicle I'm going to pay for.

Well, legally, most employees of a company simply can't buy or lease a car on behalf of the company so it's almost a moot point. That said, in the scenario Astro14 refers to, that person owns (or operates) the company.

Re: Is BITOG syndrome relevant to short term owners? [Re: JoelB] #5354356 02/19/20 11:03 AM
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Well, I guess that depends on the phrase used. In the manner Astro said it, it can be dissected either way.
I've heard some use that same phrase (words assertation) to describe where the friend might work, not necessarily own.
Maybe Astro will read this and clarify.

Ex: My business is the beer business. But I surely don't own any brewery or distributorship.

Last edited by Triple_Se7en; 02/19/20 11:13 AM.

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Re: Is BITOG syndrome relevant to short term owners? [Re: hallstevenson] #5354366 02/19/20 11:13 AM
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Originally Posted by hallstevenson
Originally Posted by BMWTurboDzl
You would be correct however the "trade in" value or "time to sell" and resale value might be impacted by the lack of maintenance.

I'm afraid you are giving that too much weight. How many times have you or anyone seen this actually apply ? If the car is washed, interior vacuumed, has usable tires, etc, 90% of buyers are impressed. Only a tiny, tiny percentage of shoppers pull the dipstick, ask for service records, and so on. Someone that hasn't had the ATF serviced isn't going to get a lower price for a trade-in vs someone that changes it every 25k miles.

People here post about selling their immaculately maintained vehicles and trying to hand the buyer their notebook or folder full of service records, receipts, etc and are told they can keep it, the buyer doesn't want it.



I said "might" and I mentioned "time to sell". For example, which used car with 50k miles on the odometer and priced the same will get more looks and/or sell faster? The one which had the ATF serviced and has all maintenance records or the one which is advertised with none of those? In addition there's more to maintenance than just mechanical. It's also cosmetic and general wear-n-tear on interior/paint. It entirely depends on the vehicle one is selling. Is it a run of the mill F150, Camry, Corolla or is it a Audi, Mercedes, Lexus?


Last edited by BMWTurboDzl; 02/19/20 11:15 AM.

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Re: Is BITOG syndrome relevant to short term owners? [Re: BMWTurboDzl] #5354388 02/19/20 11:23 AM
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Originally Posted by BMWTurboDzl
I said "might" and I mentioned "time to sell". For example, which used car with 50k miles on the odometer and priced the same will get more looks and/or sell faster? The one which had the ATF serviced and has all maintenance records or the one which is advertised with none of those?

Yes, I'll acknowledge you said "might" but I believe very strongly that it's a really, really big "might" ! grin In your scenario, if we stick to under the hood maintenance, there will be no difference in getting looks and/or selling faster. Not in the real world. On paper, sure. I also pointed out just making the car look nice (visually, outside appearance) will sadly have as much if not more impact than anything else to the average buyer.

Wait, are you talking about selling a car (or trading it in) locally or via BITOG's classified section, targeting members here ?? grin2 LOL grin2 LOL

Re: Is BITOG syndrome relevant to short term owners? [Re: JoelB] #5354398 02/19/20 11:45 AM
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well, I'll give you a real world example: I just sold my Alltrack, which was about 2 1/2 years old, and had 26K miles on it. It had a few modifications on it, but nothing crazy. I sold it for 2K less than the purchase price, and about 3K less than you could get a new one.

A big part of the reason I was able to get that sort of price for it was the obsessive maintenance I did on it. Obviously, it took finding the right buyer, but the car really was better than new--and I was able to command a top price for it. Without the service history that it had, I wouldn't have gotten that price.

This has been the case with higher-mileage cars I've sold as well. And note: this is all with service that I've done myself. I keep records and receipts, and that's always been enough.

If you're leasing or trading in, it will not make a difference to you. That said, at a minimum I would still follow the OEM recommendations, since it's just the right thing to do. Someone else is going to own the car after you.

Re: Is BITOG syndrome relevant to short term owners? [Re: JoelB] #5354412 02/19/20 11:55 AM
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It may not make a difference to someone else; I cannot speak to that.
It makes a difference to me.

Last edited by JeffKeryk; 02/19/20 11:56 AM.

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Re: Is BITOG syndrome relevant to short term owners? [Re: JoelB] #5354513 02/19/20 02:12 PM
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OP, I believe you made a good argument. If only keeping the vehicle for 3 or 4 years, basic scheduled maintenance should suffice. I don't see this as neglect. I've yet to meet someone outside the auto industry that knows what IVD, CAFE, HT/HS or E10 even mean.


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Re: Is BITOG syndrome relevant to short term owners? [Re: JeffKeryk] #5354610 02/19/20 03:55 PM
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Originally Posted by JeffKeryk
I just believe in taking care of my stuff. I make my bed every day.
It's about basic respect. Respect for stuff. Respect for myself.
If I use a car for 3 years, it is gonna go to someone else afterwards.

My kind of guy JeffK. If I own it, it gets regular maintenance. From clocks to vacuums to toilets.

Re: Is BITOG syndrome relevant to short term owners? [Re: Yah-Tah-Hey] #5354705 02/19/20 05:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Yah-Tah-Hey
Originally Posted by JeffKeryk
I just believe in taking care of my stuff. I make my bed every day.
It's about basic respect. Respect for stuff. Respect for myself.
If I use a car for 3 years, it is gonna go to someone else afterwards.

My kind of guy JeffK. If I own it, it gets regular maintenance. From clocks to vacuums to toilets.


I "Maintained" my toilet earlier today

Re: Is BITOG syndrome relevant to short term owners? [Re: Astro14] #5354730 02/19/20 06:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Astro14
One of my best friends simply doesn't care about oil or maintenance.

He finds the very existence of this site/board bizarre.

He leases a new car through his company. Trades it in every three years. Car, insurance, even gas, are paid through his business.

He hasn't worried about an oil change, or tires, or any of the things that we discuss for a long time. He brings it in for service when required, but doesn't really care what they do to it, because he's driving a loaner that day. Never worries about maintenance details, or longevity.

He picks a car he likes. Negotiates the deal. Enjoys it for a few years.

Then gets a new one.

he is not a car guy thats all most of the people aren't.i rent a car on vacation and go to a car wash even tho it's not my car,if u love cars u love cars it's simple but soo complecated.somtimes I truly envy those people.

Last edited by avi1777; 02/19/20 06:09 PM.
Re: Is BITOG syndrome relevant to short term owners? [Re: JOD] #5354926 02/19/20 10:01 PM
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Originally Posted by JOD
well, I'll give you a real world example: I just sold my Alltrack, which was about 2 1/2 years old, and had 26K miles on it. It had a few modifications on it, but nothing crazy. I sold it for 2K less than the purchase price, and about 3K less than you could get a new one.

A big part of the reason I was able to get that sort of price for it was the obsessive maintenance I did on it. Obviously, it took finding the right buyer, but the car really was better than new--and I was able to command a top price for it. Without the service history that it had, I wouldn't have gotten that price.

This has been the case with higher-mileage cars I've sold as well. And note: this is all with service that I've done myself. I keep records and receipts, and that's always been enough.

If you're leasing or trading in, it will not make a difference to you. That said, at a minimum I would still follow the OEM recommendations, since it's just the right thing to do. Someone else is going to own the car after you.


Your example is a very rare exception. Plus-the buyer "pool" for a car like yours is pretty small too.

Last edited by CKN; 02/19/20 10:02 PM.
Re: Is BITOG syndrome relevant to short term owners? [Re: JoelB] #5357675 02/22/20 10:37 PM
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I feel better and have more confidence in our cars when I know they are maintained right. Little high strung turbo engines don't take much neglect to cook a turbo. My hatch is tuned as well and making considerable more power than stock, so its not even really an option.

Plus I like knowing they are doing the best they can be while we are operating them. I like the feeling of being out on the road with a perfectly maintained car, I feel good about myself.

Last edited by PolarisX; 02/22/20 10:38 PM.

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