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Re: Would not have bought a Toyota for the spouse if I knew this. [Re: Wolf359] #5027104 02/28/19 10:00 PM
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pezzy669 Offline
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Originally Posted by Wolf359
Originally Posted by Miller88
Originally Posted by SubieRubyRoo
Originally Posted by rooflessVW
Buying a Toyota for AWD was your first mistake


Yep, there's Subaru AWD and then there's... all the "non-AWD AWDs"


Anything with a sideways engine and AWD is a big no no for me. I like front wheel drive, but PDUs are just unreliable. Doesn't matter if it's bottom of the barrel or Haldex. It's an unreliable afterhought.

At least he AWD system on my Subaru is mechanical. Kinda sucks as I can't just replace one or two tires. At least on some of the older 4EAT ones you could disable AWD and make them front drive only.


Oh yeah, in that case, you should probably get a Mercedes. I believe most of their 4matic systems are normally rwd without the system so it's still there if you have a fault. When I had a bad steering angle sensor, it did knock out the abs and stability control along with the cruise control, but the AWD always worked. I think only one of their cheaper models is actually FWD, the rest are RWD based.



Ehhh Mercedes limp mode is not much better - you can barely get out of your own way when it kicks in. Had a faulty accelerator pedal in my E350 that would throw the car into limp mode (disabling ABS, TCS and ESP) because of implausible signals at WOT and my car would go dead in the water and barely move once it went into limp mode. Yeah my 4Matic was probably still working but when power was cut by +75% it probably wasn't necessary to even have 4Matic because there was not enough power flowing to cause any slip.


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Re: Would not have bought a Toyota for the spouse if I knew this. [Re: i6pwr] #5027190 02/28/19 11:28 PM
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Sell it. That is pants on head retarded.


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Re: Would not have bought a Toyota for the spouse if I knew this. [Re: NormanBuntz] #5027242 03/01/19 03:24 AM
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Originally Posted by NormanBuntz
So you don't live in a snow belt, and you're worried about your O2 sensor causing a fault at the SAME TIME that conditions are snowy? Probably the same probability as being struck by lightning. I thought I worried about small things. Besides you still have FWD with all season tires.



It will happen to people. Most likely is they won't know to expect it to not be working while their CEL is on. I agree with the OP, it's a dumb design. Wonder what NHTSA would say about safety features being unnecessarily disabled. No one can predict when an O2 sensor will fail.


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Re: Would not have bought a Toyota for the spouse if I knew this. [Re: i6pwr] #5027288 03/01/19 05:56 AM
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madRiver Offline
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The time it happened to me where CEL AWD/Traction shutdown I happened to be a wet day. With one wheel on manhole at stop light I did not realize how much traction control/AWD helps when 300 HP vehicle reverts to FWD no nannies. Torque steer is quite heavy and tire spins.

Re: Would not have bought a Toyota for the spouse if I knew this. [Re: i6pwr] #5028004 03/01/19 03:50 PM
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Miller88 Offline
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For me , AWD isn't a necessity. It was a standard feature of the vehicle I wanted. If I could have got a FWD or RWD Forester, I would have.


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Re: Would not have bought a Toyota for the spouse if I knew this. [Re: i6pwr] #5028215 03/01/19 07:18 PM
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methusaleh Offline
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Does this happen with all Toyotas? I am looking at a 4Runner now, specifically because of how difficult my property and area can be to navigate.

Re: Would not have bought a Toyota for the spouse if I knew this. [Re: i6pwr] #5028343 03/01/19 08:57 PM
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Unbelievable.......

Re: Would not have bought a Toyota for the spouse if I knew this. [Re: i6pwr] #5028408 03/01/19 09:45 PM
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Wolf359 Online Content
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Originally Posted by pezzy669
Ehhh Mercedes limp mode is not much better - you can barely get out of your own way when it kicks in. Had a faulty accelerator pedal in my E350 that would throw the car into limp mode (disabling ABS, TCS and ESP) because of implausible signals at WOT and my car would go dead in the water and barely move once it went into limp mode. Yeah my 4Matic was probably still working but when power was cut by +75% it probably wasn't necessary to even have 4Matic because there was not enough power flowing to cause any slip.


True, but at least limp mode had something to do with the car. A random CEL that has nothing to do with the system aside from the fact that they're all tied in isn't a good system.

Re: Would not have bought a Toyota for the spouse if I knew this. [Re: i6pwr] #5028473 03/01/19 10:51 PM
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Since you bought it used, Toyota has not made any money off of you. So selling it will not make them miss you as a contributing customer.


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Re: Would not have bought a Toyota for the spouse if I knew this. [Re: methusaleh] #5029844 03/03/19 06:42 AM
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madRiver Offline
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Originally Posted by methusaleh
Does this happen with all Toyotas? I am looking at a 4Runner now, specifically because of how difficult my property and area can be to navigate.


Likely not as 4runnner is purpose built 4wd instead of a FWD with tacked on AWD like 95% CUVs on road besides Subaru.

Re: Would not have bought a Toyota for the spouse if I knew this. [Re: madRiver] #5030609 03/03/19 07:13 PM
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5AcresAndAFool Offline
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Originally Posted by madRiver
Originally Posted by methusaleh
Does this happen with all Toyotas? I am looking at a 4Runner now, specifically because of how difficult my property and area can be to navigate.


Likely not as 4runnner is purpose built 4wd instead of a FWD with tacked on AWD like 95% CUVs on road besides Subaru.


There is so much Misinformation on this thread I do not even know where to begin, You obviously do not have a firm grasp about the 4 runners 4wd system, it is indeed disabled when the PCM has error codes, it works almost the same as the "tacked on" systems you speak of.

I do agree that disabling the VSC and TCS for an evap code is asinine. I do understand why you would want to disable non essential systems for something like a TPS code.

The ABS system is NOT disabled for a PCM code. Just the VSC and TCS.

I have two toyota products and find this ridiculous as well but I am sure the lawyers had the final input on the matter.

FWIW we have an awd sienna, an 05, there is always a 50/50 bias between the front and rear, there is no way to disable this, there is 3 differentials, a front, center ( not really in the center) and rear. All 3 are open. The vehicle uses the traction control to lock the spinning wheels. With No TCS you could have 3 wheels on ice and one on dry blacktop and you aren't going anywhere.

It is a quick, cheap and dirty AWD setup however it is also simple and extremely reliable. It is just not very effective if you do not have the benefit of traction control.

On My XB, it is almost undrivable with no traction control, the deep throttle tip in does not help. I for one actually like ABS,VSC and TCS. I have had plenty of vehicles without it and I feel overall it is beneficial.

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