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Re: Shell vs Delvac [Re: Dak27] #4789809 06/18/18 08:55 AM
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nap Offline
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Originally Posted By: Dak27

I'm a bit of a novice around here, does this type of testing between oil companies happen often, where one company will point out that another company's product doesn't meet specs?


Happened before:

https://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1481293

Re: Shell vs Delvac [Re: alarmguy] #4792768 06/21/18 06:17 AM
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dnewton3 Offline
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Originally Posted By: alarmguy
Originally Posted By: krismoriah72
Rotella has very robust add packs, high TBN..sold everywhere.. even JASO approved.



Rotella is NOT Jaso approved.

Shell claims certain oils of theirs MEETS the requirements of Jaso. No where to be found in the JASO Approved list will you find Rotella oils.


True.

However also true of brands like Amsoil, RL, etc when it comes to some API certifications. Doesn't mean they don't meet the intended specs; just means they are unwilling to pay for the license privilege.

Just as Amsoil will warrant their product in their stated API uses, so would Rotella for the claimed JASO applications.

Last edited by dnewton3; 06/21/18 06:18 AM.

The act of preventative maintenance, in and of itself, is FAR MORE important than brand/grade/base choices among lubes and filters.
- under maintaining something is akin to abuse/neglect; that can kill equipment by shortening the lifespan
- over maintaining something has never been proven to be anything but a waste of time and money
Re: Shell vs Delvac [Re: Dak27] #4793707 06/21/18 10:45 PM
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Garak Offline
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Originally Posted By: Dak27
I agree. I figure if Mobil chooses to respond to Shell's ad, they'll go this route.

I'm a bit of a novice around here, does this type of testing between oil companies happen often, where one company will point out that another company's product doesn't meet specs?

It has happened a few times, but it's relatively uncommon. I gather they check frequently enough, since that's a major marketing coup. Nonetheless, I highly doubt that Mobil's ordinary formulation won't meet CK-4 and the builder approvals. Something just went wrong here with a batch.


Plain, simple Garak.

2008 Infiniti G37 - Shell ROTELLA T6 Multi-Vehicle 5w-30, Wix 57356
1984 F-150 4.9L - Quaker State GB 10w-30, Wix 51515
Re: Shell vs Delvac [Re: dogememe] #4794673 06/22/18 09:36 PM
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jongies3 Offline
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Originally Posted By: dogememe
Originally Posted By: skyactiv
My thoughts? I think Mobil makes the worst products of the major players.
This isn't the first a competitor called out a Mobil product.
I bet Shell is correct on calling out the oil in question and cant be held libel because the product in question is in fact a failure.



It's funny, so many people say Mobil the best but I don't think it's all it's cracked up to be.

There is no best oil, Mobil may not be the best, but there's nothing wrong with it either. I'd much rather use their products over anything made by Supertech after seeing how poorly the latter performed in cold pour tests. Supertech is definitely a bottom of the barrel oil, but even it's not bad if you live in a temperate climate that doesn't get below freezing. I'd put Mobil and Shell neck and neck, I've used both extensively and cannot tell the difference. I've noticed the engine in my Tacoma seems to turn over a lot easier in the bitter cold on the M1 AFE 0W-30 over Pennzoil Platinum 5W-30, this is due to a lower pour point, however. Even if it's only a few degrees difference. There's no question who the leader is in synthetic oil sales is, however, Mobil 1 outsells the rest by a pretty big margin, they must be doing something right!


2004 Toyota Tacoma 3.4 V6: Mobil 1 AFE 0W-30, FRAM PH3614 filter
2003 Buick Park Avenue Ultra S/C 3.8 V6: QSGB 5W-30, FRAM PH3387 filter
2013 Honda 400EX ATV: Mobil 1 Racing 4t 10W-40, OEM filter
Re: Shell vs Delvac [Re: jongies3] #4794739 06/22/18 10:31 PM
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Garak Offline
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There are name brand synthetics in 5w-30 that have a pour point of -36 C, along with some major builder approvals. It's better to pay attention to the number before the "w" than the pour point for people who do need the cold start capabilities.


Plain, simple Garak.

2008 Infiniti G37 - Shell ROTELLA T6 Multi-Vehicle 5w-30, Wix 57356
1984 F-150 4.9L - Quaker State GB 10w-30, Wix 51515
Re: Shell vs Delvac [Re: njohnson] #4796020 06/24/18 07:36 AM
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rdg Offline
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It appears that Shell isn't afraid of a potential lawsuit about making accusations of Mobil Delvac 1300 Super failing the Volvo T-13 oxidation test, because they posted this video on YouTube:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ljHagvd3-Ck

Re: Shell vs Delvac [Re: njohnson] #4796171 06/24/18 10:50 AM
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SavagePatch Offline
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ExxonMobil still hasn't updated their PDS for M1 TDT CK-4. If going by the CJ-4 PDS it is lacking in the builder approvals "arena" too.


Re: Shell vs Delvac [Re: SavagePatch] #4796316 06/24/18 01:45 PM
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Dodgetracker Offline
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From Mobil website:

Applications
Mobil 1 Turbo Diesel Truck 5W-40 is recommended for use in all super high performance diesel applications, including modern low emission engine designs with Exhaust Gas Recirculation (EGR). These applications include the following:
On-highway engines operating in both high speed/high load and stop-and-go conditions
Off-highway engines operating in severe low speed/heavy load conditions
Virtually all diesel powered equipment from American, European, and Japanese equipment builders
High performance gasoline engines and mixed fleets
Refrigeration units

Specifications and Approvals
This product meets or exceeds the requirements of the following industry and builder specifications:
ACEA E7
API CJ-4
API CI-4 PLUS
API CI-4
API CH-4
API SM
API SL
CATERPILLAR ECF-3
API CG-4
API CK-4
API SN
ACEA E9-12


Typical Properties
Mobil 1 Turbo Diesel Truck 5W-40

SAE Grade
5W-40
Viscosity, cSt (ASTM D445)

@ 40C
97.9
@ 100C
14.5
Viscosity Index
153
Phosporous (ASTM D4951)
0.11
HTHS Viscosity, mPas @ 150C (ASTM D4683)
3.8
Sulfated Ash, wt% (ASTM D874)
0.95
Total Base #, mg KOH/g (ASTM D2896)
10.7
Flash Point, C (ASTM D92)
215
Density @ 15.6C g/ml (ASTM D4052)
0.85


2008 Dodge Ram 2500 4x4 6.7 CTD 68RFE.
2004 Jeep Wrangler 4x4 4L Straight 6 Auto.
Re: Shell vs Delvac [Re: njohnson] #4796349 06/24/18 02:14 PM
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BobFout Offline
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Guys, TDT is (primarily) designed for pickup trucks. The Delvac line is for heavy duty use.


2003 VW Jetta TDI (Sold) / 2015 VW GTI 2.0T
Re: Shell vs Delvac [Re: BobFout] #4796498 06/24/18 05:17 PM
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bullwinkle Online Confused
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Originally Posted By: BobFout
Guys, TDT is (primarily) designed for pickup trucks. The Delvac line is for heavy duty use.
Uh-oh, guess my Cummins Ram is going to blow up from all the Delvac 1 I've been using in it! You do realize, back in the CI-4 days, TDT & D1 were the EXACT SAME oil??


06 Ram 3500 CTD 4X4(FG Venturi), 89 F-450 7.3, 98 XJ 4.0(XG8A), 05 xB(XG3600), 18 Transit 3.7 (MC), 03 Merc Grand Marquis 4.6 2V(XG2), 11 Express 3500 6.0 (Fram PH10060 for now)
Re: Shell vs Delvac [Re: BobFout] #4796722 06/24/18 09:56 PM
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Originally Posted By: BobFout
Guys, TDT is (primarily) designed for pickup trucks. The Delvac line is for heavy duty use.


No Sir,,, that's not true.


2008 Dodge Ram 2500 4x4 6.7 CTD 68RFE.
2004 Jeep Wrangler 4x4 4L Straight 6 Auto.
Re: Shell vs Delvac [Re: Dodgetracker] #4796813 06/25/18 02:36 AM
Joined: Sep 2010
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4WD Online Confused
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Originally Posted By: Dodgetracker
Originally Posted By: BobFout
Guys, TDT is (primarily) designed for pickup trucks. The Delvac line is for heavy duty use.


No Sir,,, that's not true.


Well, TDT has a pickup on the bottle and Delvac has a big rig so we can certainly say they are marketing it that way.
Having said that I know guys with a 2017 PSD F250, 2014 Ram 3500, and a 2015 Duramax running Delvac 1
They all trailer heavy (have cattle and land) and use the same oil in equipment

Re: Shell vs Delvac [Re: njohnson] #4796826 06/25/18 03:37 AM
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Gokhan Offline
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I've always thought Delvac was better than Rotella. I see that Rotella CK-4 no longer has moly, which is not good. Delvac still has the trinuclear moly ("trimer" additive technology as they put it in the CJ-4 data sheet) but they've reduced it in CK-4.

Incidentally I calculated the A_Harman index for Delvac 15W-40 CK-4 to be 0.982, which is the highest A_Harman index of any off-the-shelf oil out there, higher than any synthetic oil. So, Delvac 15W-40 CK-4 is the current top-place holder for the A_Harman index among all nonboutique oils out there. It seems to be virtually VII-free. Therefore, It would have to be Group II+ and I don't understand how it would fail the oxidation test.


2020 Toyota Prius Prime XLE plug-in hybrid, 2ZR-FXE engine, ~ 65 mpg on regular gasoline, ~ 5,000 mi
TGMO 0W-16 SN/RC Japan
OEM spin-on oil filter Japan
Re: Shell vs Delvac [Re: njohnson] #4796828 06/25/18 03:41 AM
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Gokhan Offline
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Of course, Mobil 1 Turbo Diesel Truck 5W-40 is not meant for heavy-duty trucks. It doesn't have a single OEM certification other than Caterpillar ECF-3. Delvac has all kinds of OEM certifications for 18-wheelers on the other hand.


2020 Toyota Prius Prime XLE plug-in hybrid, 2ZR-FXE engine, ~ 65 mpg on regular gasoline, ~ 5,000 mi
TGMO 0W-16 SN/RC Japan
OEM spin-on oil filter Japan
Re: Shell vs Delvac [Re: 4WD] #4797124 06/25/18 12:06 PM
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OVERKILL Offline
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Originally Posted By: 4WD


Yeah, despite this being a different grade, Mobil's claims completely contradict Shell's claims shrug


2019 RAM 1500 Sport - Mobil 1 EP 0w-20, FRAM Ultra
2020 Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT Ravenol SSL 0w-40, FRAM Ultra
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