I think I could do some of the maintenance. I'm going to pass on the Generac brand. Their warranty isn't as good as B&S, Kohler or Cummins.
20KW Standby Generator Recommendations
- Thread starter MParr
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Look at WinCo. A step up from General. I have worked on the WinCo I bought as a project. It's well built .
I will be moving to Delaware in a year or so. They seem to have less power failures than upstate NY. But my home in NY is oil boiler and gas cooking. Home in DE is electric heat pumps (two) with gas hot water heater and 2 propane fire places. The size generator would be large if I tried to run one of the heat pumps. In NY I can get away with a 5 KW or 8 KW. In DE it will be 25 KW, maybe 40 KW. Unsure if I will get one. A lot less people have a generator where I am in DE than around me in NY.
The newer Winco air cooled models use the 993cc B&S Vanguard big block V-twin.
Lots of Generac's in service up here for those fortunate to afford one.
This being an oil site, I find it surprising that no-one has commented on the OCI requirements of the air cooled units. Wouldn't you need shut the unit down and change the oil every 50-100 hours, meaning 2-4 days? Water cooled units are indeed more expensive, but they often run at 1800 vs. 3600 RPM, making them quieter. They also tend to have a 500 hour OCI, which is almost 21 days. I am not sure what the point is with an air cooled whole house generator if the the thing is too loud for you to sleep and you need to change the oil after two or three sleepless nights.
Something to consider is that generator costs may vary a lot between types, but the installation costs won't. A liquid cooled unit, powered by either diesel or LPG, may not be that more expensive when looking at the total installed cost. LPG (Propane) is your best bet in terms of indefinite fuel storage. Diesel will be the most cost effective fuel. Diesel and fuel oil are somewhat interchangeable in this application, so there is an opportunity to share a tank if you heat with oil.
Something to consider is that generator costs may vary a lot between types, but the installation costs won't. A liquid cooled unit, powered by either diesel or LPG, may not be that more expensive when looking at the total installed cost. LPG (Propane) is your best bet in terms of indefinite fuel storage. Diesel will be the most cost effective fuel. Diesel and fuel oil are somewhat interchangeable in this application, so there is an opportunity to share a tank if you heat with oil.
Generac OCI is 2 years or 200 hours so roughly 8 days of running. Only holds 2 quarts and the service isn't super difficult to perform.
The air cooled unit is less expensive. Changing the oil at 100 hrs. isn't that big of a deal. An air cooled unit produces 66db to 70db of noise and they can be positioned where they will not affect your sleep. I don't have neighbors close by and it will not affect their sleep, either. Propane (LPG) is the best fuel for long term storage.
For me a water cooled diesel or propane unit is just to big of an outlay. Diesel is definitely out of the question because, diesel fuel will degrade.
For me a water cooled diesel or propane unit is just to big of an outlay. Diesel is definitely out of the question because, diesel fuel will degrade.
Originally Posted by FlyNavyP3
I've been comparing and shopping here in North Florida, I'm planning on installing a 22KW Generac. I would prefer the Kohler V twin engine over the Briggs Vanguard but for local sales and support the best dealer is a Generac dealer. I wish there was an affordable diesel or 1800 rpm liquid cooled option, but there's not.
So personally I'm buying a Generac. Installation is basically equal to the price of the Generator. So be ready for that. Since I don't have natural gas where I live I'm stuck with propane which is an additional expense. I'm burying a 500 gal tank to run my Generac.
Wow, a 500 gallon tank is a really big tank. I thought you meant a 500 pound tank, but the 22kw generator does say that it takes 7.8 pounds per hour at 50% load. That means that you're at 11kw per hour. Times 24 times 7 is 1848 kilowatts a week which is 1310 pounds of propane or about 309 gallons. Just how much power do you consume a month? Normally my electric bill is under 500 kilowatts a month. Most of the time when I see a propane tank outside a house with a generator, it's either one or two 420 pound tanks that are above ground which is about 100 gallons.
I've been comparing and shopping here in North Florida, I'm planning on installing a 22KW Generac. I would prefer the Kohler V twin engine over the Briggs Vanguard but for local sales and support the best dealer is a Generac dealer. I wish there was an affordable diesel or 1800 rpm liquid cooled option, but there's not.
So personally I'm buying a Generac. Installation is basically equal to the price of the Generator. So be ready for that. Since I don't have natural gas where I live I'm stuck with propane which is an additional expense. I'm burying a 500 gal tank to run my Generac.
Wow, a 500 gallon tank is a really big tank. I thought you meant a 500 pound tank, but the 22kw generator does say that it takes 7.8 pounds per hour at 50% load. That means that you're at 11kw per hour. Times 24 times 7 is 1848 kilowatts a week which is 1310 pounds of propane or about 309 gallons. Just how much power do you consume a month? Normally my electric bill is under 500 kilowatts a month. Most of the time when I see a propane tank outside a house with a generator, it's either one or two 420 pound tanks that are above ground which is about 100 gallons.
Originally Posted by Wolf359
Originally Posted by FlyNavyP3
I've been comparing and shopping here in North Florida, I'm planning on installing a 22KW Generac. I would prefer the Kohler V twin engine over the Briggs Vanguard but for local sales and support the best dealer is a Generac dealer. I wish there was an affordable diesel or 1800 rpm liquid cooled option, but there's not.
So personally I'm buying a Generac. Installation is basically equal to the price of the Generator. So be ready for that. Since I don't have natural gas where I live I'm stuck with propane which is an additional expense. I'm burying a 500 gal tank to run my Generac.
Wow, a 500 gallon tank is a really big tank. I thought you meant a 500 pound tank, but the 22kw generator does say that it takes 7.8 pounds per hour at 50% load. That means that you're at 11kw per hour. Times 24 times 7 is 1848 kilowatts a week which is 1310 pounds of propane or about 309 gallons. Just how much power do you consume a month? Normally my electric bill is under 500 kilowatts a month. Most of the time when I see a propane tank outside a house with a generator, it's either one or two 420 pound tanks that are above ground which is about 100 gallons.
For many larger propane generators its the vaporization rate that drives one to a large tank, not the run time. In warmer temps, the vaporization rate is less of an issue. If you are burying a tank then 500 gallons or 1000 gallons. And the wise thing is to always buy the tank, not rent. For a generator only installation, most propane companies will not rent a tank or if they do it will be expensive.
Originally Posted by FlyNavyP3
I've been comparing and shopping here in North Florida, I'm planning on installing a 22KW Generac. I would prefer the Kohler V twin engine over the Briggs Vanguard but for local sales and support the best dealer is a Generac dealer. I wish there was an affordable diesel or 1800 rpm liquid cooled option, but there's not.
So personally I'm buying a Generac. Installation is basically equal to the price of the Generator. So be ready for that. Since I don't have natural gas where I live I'm stuck with propane which is an additional expense. I'm burying a 500 gal tank to run my Generac.
Wow, a 500 gallon tank is a really big tank. I thought you meant a 500 pound tank, but the 22kw generator does say that it takes 7.8 pounds per hour at 50% load. That means that you're at 11kw per hour. Times 24 times 7 is 1848 kilowatts a week which is 1310 pounds of propane or about 309 gallons. Just how much power do you consume a month? Normally my electric bill is under 500 kilowatts a month. Most of the time when I see a propane tank outside a house with a generator, it's either one or two 420 pound tanks that are above ground which is about 100 gallons.
For many larger propane generators its the vaporization rate that drives one to a large tank, not the run time. In warmer temps, the vaporization rate is less of an issue. If you are burying a tank then 500 gallons or 1000 gallons. And the wise thing is to always buy the tank, not rent. For a generator only installation, most propane companies will not rent a tank or if they do it will be expensive.
Originally Posted by Wolf359
Originally Posted by FlyNavyP3
I've been comparing and shopping here in North Florida, I'm planning on installing a 22KW Generac. I would prefer the Kohler V twin engine over the Briggs Vanguard but for local sales and support the best dealer is a Generac dealer. I wish there was an affordable diesel or 1800 rpm liquid cooled option, but there's not.
So personally I'm buying a Generac. Installation is basically equal to the price of the Generator. So be ready for that. Since I don't have natural gas where I live I'm stuck with propane which is an additional expense. I'm burying a 500 gal tank to run my Generac.
Wow, a 500 gallon tank is a really big tank. I thought you meant a 500 pound tank, but the 22kw generator does say that it takes 7.8 pounds per hour at 50% load. That means that you're at 11kw per hour. Times 24 times 7 is 1848 kilowatts a week which is 1310 pounds of propane or about 309 gallons. Just how much power do you consume a month? Normally my electric bill is under 500 kilowatts a month. Most of the time when I see a propane tank outside a house with a generator, it's either one or two 420 pound tanks that are above ground which is about 100 gallons.
I just checked my electric bill for September since it's one of the two most active hurricane months here in Florida. My monthly usage for September was 1253 KWh. Which is a little higher than normal but within about 200 kWh of my min and max consumption for the year.
I too used the 50% load to estimate fuel consumption since the AC by itself will put me about 50% load on the generator, when the AC isn't running I'll probably be more like 15-30% load but the 25% fuel burn is not half of the 50% since the engine consumes fuel even at light load. It's not efficient at light loads compared to a smaller machine but it's convenient.
I wish someone would make a variable speed machine that would run 1200-3600 RPM based on load like the Honda inverter generator does. Generac makes one that's 1800/3600 with 2 different sets of windings in the generator head but it's proven troublesome in field use.
If this was a long term home and I had natural gas I would buy the 35kw Briggs and Stratton that's powered by a pusbrod all cast iron GM 3.0L inline 4 cylinder and turns 1800 RPM, that's a fantastic little engine, gear to gear timing push rods, very robust and still built new for industrial and marine applications.
Originally Posted by FlyNavyP3
I've been comparing and shopping here in North Florida, I'm planning on installing a 22KW Generac. I would prefer the Kohler V twin engine over the Briggs Vanguard but for local sales and support the best dealer is a Generac dealer. I wish there was an affordable diesel or 1800 rpm liquid cooled option, but there's not.
So personally I'm buying a Generac. Installation is basically equal to the price of the Generator. So be ready for that. Since I don't have natural gas where I live I'm stuck with propane which is an additional expense. I'm burying a 500 gal tank to run my Generac.
Wow, a 500 gallon tank is a really big tank. I thought you meant a 500 pound tank, but the 22kw generator does say that it takes 7.8 pounds per hour at 50% load. That means that you're at 11kw per hour. Times 24 times 7 is 1848 kilowatts a week which is 1310 pounds of propane or about 309 gallons. Just how much power do you consume a month? Normally my electric bill is under 500 kilowatts a month. Most of the time when I see a propane tank outside a house with a generator, it's either one or two 420 pound tanks that are above ground which is about 100 gallons.
I just checked my electric bill for September since it's one of the two most active hurricane months here in Florida. My monthly usage for September was 1253 KWh. Which is a little higher than normal but within about 200 kWh of my min and max consumption for the year.
I too used the 50% load to estimate fuel consumption since the AC by itself will put me about 50% load on the generator, when the AC isn't running I'll probably be more like 15-30% load but the 25% fuel burn is not half of the 50% since the engine consumes fuel even at light load. It's not efficient at light loads compared to a smaller machine but it's convenient.
I wish someone would make a variable speed machine that would run 1200-3600 RPM based on load like the Honda inverter generator does. Generac makes one that's 1800/3600 with 2 different sets of windings in the generator head but it's proven troublesome in field use.
If this was a long term home and I had natural gas I would buy the 35kw Briggs and Stratton that's powered by a pusbrod all cast iron GM 3.0L inline 4 cylinder and turns 1800 RPM, that's a fantastic little engine, gear to gear timing push rods, very robust and still built new for industrial and marine applications.
There are some water cooled 20 or 22kw units out there. I think Winco still makes one. If you went with a water cooled unit on propane you could have it set up for liquid draw which would reduce the size of tank needed.
With any motor loading like central air conditioner units you are going to be stuck with a single speed unit.
With any motor loading like central air conditioner units you are going to be stuck with a single speed unit.
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Originally Posted by Donald
Originally Posted by Wolf359
Originally Posted by FlyNavyP3
I've been comparing and shopping here in North Florida, I'm planning on installing a 22KW Generac. I would prefer the Kohler V twin engine over the Briggs Vanguard but for local sales and support the best dealer is a Generac dealer. I wish there was an affordable diesel or 1800 rpm liquid cooled option, but there's not.
So personally I'm buying a Generac. Installation is basically equal to the price of the Generator. So be ready for that. Since I don't have natural gas where I live I'm stuck with propane which is an additional expense. I'm burying a 500 gal tank to run my Generac.
Wow, a 500 gallon tank is a really big tank. I thought you meant a 500 pound tank, but the 22kw generator does say that it takes 7.8 pounds per hour at 50% load. That means that you're at 11kw per hour. Times 24 times 7 is 1848 kilowatts a week which is 1310 pounds of propane or about 309 gallons. Just how much power do you consume a month? Normally my electric bill is under 500 kilowatts a month. Most of the time when I see a propane tank outside a house with a generator, it's either one or two 420 pound tanks that are above ground which is about 100 gallons.
For many larger propane generators its the vaporization rate that drives one to a large tank, not the run time. In warmer temps, the vaporization rate is less of an issue. If you are burying a tank then 500 gallons or 1000 gallons. And the wise thing is to always buy the tank, not rent. For a generator only installation, most propane companies will not rent a tank or if they do it will be expensive.
I think that's why there's usually 2 propane tanks.
Originally Posted by Wolf359
Originally Posted by FlyNavyP3
I've been comparing and shopping here in North Florida, I'm planning on installing a 22KW Generac. I would prefer the Kohler V twin engine over the Briggs Vanguard but for local sales and support the best dealer is a Generac dealer. I wish there was an affordable diesel or 1800 rpm liquid cooled option, but there's not.
So personally I'm buying a Generac. Installation is basically equal to the price of the Generator. So be ready for that. Since I don't have natural gas where I live I'm stuck with propane which is an additional expense. I'm burying a 500 gal tank to run my Generac.
Wow, a 500 gallon tank is a really big tank. I thought you meant a 500 pound tank, but the 22kw generator does say that it takes 7.8 pounds per hour at 50% load. That means that you're at 11kw per hour. Times 24 times 7 is 1848 kilowatts a week which is 1310 pounds of propane or about 309 gallons. Just how much power do you consume a month? Normally my electric bill is under 500 kilowatts a month. Most of the time when I see a propane tank outside a house with a generator, it's either one or two 420 pound tanks that are above ground which is about 100 gallons.
For many larger propane generators its the vaporization rate that drives one to a large tank, not the run time. In warmer temps, the vaporization rate is less of an issue. If you are burying a tank then 500 gallons or 1000 gallons. And the wise thing is to always buy the tank, not rent. For a generator only installation, most propane companies will not rent a tank or if they do it will be expensive.
I think that's why there's usually 2 propane tanks.
This 35KW Generator is the one I would buy if I had Natural Gas and was staying in the house for an extended period of time. Link -----------> CLICK HERE
3.0L All cast iron 4 cyl with geared timing, hydraulic cam (no valve adjustments) and a proven track record, it also has very compreable fuel flow at reasonable loads to the 22KW air cooled units.
3.0L All cast iron 4 cyl with geared timing, hydraulic cam (no valve adjustments) and a proven track record, it also has very compreable fuel flow at reasonable loads to the 22KW air cooled units.
Originally Posted by FlyNavyP3
Generac OCI is 2 years or 200 hours so roughly 8 days of running. Only holds 2 quarts and the service isn't super difficult to perform.
200 hours on a Generac air cooled V-Twin engine? B&S recommends 100 hours on their V-Twins. What's different about the Generac engine that would justify the difference? I also recall that B&S used to say that one ounce per cylinder per hour was considered normal oil use. If you do the math, an oil consumption rate of only 0.08 ounce per cylinder would be necessary to reach 200 hours with half of your original oil left. Is that 200 hour OCI really practical in anyone's personal experience?
Generac OCI is 2 years or 200 hours so roughly 8 days of running. Only holds 2 quarts and the service isn't super difficult to perform.
200 hours on a Generac air cooled V-Twin engine? B&S recommends 100 hours on their V-Twins. What's different about the Generac engine that would justify the difference? I also recall that B&S used to say that one ounce per cylinder per hour was considered normal oil use. If you do the math, an oil consumption rate of only 0.08 ounce per cylinder would be necessary to reach 200 hours with half of your original oil left. Is that 200 hour OCI really practical in anyone's personal experience?
Originally Posted by Astro_Guy
Originally Posted by FlyNavyP3
Generac OCI is 2 years or 200 hours so roughly 8 days of running. Only holds 2 quarts and the service isn't super difficult to perform.
200 hours on a Generac air cooled V-Twin engine? B&S recommends 100 hours on their V-Twins. What's different about the Generac engine that would justify the difference? I also recall that B&S used to say that one ounce per cylinder per hour was considered normal oil use. If you do the math, an oil consumption rate of only 0.08 ounce per cylinder would be necessary to reach 200 hours with half of your original oil left. Is that 200 hour OCI really practical in anyone's personal experience?
My Generac installer noted that the units consume oil in use and recommended shutting the unit off once per day to check and add oil as needed, I know the unit has a low oil pressure shut down, not sure if it has a low oil level shut down. He mentioned that average consumption in his experience was 4-8 ounces per 24 hours at 50% continious load and that if the generator is unattended should run 2-3 days before tripping on low oil shutdown protection. If I'm adding a 8 oz per 24 hours that would be a full quart every 100 hours or a full 2 quarts replaced by the time it gets to 200 hours. Seems reasonable to me with a full flow filter.
Originally Posted by FlyNavyP3
Generac OCI is 2 years or 200 hours so roughly 8 days of running. Only holds 2 quarts and the service isn't super difficult to perform.
200 hours on a Generac air cooled V-Twin engine? B&S recommends 100 hours on their V-Twins. What's different about the Generac engine that would justify the difference? I also recall that B&S used to say that one ounce per cylinder per hour was considered normal oil use. If you do the math, an oil consumption rate of only 0.08 ounce per cylinder would be necessary to reach 200 hours with half of your original oil left. Is that 200 hour OCI really practical in anyone's personal experience?
My Generac installer noted that the units consume oil in use and recommended shutting the unit off once per day to check and add oil as needed, I know the unit has a low oil pressure shut down, not sure if it has a low oil level shut down. He mentioned that average consumption in his experience was 4-8 ounces per 24 hours at 50% continious load and that if the generator is unattended should run 2-3 days before tripping on low oil shutdown protection. If I'm adding a 8 oz per 24 hours that would be a full quart every 100 hours or a full 2 quarts replaced by the time it gets to 200 hours. Seems reasonable to me with a full flow filter.
Originally Posted by FlyNavyP3
My Generac installer noted that the units consume oil in use and recommended shutting the unit off once per day to check and add oil as needed, I know the unit has a low oil pressure shut down, not sure if it has a low oil level shut down. He mentioned that average consumption in his experience was 4-8 ounces per 24 hours at 50% continious load and that if the generator is unattended should run 2-3 days before tripping on low oil shutdown protection. If I'm adding a 8 oz per 24 hours that would be a full quart every 100 hours or a full 2 quarts replaced by the time it gets to 200 hours. Seems reasonable to me with a full flow filter.
That's pretty impressive for an air-cooled engine running continuously at 3600 RPM!
My Generac installer noted that the units consume oil in use and recommended shutting the unit off once per day to check and add oil as needed, I know the unit has a low oil pressure shut down, not sure if it has a low oil level shut down. He mentioned that average consumption in his experience was 4-8 ounces per 24 hours at 50% continious load and that if the generator is unattended should run 2-3 days before tripping on low oil shutdown protection. If I'm adding a 8 oz per 24 hours that would be a full quart every 100 hours or a full 2 quarts replaced by the time it gets to 200 hours. Seems reasonable to me with a full flow filter.
That's pretty impressive for an air-cooled engine running continuously at 3600 RPM!
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