Recent Topics
2012-2014 Lexus GS350 AWD Reliability?
by GZRider - 10/17/19 10:28 PM
Switch to High Mileage Oil or No?
by Blake1107 - 10/17/19 10:21 PM
Found this funny
by taztheman - 10/17/19 10:04 PM
How much gas to start a 3L or larger engine?
by paulri - 10/17/19 09:54 PM
Syneresis, learned a new word today!
by Cujet - 10/17/19 09:28 PM
What is more important in an oil?
by Rglossip - 10/17/19 08:03 PM
Chevy 2.4 Oil Burner Oil/Filter Change?
by GaryPoe - 10/17/19 07:57 PM
2016 F150 2.7 UOA 4k
by tomcruise - 10/17/19 07:13 PM
Mobil1 5W-30, 8,200mi, 2017 Expl 2.3EBBB
by Whimsey - 10/17/19 07:01 PM
How To Avoid Deer?
by Passport1 - 10/17/19 06:41 PM
Mazda6 P0401 code
by miden851 - 10/17/19 06:15 PM
2004 Crown Vic shock/ struts recommendation
by umungus1122 - 10/17/19 06:12 PM
Undercarriage pics of my 2003 E46 330Ci ZSP
by SLO_Town - 10/17/19 06:11 PM
Porter Cable air compressor not shutting off
by JLawrence08648 - 10/17/19 06:06 PM
OCI older car, modern oil
by VQLT - 10/17/19 05:24 PM
ZAINO Products
by BlueOvalFitter - 10/17/19 05:17 PM
BMW N63 engines... Valve seals
by Ndx - 10/17/19 04:53 PM
Newest Members
jmichels, Collins92, Paul_Millner, kelsdawnj, Emtp1990
69591 Registered Users
Who's Online Now
87 registered members (alchargo, askani79705, 2015_PSD, 92saturnsl2, 4WD, 9 invisible), 1,586 guests, and 20 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Statistics
Forums67
Topics296,121
Posts5,091,489
Members69,591
Most Online3,532
Jul 30th, 2019
Donate to BITOG
Print Thread
Hop To
Page 1 of 8 1 2 8
Why hasn't someone made a more efficient filter? #5106820 05/16/19 11:36 AM
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 21,889
P
Patman Offline OP
Global Moderator
OP Offline
Global Moderator
P
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 21,889
I'm curious as to why no manufacturers out there have made an oil filter than is even more efficient than what we currently have, let's just say something that's 99% efficient down to 10 or 15 microns instead of the current best which seems to be around 99% at 20 microns. Surely the technology must exist.


2018 Corvette, 17k, M1 ESP Formula 5w30 & NAPA Gold
2006 Civic EX Coupe, 152k, PUP 5w20 & Fram Ultra
2010 BMW 328i X-Drive,121k, GC 0w40 & Fram Ultra

Re: Why hasn't someone made a more efficient filter? [Re: Patman] #5106823 05/16/19 11:40 AM
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 38,124
Q
Quattro Pete Offline
Offline
Q
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 38,124
Is more filtration really needed? Do engines fail because existing filters don't filter enough? Will more efficient filters restrict flow too much?



2002 530i   2015 Q5 3.0T   2018 Charger SRT
Re: Why hasn't someone made a more efficient filter? [Re: Patman] #5106824 05/16/19 11:40 AM
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 4,145
D
dwendt44 Offline
Offline
D
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 4,145
The cost would be through the roof. Plus the larger media would require a larger
'can' to meet oil flow requirements. Many engines don't have room for a giant filter can.


My 2¢


There's no such thing as:
Too big of a battery,
Too large of a gas tank,
or too loud of a horn,
or too bright headlights.
Re: Why hasn't someone made a more efficient filter? [Re: Patman] #5106825 05/16/19 11:42 AM
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 14,145
C
CT8 Offline
Offline
C
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 14,145
What is the need ?


2015 F150 2.7
2018 F350 6.2
Re: Why hasn't someone made a more efficient filter? [Re: Patman] #5106827 05/16/19 11:43 AM
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 2,567
H
hallstevenson Online Content
Online Content
H
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 2,567
Because it's truly not necessary ? What's the difference between 10 microns and 20 microns ? And I'm only asking these two questions: 1) At what level will the filter trap additives ? 2) Will flow be (too) restricted ?

Cost will be a factor too. It might cost substantially more while there's no need for it.

Re: Why hasn't someone made a more efficient filter? [Re: CT8] #5106845 05/16/19 12:03 PM
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 5,209
JohnnyJohnson Online Content
Online Content
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 5,209
Originally Posted by CT8
What is the need ?



Maybe this.

Miles to first overhaul.jpg

2004 Corolla 136181
Out: EDGE EP 5W-30 Bosch 3311 7156 Miles
In: Havoline Pro DS 10w-30 Purolator PureOne 3-14-19 129693
2006 Duramax 76552
Out: T6 5W-40 M1-303
In: T6 5W-40 XG9100 73705 4-22-18
Re: Why hasn't someone made a more efficient filter? [Re: Patman] #5106847 05/16/19 12:05 PM
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 322
B
brages Online Content
Online Content
B
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 322
The "toilet paper" bypass filters claim to remove extremely small particles at a low flow rate... https://www.frantzfilters.com/

Re: Why hasn't someone made a more efficient filter? [Re: Patman] #5106851 05/16/19 12:08 PM
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 20,457
MolaKule Offline
Global Moderator
Offline
Global Moderator
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 20,457
I thought that was what By-pass filters were made for.

There is a trade-off between particle filtering capabilities and cost. smile


"You ... sadist," said Mr Cummings, "you try to make people think." Ezra Pound (1885-1972)
Re: Why hasn't someone made a more efficient filter? [Re: CT8] #5106852 05/16/19 12:08 PM
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 21,889
P
Patman Offline OP
Global Moderator
OP Offline
Global Moderator
P
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 21,889
Originally Posted by Quattro Pete
Will more efficient filters restrict flow too much?

Considering how well the Fram Ultra flows in it's current form, couldn't they just tweak that media a little bit in order to filter even better, while not compromising flow by much?

Originally Posted by CT8
What is the need ?

I'm mainly just curious as to why they don't exist, from a technical standpoint. But I'm also wondering why someone wouldn't do this and market the heck out of it in order to grab a bigger slice of the DYI oil change market. Performance enthusiasts would snap them up, even though most of them probably won't see the long term benefits of finer filtration.

I've always believed that the more efficient the better, even if it's overkill for most people since they trade their cars in long before the engine wears out.

Re: Why hasn't someone made a more efficient filter? [Re: MolaKule] #5106853 05/16/19 12:10 PM
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 21,889
P
Patman Offline OP
Global Moderator
OP Offline
Global Moderator
P
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 21,889
Originally Posted by MolaKule
I thought that was what By-pass filters were made for.

There is a trade-off between particle filtering capabilities and cost. smile


True, but even if they charged $15 or $20 (as opposed to the $10 for the Ultra) they could still be popular.

As far as bypass filtration goes, I think the complexity of it scares a lot of people away. Having a simple spin on filter that is super efficient would be more user friendly.

Re: Why hasn't someone made a more efficient filter? [Re: dwendt44] #5106859 05/16/19 12:17 PM
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 4,064
B
BMWTurboDzl Offline
Offline
B
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 4,064
Originally Posted by dwendt44
The cost would be through the roof. Plus the larger media would require a larger
'can' to meet oil flow requirements. Many engines don't have room for a giant filter can.

My 2¢

This. There's simply no room and it's not needed. Insufficient filtration is no longer a failure point.


“It took untold generations to get you where you are. A little gratitude might be in order. If you’re going to insist on bending the world to your way, you better have your reasons.”

435i
Re: Why hasn't someone made a more efficient filter? [Re: BMWTurboDzl] #5106878 05/16/19 12:52 PM
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 21,889
P
Patman Offline OP
Global Moderator
OP Offline
Global Moderator
P
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 21,889
Originally Posted by BMWTurboDzl
This. There's simply no room and it's not needed. Insufficient filtration is no longer a failure point.

But maybe we need to think of it in terms of not the failure point, but keeping the engine running perfectly for the entire time you own the car. If finer filtration means the engine stays "as good as new" for a longer period, isn't that worth it? In other words, maybe that engine with 100k on it now doesn't burn any oil, instead of using a quart every 5k if it was slightly worn. Maybe it's making 98% of it's original horsepower instead of being down to 90%. Maybe it still gets the same MPG as new, instead of it dropping by a few %.

Re: Why hasn't someone made a more efficient filter? [Re: Patman] #5106884 05/16/19 12:57 PM
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 5,555
V
Virtus_Probi Offline
Offline
V
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 5,555
Wasn't this the idea behind the Microgreen filters?
Integrated bypass to filter out the tiny particles while maintaining full flow in one modestly sized package?
I guess the question is if they actually did what they said...I know there was some controversy about the end product possibly being a total [censored] of the original intent and the idea man behind it supposedly being forced out of the company.


2014 Forester XT, 105000 miles
Last Change;
PP 5w30 d1G2
Tokyo Roki 15208AA170 filter
Re: Why hasn't someone made a more efficient filter? [Re: Virtus_Probi] #5106910 05/16/19 01:22 PM
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 10,433
4WD Online Confused
Online Confused
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 10,433
Whatever happened to those … any users still here ?

Re: Why hasn't someone made a more efficient filter? [Re: Patman] #5106927 05/16/19 01:44 PM
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 15,407
P
PandaBear Offline
Offline
P
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 15,407
1st: oil filter is not the limiting factor of vehicle life, the current cheap oil filter is good enough before other things kill the car (rust, transmission, head gasket, turbo, accident, exterior, fashion, etc)

2nd: we already have toilet paper bypass filter, most people decided it is not worth the trouble and cost.

3rd: you still need to change the oil and add additives, so why bother. You also have to add oil to deal with burning, etc.

The OEM can make the filter 2x or 3x as big, but they still get changed when it is not filled up, so they shrink it to make it cheaper to make, cheaper to ship, cheaper to stock, and cheaper to dispose.

Last edited by PandaBear; 05/16/19 01:46 PM.

"You keep asking questions PandaBear and you'll end up a vegetarian like my wife" - Camu Mahubah
Page 1 of 8 1 2 8
Previous Thread
Index
Next Thread

BOB IS THE OIL GUY® Powered by UBB.threads™