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#4729315 - 04/16/18 08:36 PM Octane, Ethanol, and Dilution
Isophix Online   content


Registered: 04/10/18
Posts: 11
Loc: NC
I bought a 2018 Hyundai Elantra Sport a couple of weeks ago, and have been zipping around in it.

Got about 900 miles on it now.

Checked the oil today, smells like a fuel factory.

I have been putting 90 octane, ethanol-free Valero (a recommended Top-Tier branded) gasoline in it.


Does octane and/or ethanol levels play any role in dilution, or are they unrelated?

What steps can be taken to mitigate dilution?


The reason I like the higher octane and the ethanol free is supposedly they help prevent LSPI.

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#4729328 - 04/16/18 08:46 PM Re: Octane, Ethanol, and Dilution [Re: Isophix]
Charlie2015 Offline


Registered: 04/24/15
Posts: 215
Loc: Georgia
I do a lot of oil changes. Almost all DI engines smell like fuel in the oil. That is no matter what make.
_________________________
1998 Honda Accord EX 2.3L Auto
2009 Scion TC Manual

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#4729330 - 04/16/18 08:49 PM Re: Octane, Ethanol, and Dilution [Re: Isophix]
PimTac Online   content


Registered: 03/04/17
Posts: 3484
Loc: Soviet State of Washington
Reduce short trips if possible. Is the 90 the highest octane available?

I also short trip the Mazda but I purposely drive the long way when I can. Run the car at highway speeds for 30+ minutes each week if possible. The last thing to do is to keep oci short.
_________________________
2017 Mazda CX-5 Grand Touring

Valvoline Advanced Synthetic 0w20
Mobil 1 M108A EP filter


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#4729361 - 04/16/18 09:05 PM Re: Octane, Ethanol, and Dilution [Re: Isophix]
spasm3 Online   content


Registered: 05/30/10
Posts: 8439
Loc: North Carolina
In your manual, you have the option of 3 oil weights. 5w20, 5w30, and 10w30 all in the chart on page 8-9. Since you smell fuel, and its a DI engine, and the manual allows it, i would run a 5w 30 oil. The fuel is already reducing the viscosity of the 5w20 to even less.

You could get a uoa sample drawn after a typical drive, and send it of to confirm fuel ( i'm going to do this on my mazda). A 5w 30 oil will give you a bit more viscosity if you are getting fuel dilution.


Edited by spasm3 (04/16/18 09:06 PM)
_________________________
13 elantra 67k 5w30 QSUD
03 chevy avalanche76k synpwr 5w30
01 saturnsc1 185k synpwr rebuilt
17 mazda cx-5 2200 miles m1 0w20/0w40 mix

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#4729369 - 04/16/18 09:12 PM Re: Octane, Ethanol, and Dilution [Re: Isophix]
benjy Offline


Registered: 08/23/10
Posts: 744
Loc: pa
being in a warmer area the 10W-30 is a better choice, less viscosity improvers and a better noack, prolly a higher HTHS as well that is seldom shown anymore. noack and hths are important and not easily 'pumped' up by additives that do not last.

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#4729377 - 04/16/18 09:20 PM Re: Octane, Ethanol, and Dilution [Re: Isophix]
BrocLuno Offline


Registered: 09/06/15
Posts: 5235
Loc: Kalifornia Kollective
Unless it is very well known synthetic (Mobil, Motul, etc.) the XW rating mostly tells you what the base oils are. 5W is thinner than 10W in base oils. Then they add VII's to make the op temp (hot) grade numbers.

Fuel dilution thins the base oils badly, so given any choice, always opt for the highest XW grade they will allow. In this case it's 10W-XX.

Don't put expensive oil in there as you'll have to run short oil change intervals. The only effective solution for fuel dilution is change the oil ... Sorry, but it's a fact of some cars life. It used to be bad carburetors, now it DI engines. We're back to 3~5,000 mile oil changes.

Use a good quality oil with chemistry that will reduce intake deposits, but no need for expensive synthetics as you are not going to get their real benefit before the oil has to come out ... frown
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Formerly in marine engineering. In an earlier life I owned my own petroleum tank truck, and hauled for the majors and independent's.

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#4729386 - 04/16/18 09:28 PM Re: Octane, Ethanol, and Dilution [Re: Isophix]
hatt Offline


Registered: 01/03/12
Posts: 4085
Loc: Florida
FYI, not that it has anything to do with your situation. The 90 octane E0 may not be the same brand as the station.
_________________________
2013 F150 5.0, Pennzoil Ultra 10W-30, Wix
2010 Camry 2.5, GTX 5W-20, Fram Ultra XG9972

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#4729389 - 04/16/18 09:28 PM Re: Octane, Ethanol, and Dilution [Re: BrocLuno]
wemay Offline


Registered: 04/04/12
Posts: 8596
Loc: Southeast Florida
Originally Posted By: BrocLuno


Don't put expensive oil in there as you'll have to run short oil change intervals. The only effective solution for fuel dilution is change the oil ... Sorry, but it's a fact of some cars life. It used to be bad carburetors, now it DI engines. We're back to 3~5,000 mile oil changes.


OCI, OCI, OCI is most important when combating dilution, nothing else.
_________________________
17 Sonata 2.4 |Mobil Super Synthetic 5w20, M1
13 Santa Fe 2.0T |Mobil1 5w30 (d1G2), STP XL

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#4729463 - 04/16/18 11:20 PM Re: Octane, Ethanol, and Dilution [Re: Isophix]
Marco620 Offline


Registered: 02/25/14
Posts: 1964
Loc: Deplorable in KS/ fly over
Just stay with the pure fuel and 5w30 full synthetic oil. Clean throttle body with CRC GDi IVD cleaner. iTs made for DI and has PEA in it every 10k. Use Gumout Regane/Redline Si-1 in conjunction. No Seafoam. No PEA,no good.
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2015 Civic (R18Z1) 150k mi PUP 0w20/Ceratec,HPS SRI Intake,87e0 fuel Borla Exhaust/Tein Suspension
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#4729490 - 04/17/18 12:43 AM Re: Octane, Ethanol, and Dilution [Re: Isophix]
ndfergy Offline


Registered: 03/28/16
Posts: 412
Loc: burlington ,ontario, canada
Go with the octane rating as specified in your owners manual. If it's regular then using a premium will have no benefit. The octane rating is commensurate with your normal combustion chamber temps. Going with a higher octane when not required could lead to more unburned fuel.
_________________________
2015 Toyota Yaris 5spd Manual
Summer: Mobil Super 1000 10w30
Winter: Mobil Super 1000 5w30
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#4729510 - 04/17/18 02:02 AM Re: Octane, Ethanol, and Dilution [Re: wemay]
ZeeOSix Offline


Registered: 07/22/10
Posts: 17213
Loc: PNW
Originally Posted By: wemay
OCI, OCI, OCI is most important when combating dilution, nothing else.


What's the typical OCI called out by manufacturers for their DI engines? If fuel dilution is a major concern I'd think the OCI would be less than a typical non-DI vehicle calls out.
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#4729520 - 04/17/18 03:18 AM Re: Octane, Ethanol, and Dilution [Re: ZeeOSix]
wemay Offline


Registered: 04/04/12
Posts: 8596
Loc: Southeast Florida
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: wemay
OCI, OCI, OCI is most important when combating dilution, nothing else.


What's the typical OCI called out by manufacturers for their DI engines? If fuel dilution is a major concern I'd think the OCI would be less than a typical non-DI vehicle calls out.


My normally aspirated GDi?
Normal: 7500 /12 months
Severe: 3750 /6 months*

The turbo GDi?
Normal: 5000 /6months
Severe: 3000 /same*

*me
_________________________
17 Sonata 2.4 |Mobil Super Synthetic 5w20, M1
13 Santa Fe 2.0T |Mobil1 5w30 (d1G2), STP XL

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#4729583 - 04/17/18 06:55 AM Re: Octane, Ethanol, and Dilution [Re: Isophix]
SubieRubyRoo Online   content


Registered: 05/14/12
Posts: 885
Loc: Winchester, Indiana
So wemay, you could say it is the turbo that changes the OCI recommendation, NOT the fact that they are GDI.

Based on many EcoBoost UOAs, I think the whole fuel dilution thing is WAY overblown on here. I can't remember seeing ANY UOA that was truly concerning solely due to excessive fuel. Maybe now that we're moving to ultra-low sulfur fuels it's nowhere near the issue it once may have been? I know gasoline is not a lubricant... but it also has a much, much lower viscosity and therefore would be "pushed away" by the oil?

I'm not saying try to run 20k OCIs on a GDI, but I think a large portion of the witch hunt is just that, until I see horrible UOAs or failed GDI engines that had reasonable UOAs. JMO

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#4729591 - 04/17/18 07:03 AM Re: Octane, Ethanol, and Dilution [Re: Isophix]
Shannow Online   content


Registered: 12/12/02
Posts: 39020
Loc: 'Stralia
Some distillation curves




Premium should have less left in the crankcase both with or without ethanol.

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#4729608 - 04/17/18 07:24 AM Re: Octane, Ethanol, and Dilution [Re: Isophix]
Eddie Offline


Registered: 12/07/03
Posts: 9390
Loc: Florida, Cape Coral
I agree with SUBYRUBYROO THAT fuel dilution in most cases is overblown because, the wear values are usually low or in-line with non DI engines. A teas-spoon of gasoline in a gallon of oil smells like 50% fuel due to the aromatics in gasoline. I guess BITOGers need something to champion. Ed


Edited by Eddie (04/17/18 07:24 AM)
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