Oil For High Sustained RPM on BMW S52

[ZEK]

Hello All, I'm new to this forum but have referenced for many years. I have a question which has mainly been answered by most recently kentd98's post on M50TU and M52TU but I have an added variable. I have a recently torn down clean BMW S52 (130K) that has had everything replaced except the rotating assembly. So essentially new timing parts for this motor. The first start I used Castrol GTX 10W40 with half bottle Redline Break In additive and motor sounded nice and quiet. OFC the usual lifter noise but nothing out of the ordinary. After draining that (100 miles) I went to Liqui Moly 10W40 Mos2 as it's relatively cheap from FCP when I was buying parts. I did hear a slight increase in lifter noise but maybe that's my ears. I realize this motor isn't picky and can run just fine on a wide range of oils. I planned on switching to Mobil 1 10W40 from Walmart as it's cheaper and probably a better product then LM. The diff is a 4.10 mated to a 5spd so any highway speed is 3800RPM+ for sustained time.

Is there an oil around the Mobil 1 pricepoint (say $25) that you would recommend? I can swing Redline/Motul/Rowe however I planned on 2-3K drain intervals due to high RPM and felt that would be an even bigger waste of oil. I wanted to avoid Mobil 1 0W/40 as in my experience with that weight in these motors created the most valvetrain noise. I'm slightly curious if at a 2K interval would GTX and the Redline additive or just GTX itself would even be an option.

Hopefully I don't sound to incorrect in my reasoning but if I do please call me out. This is why I'm here. Thanks everyone.

 

[1JZ_E46]

S52 and M52 are nearly the same internally. I’d go for any mainstream LL-01 oil and change it regularly. Since you don’t want a 0W-40, Castrol EDGE 5W-30 A3/B4 can be had on Amazon and rmeuropean for $35-38 for a 5 quart jug. But honestly, there is very little difference (from a viscosity standpoint) in any LL-01 oil, regardless of weight.

Don’t waste your money on expensive/boutique oils, especially for a 3k OCI. There’s zero evidence they can outperform a mainstream LL-01 oil, like EDGE 0W-40.

 

[sloinker]

There are a lot of folks who have gotten rid of the lifter noise in modern Mopar hemi's by using Red Line. I also agree that M1 0w-40 made my old Mercedes 3.2L V6 sound bad with intermittent ticking. If you want to save money get whatever is cheapest that meets the spec. If you want what is quietest, get some Red line.

 

[d00df00d]

Originally Posted By: ZEK
Hello All, I'm new to this forum but have referenced for many years. I have a question which has mainly been answered by most recently kentd98's post on M50TU and M52TU but I have an added variable. I have a recently torn down clean BMW S52 (130K) that has had everything replaced except the rotating assembly. So essentially new timing parts for this motor. The first start I used Castrol GTX 10W40 with half bottle Redline Break In additive and motor sounded nice and quiet. OFC the usual lifter noise but nothing out of the ordinary. After draining that (100 miles) I went to Liqui Moly 10W40 Mos2 as it's relatively cheap from FCP when I was buying parts. I did hear a slight increase in lifter noise but maybe that's my ears. I realize this motor isn't picky and can run just fine on a wide range of oils. I planned on switching to Mobil 1 10W40 from Walmart as it's cheaper and probably a better product then LM. The diff is a 4.10 mated to a 5spd so any highway speed is 3800RPM+ for sustained time.

Is there an oil around the Mobil 1 pricepoint (say $25) that you would recommend? I can swing Redline/Motul/Rowe however I planned on 2-3K drain intervals due to high RPM and felt that would be an even bigger waste of oil. I wanted to avoid Mobil 1 0W/40 as in my experience with that weight in these motors created the most valvetrain noise. I'm slightly curious if at a 2K interval would GTX and the Redline additive or just GTX itself would even be an option.

Hopefully I don't sound to incorrect in my reasoning but if I do please call me out. This is why I'm here. Thanks everyone.




You mentioned FCP. Did you mean FCP Euro? If so, you know their unlimited free exchange policy applies to oil, right? You can literally mail your used oil back to them for credit on your next change. After the first change, the only net cost to you is the shipping to them. Run the numbers and see if there's an oil they sell that makes sense to run vs. a $25/jug synthetic. Or I can run them for you -- I made a little calculator for myself and I can just plug your numbers in. What's your oil consumption in 2-3k miles like?

If you don't want 0W-40, my first choice would be an LL-01 approved 5W-40. I haven't scoured FCP Euro, but I found Rowe 5W-40 Synthetic RS HC-D for $40 per 5L. For a cheap off-the-shelf option, you could do Castrol Edge 5W-40 at around $28 per 5 qt from Wal Mart. Which one is cheaper will depend on your oil consumption.

I'm not sure Red Line or Motul 300V would be of much benefit here TBH, but I guess you could run one of them in xW-40 as well.

Either way, I wouldn't touch a conventional in this application.

 

[racin4ds]

Anything Mobil 1 is going to make this engine noisy as that is just a trait that seems to follow M1. Try some Pennzoil Ultra/Platinum Euro formula that is LL-01 rated. Its also at WalMart and around the same price point but a much better oil.

Why dump the oil at 3k miles if you don't have too? I'd do a couple UOA's and see how its performing and go from there. My guess is you can easily go 5k miles with an oil like PUP.

 

[4WD]

Originally Posted By: racin4ds
Anything Mobil 1 is going to make this engine noisy as that is just a trait that seems to follow M1. Try some Pennzoil Ultra/Platinum Euro formula that is LL-01 rated. Its also at WalMart and around the same price point but a much better oil.

Why dump the oil at 3k miles if you don't have too? I'd do a couple UOA's and see how its performing and go from there. My guess is you can easily go 5k miles with an oil like PUP.


Tell you what … since after decades using M1 and not having “noise” … and doing actual DB tests where PUP was louder than M1 EP in both a Ford and GM engine … please tell us what is is about M1 that makes it so loud ...
(You’d be the first here) …

 

[d00df00d]

I ran a BUNCH of different oils in my old E36 M3, from 0W-30 to 15W-40; BMW, Motul 8100, Motul 300V, RLI, and Mobil 1. From just over 90k miles when I got it until around 210k when I got rid of it, the only time I ever got valvetrain noise was with the 15W-40 on a cold start, or VERY occasionally on the very first start after an oil change -- and only for a few seconds either way.

Mobil 1 0W-40 was the last oil I ran, so it saw the engine after almost 200k hard miles. By that point, the engine had been consuming oil at 1 qt every 600-1600 miles and fuel diluting like crazy for most of its life -- in spite of which I still ran a lot of extended OCIs, well past BMW's recommendation. Still had zero valvetrain noise.

 

[Lolvoguy]

 

[racin4ds]

[/quote] Tell you what … since after decades using M1 and not having “noise” … and doing actual DB tests where PUP was louder than M1 EP in both a Ford and GM engine … please tell us what is is about M1 that makes it so loud ...
(You’d be the first here) … [/quote]

I wish I knew, I'm not a tribologist nor do I claim to be, I'm a veteran mechanic that has changed a LOT of oil and owned many different cars. Every single one that I put M1 in was noticeably noisier than any other oil, to the point my oblivious wife noticed it in her Nissan Sentra, in her Honda and even in our F150. I used to love M1 and had a hard time giving up on them but the last decade of formula changes and going cheap has done something that I will not risk. Any oil that causes excessive audible noise is not protecting, plain and simple.

No dB testing was done, no scientific facts stated on paper, just plain observation and good ears. My dad whom also LOVED M1 oils stopped using it for the same reason when it starting making his new Honda Civics "tap" and sound like a worn out sewing machine. Switching to PU/PUP quieted every engine back to normal or even better in my case and will be my off the shelf syn of choice.

 

[4WD]

Originally Posted By: racin4ds

Tell you what … since after decades using M1 and not having “noise” … and doing actual DB tests where PUP was louder than M1 EP in both a Ford and GM engine … please tell us what is is about M1 that makes it so loud ...
(You’d be the first here) … [/quote]

I wish I knew, I'm not a tribologist nor do I claim to be, I'm a veteran mechanic that has changed a LOT of oil and owned many different cars. Every single one that I put M1 in was noticeably noisier than any other oil, to the point my oblivious wife noticed it in her Nissan Sentra, in her Honda and even in our F150. I used to love M1 and had a hard time giving up on them but the last decade of formula changes and going cheap has done something that I will not risk. Any oil that causes excessive audible noise is not protecting, plain and simple.

No dB testing was done, no scientific facts stated on paper, just plain observation and good ears. My dad whom also LOVED M1 oils stopped using it for the same reason when it starting making his new Honda Civics "tap" and sound like a worn out sewing machine. Switching to PU/PUP quieted every engine back to normal or even better in my case and will be my off the shelf syn of choice. [/quote]

Well, I’m only using in two vehicles out of six … one is +60% PAO and one is GTL …
That’s what you are calling gone cheap?

 

[KenO]

I've ran a number of oils in my M52 drift car which just rides the rev limiter pretty often. Castrol Edge 5W-50, Rotella 5W-40, Motul 5W-40 have all suited me well.

 

[NewYorkBuck]

Not that this is the be-all and end-all re high revs in a BMW, but since the conversation has turned to engine noise I figured Id add my 2 cents.

I have a Porsche 996TT. With that, I get the customary IMS chain rattle. Ive tried many oils trying to get rid of it - M1 0W-40, Delvac 5W-40 ESP, M1 5W-50, and finally Motul 300V 5W-40.

In all that, the Motul is the only oil that successfully quieted my IMS. It also gave me far and away my best UOAs. It is expensive, but the way I see it, its the best medicine I know for a $40k engine. If I ever get tired of the cost, I may try X-cess, but right now, it aint broke, so I aint fixing it.

 

[racin4ds]

Originally Posted By: NewYorkBuck
Not that this is the be-all and end-all re high revs in a BMW, but since the conversation has turned to engine noise I figured Id add my 2 cents.

I have a Porsche 996TT. With that, I get the customary IMS chain rattle. Ive tried many oils trying to get rid of it - M1 0W-40, Delvac 5W-40 ESP, M1 5W-50, and finally Motul 300V 5W-40.

In all that, the Motul is the only oil that successfully quieted my IMS. It also gave me far and away my best UOAs. It is expensive, but the way I see it, its the best medicine I know for a $40k engine. If I ever get tired of the cost, I may try X-cess, but right now, it aint broke, so I aint fixing it.


So you only tried Mobil products up until the Motul... why not give the new Pennzoils a try? Or the new Castrol Magnatech syns? All better oils than the M1! Oh but wait, be prepared to get flamed for hating on M1 around here, its impossible for that oil to be bad and cause issues! Its made from unicorn tears and works in everything!

 

[ka9mnx]

Originally Posted By: 4WD
Originally Posted By: racin4ds
Anything Mobil 1 is going to make this engine noisy as that is just a trait that seems to follow M1. Try some Pennzoil Ultra/Platinum Euro formula that is LL-01 rated. Its also at WalMart and around the same price point but a much better oil.

Why dump the oil at 3k miles if you don't have too? I'd do a couple UOA's and see how its performing and go from there. My guess is you can easily go 5k miles with an oil like PUP.


Tell you what … since after decades using M1 and not having “noise” … and doing actual DB tests where PUP was louder than M1 EP in both a Ford and GM engine … please tell us what is is about M1 that makes it so loud ...
(You’d be the first here) …


From reading your posts I get it you don't like Mobil1.

First. It has been proven, although very annoying, noise does not mean wear.

Second. The high iron (FE) in UOA's is unfounded.

I have used Mobil1 since it was a 5w-20. Yes, some old engines were louder and annoying.

Here is my recent experience with the HM version of Mobil1 in older engines. After messing around with various brands and weights I went back to Mobil1 HM. After the change the engines were noisy but not more than they were with the previous oils. Upon reaching around 1K miles, on the oil, the engines quieted right down to where I cannot even hear my old F150 running (and that's with the steel timing gears). I have never had that happen with any oil. This has happened with all four of my vehicles. So I think you have to give Mobil1 a few miles before making any decisions.

I see you like Pennzoil and that's OK. If I wasn't seeking long OCI's I would be using PYB. Good stuff.

Oh, the noisiest I ever used was Valvoline.

 

[Lead Shoes]

My S52 is smooth and quiet on 0w40 Castrol... for the price and ll-01 cert you cannot beat the availability and performance.