Coal powered Tesla

[Shannow]

Originally Posted by Nick1994
Originally Posted by Nick1994
Does the power plant pollute more when you plug in an electric car to charge?

Shannow, I'm genuinely curious.


Not sure on the question...but will use the Pelican Point example from above.

Pelican Point has a heat rate of 7.2MJ/KWh (it uses 7.2MJ per KWh that it generates.

A Hyundai Kona uses 13.6KWh to drive 100km...throw in 10% transmission and 10% charging losses - 16.5 KWh, or 118MJ of Natural gas to move the car 100KM. - $5.50 to drive 100km.

My wife's diesel Captiva uses 8.2L of diesel to move the car the same distance...35.86MJ/L, it uses 294MJ of fossil fuels. - $11.20 fuel costs per 100km.

However, when South Oz is using their OCGTs running diesel, not natural gas, heat rate is 11...180MJ of expensive diesel to do the same.

 

[4WD]

Seems certain leaders can cop such a bad attitude towards natural gas that they are happy to export too much of it.
Happy with the concept at least …

 

[Shannow]

Originally Posted by 4WD
Seems certain leaders can cop such a bad attitude towards natural gas that they are happy to export too much of it.
Happy with the concept at least …


AGL is looking at building an import terminal, down South, near where the gas fields used to be....so we'll be exporting it full tilt, and importing it to control local prices.

 

[Nick1994]

Originally Posted by Shannow
Originally Posted by Nick1994
Originally Posted by Nick1994
Does the power plant pollute more when you plug in an electric car to charge?

Shannow, I'm genuinely curious.


Not sure on the question...but will use the Pelican Point example from above.

Pelican Point has a heat rate of 7.2MJ/KWh (it uses 7.2MJ per KWh that it generates.

A Hyundai Kona uses 13.6KWh to drive 100km...throw in 10% transmission and 10% charging losses - 16.5 KWh, or 118MJ of Natural gas to move the car 100KM. - $5.50 to drive 100km.

My wife's diesel Captiva uses 8.2L of diesel to move the car the same distance...35.86MJ/L, it uses 294MJ of fossil fuels. - $11.20 fuel costs per 100km.

However, when South Oz is using their OCGTs running diesel, not natural gas, heat rate is 11...180MJ of expensive diesel to do the same.

What I meant was, in the terms of power plants polluting, and the energy they produce is used to charge electric cars, therefore electric cars share some of that pollution.

But since the power plants are already running, and polluting X amount, when you charge an electric car and it demands X amount of energy, is the power plant polluting any more than it would if you weren't charging an electric car?

 

[Cujet]

https://www.greencarcongress.com/2019/04/20190420-cesifo.html

Quote:

"According to a new study published by the ifo Institue Center for Economic Studies (CESifo) in Germany, EVs will barely help cut CO2 emissions in the country over the coming years, as the introduction of electric vehicles does not necessarily lead to a reduction in CO2 emissions from road traffic given the current power generation mix. The researchers carried out their calculations based on a Mercedes-Benz C 220 d diesel and the new Tesla Model 3"

 

[Shannow]

Originally Posted by Nick1994
What I meant was, in the terms of power plants polluting, and the energy they produce is used to charge electric cars, therefore electric cars share some of that pollution.

But since the power plants are already running, and polluting X amount, when you charge an electric car and it demands X amount of energy, is the power plant polluting any more than it would if you weren't charging an electric car?


OK, Gotchya...that one's easy...if the plant is running, then any incremental load will be more efficient for every MW that it's producing.

It will be producing more total pollutants, but it will be doing less of them per MWh....here's the efficiency curve of a Gas Turbine....steam turbines are similar, but not as drastic. Going from baseload to low load cycling carries about a 10% fuel consumption burden on a coal unit.