If a load test gives fail results could this explain no crank even though voltage looks good?
2007 Saturn Ion 2.2 manual won't turn over
- Thread starter schuylkill
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If the battery voltage stays that high while trying to crank, I would suspect the starter or starter solenoid. Try banging on the starter while someone is trying to start the car. I had an old Volvo 850 with a weak starter that you had to bang on sometimes to get it to crank, when it finally gave out the starter made a sizzling noise.
Last night voltage at the positive fuse block post (post for jump starting under the hood since battery is in the trunk) was down to 12.2v after being fully charged on Saturday. Not good. Then I went under the car to the starter solenoid to check voltage to small connection as my son turned the ignition key. I think there may have been a short then that blew out a wire on my gauge though I didn't fully process it at the time but I did hear a possible spark like sound. So there was no voltage reading on the gauge. Then I went to check the large center post which is energized when the ignition is turned and nothing, the wire then fell loose and I just thought my old gauge was showing its age. Got new meter wires today and just went under the car to check the hot wire coming off of the battery and with the power on, nothing. So I checked voltage at the post on the box and nothing. 12.2 volts at the battery. So is there a fuse for the cables running from the battery to the fuse block post and then down to the starter? What a mess. The starter and solenoid are really rusted out. The cables that meet under the post on the fuse block are a little dirty where they sit under the post with eye connections but don't look bad. The cables on the battery are nice and clean. So I suspect something with the starter/solenoid/wiring caused a short when I made the initial connection with my meter. Possible? And how do I get power back to the post on the fuse block? Seems like its just a cable from the battery in the trunk to the post on the fuse box under the hood. Fused?
Check/clean your terminals at the battery. Then find the main ground off the neg cable and clean that as well. I had a later 90's Cavy with the 2.4 which had piles of ground cable corrosion. Battery was testing good, had power to the interior but unable to turn the engine over. An old mechanic friend put me on the trail of the ground as he experienced this with many GM vehicles.
does the lock/theft icon light up when cranking?
I had an ion, it ended up being the key cylinder. Easy swap, and common on these things and cobalts.
I had an ion, it ended up being the key cylinder. Easy swap, and common on these things and cobalts.
Does anything electric on the car power up?
There won't be any fuses in the main cables between the battery, starter, and jump-starting post. Check by measuring for a voltage difference between parts that are supposed to be connected. Do this under load, such as having the key on. Remember that the ground side of the circuit is just as important.
There won't be any fuses in the main cables between the battery, starter, and jump-starting post. Check by measuring for a voltage difference between parts that are supposed to be connected. Do this under load, such as having the key on. Remember that the ground side of the circuit is just as important.
I don't believe there was ever voltage at the post on the fuse block until the key is in the first position. If that's true I'm hoping that maybe an ignition fuse is blown, or a fuse that is involved in getting voltage to the post.
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I don't believe there was ever voltage at the post on the fuse block until the key is in the first position
That can't be true, then you couldn't charge the battery from under the hood without key on and I did that.
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Check/clean your terminals at the battery. Then find the main ground off the neg cable and clean that as well. I had a later 90's Cavy with the 2.4 which had piles of ground cable corrosion. Battery was testing good, had power to the interior but unable to turn the engine over. An old mechanic friend put me on the trail of the ground as he experienced this with many GM vehicles.
I'll do this but not confident that it's the latest problem. Something changed from one day having power at the post, me taking readings at the starter solenoid with multi-meter and the next day no power at post. When I was under the car with the meter and my son turned the key, there was a noise that did't seem to come from the starter but behind the starter. Where is the ECU on these things?
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There won't be any fuses in the main cables between the battery, starter, and jump-starting post.
If this is true either the ground at the battery is bad or there is a short or break in the battery cable from the battery to the post on the fuse box.
I don't believe there was ever voltage at the post on the fuse block until the key is in the first position
That can't be true, then you couldn't charge the battery from under the hood without key on and I did that.
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Check/clean your terminals at the battery. Then find the main ground off the neg cable and clean that as well. I had a later 90's Cavy with the 2.4 which had piles of ground cable corrosion. Battery was testing good, had power to the interior but unable to turn the engine over. An old mechanic friend put me on the trail of the ground as he experienced this with many GM vehicles.
I'll do this but not confident that it's the latest problem. Something changed from one day having power at the post, me taking readings at the starter solenoid with multi-meter and the next day no power at post. When I was under the car with the meter and my son turned the key, there was a noise that did't seem to come from the starter but behind the starter. Where is the ECU on these things?
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There won't be any fuses in the main cables between the battery, starter, and jump-starting post.
If this is true either the ground at the battery is bad or there is a short or break in the battery cable from the battery to the post on the fuse box.
Does anyone know a place to purchase lugs for electrical connections that may have a lug for 10 gauge wire that has a hole that will fit on a 5/16" stud?
I'm working on cleaning the cable to stud connections on the ground wire from the tranny to the frame. At the transmission there are 2 10 gauge wires from the harness that also connect to the stud. That connection is on the tranny just below where oil has been leaking and it was a real dirty mess. I cleaned it up and decided to remove the lugs and clean them up. The stud broke free and I had to cut the lugs on the 2 10 gauge wires to be able to spin out the stud.
I'm working on cleaning the cable to stud connections on the ground wire from the tranny to the frame. At the transmission there are 2 10 gauge wires from the harness that also connect to the stud. That connection is on the tranny just below where oil has been leaking and it was a real dirty mess. I cleaned it up and decided to remove the lugs and clean them up. The stud broke free and I had to cut the lugs on the 2 10 gauge wires to be able to spin out the stud.
Originally Posted by schuylkill
If this is true either the ground at the battery is bad or there is a short or break in the battery cable from the battery to the post on the fuse box.
Those are very likely scenarios. Check the big wires before you start messing with the small ones.
If this is true either the ground at the battery is bad or there is a short or break in the battery cable from the battery to the post on the fuse box.
Those are very likely scenarios. Check the big wires before you start messing with the small ones.
I removed the battery and disconnected the big cable from the battery to the post at the post also. It checked good for continuity. Now I'm working on the heavy ground cable from tranny to frame and have this situation, the smaller 10 gauge wires are connected with the ground wire on the tranny. So I'm suspecting and hoping that the tranny wasn't properly grounded and that is why I didn't find voltage at the positive post when I tested between it and the tranny.
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The ground points have been cleaned up. The connections on the starter were so rusted that the studs broke so I installed new starter and solenoid. Now when the key is turned there is a clunk sound at the starter but engine still doesn't turn over. Besides the battery what other possible causes? If the starter is attempting to do its job what other components might prevent the engine to crank? I think I'm going to take the battery into Advance Auto for testing and see what they say. It's still at 12.7 volts at the engine.
Try turning the engine by hand (with a socket wrench on the crank bolt) to be sure it is not seized.
Then again measure voltage at the battery, while the key is turned trying to start. Then measure at the starter with the key turned.
Measuring when the key is not turned and there is no load doesn't tell much.
Then again measure voltage at the battery, while the key is turned trying to start. Then measure at the starter with the key turned.
Measuring when the key is not turned and there is no load doesn't tell much.
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I can crank the crank with a wrench, then it started to rain.
It was the starter. When I installed it I didn't connect the power cable but another harness cable that was just hanging apparently unused behind the radiator. I didn't look closely at the harness bundle it is part of to see if I can guess why it's just hanging there. I am embarrassed but I understand how I grabbed the wrong cable end, there wasn't enough room under the car to extend my arms above me to make the connections so I had to slide further back under the car and reach forward and work by feel without seeing what I was actually doing. I was exhausted. Hopefully I didn't fry anything turning the key with the power cable not connected to the starter. Not sure what sort of contact it was or wasn't making. Anyway with power to the new starter it fired right up. Glad I didn't buy a battery, I don't think it is needed yet.
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If you had the main 12v power wire banging around loose under there it won't matter if you had the key on or not-- you're just lucky it didn't ground, as it's not fused.
Man that's right, that could have been real bummer. I'm thinking that maybe it was a grounding problem the no start and not the starter. I'm going to check the old starter. Also is it common to have a lugged harness wire just hanging in space? I'm going to electrical tape the lug for now and if something electrical doesn't work that may be related to it look further towards it.
If you had the main 12v power wire banging around loose under there it won't matter if you had the key on or not-- you're just lucky it didn't ground, as it's not fused.
Man that's right, that could have been real bummer. I'm thinking that maybe it was a grounding problem the no start and not the starter. I'm going to check the old starter. Also is it common to have a lugged harness wire just hanging in space? I'm going to electrical tape the lug for now and if something electrical doesn't work that may be related to it look further towards it.
Is it possible it was connected to the starter with the battery wire and I missed it? That makes the most sense to me, the lug would fit that stud. My son has worked in repair shops and has some experience and says he's never seen a second wire connected that way on the starter solenoid. More data for the why I am not an auto mechanic but a backyard mechanic saga.
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