HPL recommendation for IS250 2.5L V6

Joined
Jul 29, 2005
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Location
Indiana
You might be familiar with the infamously carbonaceous 4GR-FSE featuring the GDI-only injection system.

I purchased my IS250 in 2014 with 107K on it and to my shock, learned of the GDI issues later (yes, shame on me for not doing better due diligence).

However, a top end inspection (through the lower intake by yours truly) showed only minor/normal varnishing and nothing at all like the horrific sludge farms you'll see on some of these engine and in the service bulletin that led to in some cases entirely new long blocks under warranty. This is the rare 4GR that seems to be OK on carboning up the top end.

It's been nine years, I'm at 176k now and still haven't incurred any notable carboning issues that I can tell. (I haven't been in side the top end however since I bought it). Oil consumption is too low for me to notice, which likely explains the cleaner-than-normal top end. I do notice periodically a throttle hesitation that Seafoaming the intake seems to resolve temporarily.

Since I took possession, I'd been given a diet of mostly PUP or PP in 5w30 or 10w-30 and OEM filters.

I just performed a 176k OC with PP 5w-30 and one quart of HPL cleaner and switched to the M1 EP filter.


I'd be interested in switching entirely to an HPL lube oil to help clean the engine and perhaps maintain such but I'm unsure which to use. Also, since the carboning up of these engines has a LOT to do with oil selection (and blowby) I'd like to stick with an oil that keeps the ring pack as clean as possible.

I'm not obsessed with pushing the OCI as far as possible, and cost isn't a huge consideration I'm willing to pay for a premium oil that keeps this car in top condition so that it will rust out long before it wears out.

In my location, winter temperatures rarely drop into single digits Fahrenheit, with typical winter overnight lows in the teens or 20s-- we don't get severe winters by my standard (calibrated by a childhood in North Dakota and Wisconsin).

Conversely, we don't get summer temperatures over 40C/104F very commonly either.

The car is generally *not* garaged, and the main duty cycle is a cold-start before a 35 minute commute in the morning followed by that same event in the evening returning home. If the engine is warm from my return commute, I'll often run errands in it that are small city mixed driving. Hwy vs City mileage split is about 80/20 but by time it's probably closer to 60/40 still favoring hwy. The car gets about 27mpg in this mixed use, with 25 in the city and 32 on the hwy. I generally buy fuel at Sam's club and do not use premium (I never have any knocking or evidence of octane insufficiency).
 
Also, I should point out that this engine has sometimes exhibited the cam-phaser rattle these engines are known for. But's a rare and sporadic occurrence that hasn't happened in quite a long time.
 
Given that you don't intend to greatly extend the OCIs, then I'd recommend the HPL PCEO; their basic engine oil. You won't need the extended capabilities of the PPCEO or PPPCEO, nor would you need their non-VII oils. The main thing it sounds like you're after is good cleaning abilities, and their normal oil is a blend of extremely pure group III base stock, combined with esters and ANs.

Make sure you change the filter often (every 2500 miles or so) for the first couple of changes because it's likely going to load up quickly. You don't have to change the oil every 2500 miles, but just the filter. Cut the filters open and look for carbonaceous bits in the media pleats. Once that diminishes, you can then change the filter with the OCIs.

Once you get through the "break in" period using HPL, you could then go to 10k mile OCIs, along with the filter, with little worry.
 
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Depends on what you want to spend. Their base 5w30 would be fine. If you wanted to spend more and get the no VII 5w30 it would likely last a bit longer. The premium plus 0w30 might give a little better winter performance, even at your milder temps, and also last longer.
 
Given that you don't intend to greatly extend the OCIs, then I'd recommend the HPL PCEO; their basic engine oil. You won't need the extended capabilities of the PPCEO or PPPCEO, nor would you need their non-VII oils. The main thing it sounds like you're after is good cleaning abilities, and their normal oil is a blend of extremely pure group III base stock, combined with esters and ANs.

Make sure you change the filter often (every 2500 miles or so) for the first couple of changes because it's likely going to load up quickly. You don't have to change the oil every 2500 miles, but just the filter. Cut the filters open and look for carbonaceous bits in the media pleats. Once that diminishes, you can then change the filter with the OCIs.

Once you get through the "break in" period using HPL, you could then go to 10k mile OCIs, along with the filter, with little worry.
Thank you for this useful reply. Your logic seems impeccable to me. I'd be willing to extended OCIs once the cleaning has stabilized, perhaps 15k or more and perhaps then would be the time to switch to HDEA or non-VII oils.
 
I, like I assume a few others, was convinced for a while that as you moved up the price tier for HPL only then would I have a sufficient product, but this turns out to be the opposite. Their “plain Jane” PCO 5W30 is wayyyyyyyy more than sufficient for me….and probably you as well.

Don’t forget….”BITOG15” for 15% off!
 
I, like I assume a few others, was convinced for a while that as you moved up the price tier for HPL only then would I have a sufficient product, but this turns out to be the opposite. Their “plain Jane” PCO 5W30 is wayyyyyyyy more than sufficient for me….and probably you as well.

Don’t forget….”BITOG15” for 15% off!
Thank you!
 
Since I took possession, I'd been given a diet of mostly PUP or PP in 5w30 or 10w-30 and OEM filters.
PUP is touted by Pennzoil to be an oil that cleans. Maybe not cleaning up to HPL standards but that could be one of the reasons your engine is still clean at this point in time. You could probably just continue with the PUP regimen and save some dough.
 
PUP is touted by Pennzoil to be an oil that cleans. Maybe not cleaning up to HPL standards but that could be one of the reasons your engine is still clean at this point in time. You could probably just continue with the PUP regimen and save some dough.
No, it is advertised as keeping things clean, not cleaning up a mess that's already there.
 
Thank you for this useful reply. Your logic seems impeccable to me. I'd be willing to extended OCIs once the cleaning has stabilized, perhaps 15k or more and perhaps then would be the time to switch to HDEA or non-VII oils.
You and I both are in IN. I've run the HPL PCEO here year round and never had an issue with cold starts. You won't need the non-VII lube, is my point. If you lived in AK or the UP of MI, etc, it might be an issue. But the "normal" HPL lubes do just fine here; it doesn't get cold enough to warrant paying extra for the upmarket products.

Also, I know that the standard lube (PCEO) has been successfully run in some fleet ops up to 20k miles and still provided the desired wear control and cleaning. So even if you intend to pursue extended OCIs, don't automatically assume you're going to "need" their upper end products yet.

Given your initial goals, and the potential of slightly longer OCIs in the future, I still recommend the PCEO. Try it first; test it along the way with some UOAs. At some point, you may get to a point where the upper HPL products make sense, but until you know how well the base product works, you'll never know if you "need" anything more or not. Rather than mentally leap to the "need" for a "better" fluid, why not let data and logic dictate your moves?
 
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