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#4669174 - 02/17/18 10:28 PM another example of societal norms ignored
dnewton3 Offline



Registered: 05/14/07
Posts: 7389
Loc: Indianapolis, IN
http://www.foxnews.com/travel/2018/02/15...iral-video.html
If this were an adult, would the aircrew not have refused takeoff until the adult deplaned? Or, if the tantrum didn't start until after take-off, and this were an adult, would not that plane would have either turned around to it's origin, or put down in mid-flight plan, and the person to be arrested?


Irony - see this video where an adult female throws her own tantrum, and is removed from the plane.
http://www.foxnews.com/travel/2018/02/16...rnment-job.html
The irony is two-fold. First, she was removed prior to flight, when the kid in the first example was not. Second, in that she was upset because an infant was crying, and she didn't want to have to listen to it. You can even hear the mom apologize and say the kid won't cry all the time ... as if crying for half the flight is acceptable?


I don't care if it's an adult, a child, a special-needs person, an emotional support peacock, or whatever ... you don't have a "right" to inflict society with your issues. If you cannot conform to the expected norm of the situation, then you don't belong there. Have the decency to recognize that your burden should not become everyone's burden.


NOTE: I am delineating the behaviors here, not "disabilities". If you need me to further explain, I will. But I'd like to think that you understand the distinction I make.
_________________________
The act of preventative maintenance, in and of itself, is FAR MORE important than brand/grade/base choices among lubes and filters.
- under maintaining something is akin to abuse/neglect; that can kill equipment by shortening the lifespan
- over maintaining something has never been proven to be anything but a waste of time and money

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#4669181 - 02/17/18 10:32 PM Re: another example of societal norms ignored [Re: dnewton3]
Nick1994 Offline


Registered: 02/19/13
Posts: 10097
Loc: Phoenix, AZ
I saw that the other day. It really was like she was performing an exorcism.
_________________________
2015 Hyundai Sonata 2.4L 79k PU 5w30 & OEM
2000 Toyota Camry 2.2L 228k M1 AFE 0w30 & Wix
1996 Jeep Cherokee 4.0L 146k M1 HM 10w40 & Fram Ultra

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#4669187 - 02/17/18 10:36 PM Re: another example of societal norms ignored [Re: dnewton3]
CharlieBauer Offline


Registered: 03/29/16
Posts: 1177
Loc: CA
This is why we don't travel in economy for long haul and why my entire family has noise cancelling headphones.
_________________________
It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that ain't so.

- mistakenly attributed to Mark Twain

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#4669191 - 02/17/18 10:40 PM Re: another example of societal norms ignored [Re: dnewton3]
demarpaint Offline


Registered: 07/03/05
Posts: 29745
Loc: NY
Originally Posted By: dnewton3
I don't care if it's an adult, a child, a special-needs person, an emotional support peacock, or whatever ... you don't have a "right" to inflict society with your issues. If you cannot conform to the expected norm of the situation, then you don't belong there. Have the decency to recognize that your burden should not become everyone's burden.


NOTE: I am delineating the behaviors here, not "disabilities". If you need me to further explain, I will. But I'd like to think that you understand the distinction I make.

I agree 100%.

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#4669199 - 02/17/18 10:45 PM Re: another example of societal norms ignored [Re: dnewton3]
DoubleWasp Offline


Registered: 05/21/12
Posts: 5236
Loc: Fort Lauderdale, FL
3 year olds get away with a lot of things that grown adults do not.

There is the possibility that it was the child's first flight and that it could not adequately deal with the pressure changes.

The adult woman's mistake was threatening the job of the flight attendant. We can accuse the child of a great many things, but we cannot accuse it of being a total and complete jerk like that woman was. Talk about choosing exactly the wrong words to say.


Edited by wwillson (02/18/18 08:55 AM)
Edit Reason: censor bypass

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#4669200 - 02/17/18 10:46 PM Re: another example of societal norms ignored [Re: dnewton3]
John_K Offline


Registered: 12/08/06
Posts: 2713
Loc: Columbus, Ohio
Where's that Ridalin dispenser when you need it?

I blame the mother, this kid obviously does this on a regular basis.
_________________________
2009 Mercury Grand Marquis, 8 cyl auto, 80xxx miles, PU
2005 Hyundai Sonata, 4 cyl auto, 93xxx miles, Maxlife
Current oil stash: 517 qts.



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#4669204 - 02/17/18 10:52 PM Re: another example of societal norms ignored [Re: dnewton3]
PimTac Online   content


Registered: 03/04/17
Posts: 4246
Loc: Soviet State of Washington
We travel economy often on transpacific flights and noise cancelling headphones are a necessity. Small children cannot help crying if their ears are not clearing. This is not a issue on new aircraft like the Boeing Dreamliner though. The issue lies with parent/s who decide to take their small children and cannot handle them. Imagine having a brat kid kicking your seat back for 12-14 hours. I went through this and finally got up and stared at the kid which got him to stop for a while at least. This also applies to grown men and women who seemed to have stopped maturing around age 14 and still act like brats.

Respect for others, manners, consideration, a lot of human values are not being taught.

However I make it a point to thank anyone and commend them if their child has acted well on these long flights.
_________________________
2017 Mazda CX-5 Grand Touring

Valvoline Advanced Synthetic 0w20
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#4669212 - 02/17/18 11:05 PM Re: another example of societal norms ignored [Re: dnewton3]
aquariuscsm Online   content


Registered: 12/30/06
Posts: 18151
Loc: Dallas,Tx USA
I have one word for that rugrat,DISCIPLINE!
_________________________
1996 Nissan 300ZX 5-speed,Arctic Pearl(#175 of 300)
Quaker State Ultimate Durability 10W30
2012 Honda Accord Coupe EX-L 2.4,auto,San Marino Red
Pennzoil Platinum 0W20



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#4669213 - 02/17/18 11:06 PM Re: another example of societal norms ignored [Re: dnewton3]
Pajero Online   content


Registered: 05/05/12
Posts: 841
Loc: Rio Rancho, NM
Originally Posted By: dnewton3
http://www.foxnews.com/travel/2018/02/15...iral-video.html
If this were an adult, would the aircrew not have refused takeoff until the adult deplaned? Or, if the tantrum didn't start until after take-off, and this were an adult, would not that plane would have either turned around to it's origin, or put down in mid-flight plan, and the person to be arrested?


Irony - see this video where an adult female throws her own tantrum, and is removed from the plane.
http://www.foxnews.com/travel/2018/02/16...rnment-job.html
The irony is two-fold. First, she was removed prior to flight, when the kid in the first example was not. Second, in that she was upset because an infant was crying, and she didn't want to have to listen to it. You can even hear the mom apologize and say the kid won't cry all the time ... as if crying for half the flight is acceptable?


I don't care if it's an adult, a child, a special-needs person, an emotional support peacock, or whatever ... you don't have a "right" to inflict society with your issues. If you cannot conform to the expected norm of the situation, then you don't belong there. Have the decency to recognize that your burden should not become everyone's burden.


NOTE: I am delineating the behaviors here, not "disabilities". If you need me to further explain, I will. But I'd like to think that you understand the distinction I make.



I echo your sentiment!


Respectfully,

Pajero!
_________________________
Always remember "Planned obsolescence."

1994 Montero SR 3.5 DOHC, 133,xxx
Fram Ultra/ Snorkel with Pre-filter
K-9-Co-pilot

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#4669219 - 02/17/18 11:25 PM Re: another example of societal norms ignored [Re: DoubleWasp]
dnewton3 Offline



Registered: 05/14/07
Posts: 7389
Loc: Indianapolis, IN
Originally Posted By: DoubleWasp
3 year olds get away with a lot of things that grown adults do not.

There is the possibility that it was the child's first flight and that it could not adequately deal with the pressure changes.



Somewhat true; kids do get away with stuff. And if this were in a Chuckee-Cheese eatery, I'd not even bring it up. But this is a close-quarter flight that lasted EIGHT hours! The point is that kids should NOT be excused for acting in an inappropriate manner. And if they cannot behave adequately, they should be removed from the situation. In the absence of good parenting, the flight crew should have dealt with this before take off. And this DID START prior to take off. Which means this wasn't a "pressure" adjustment issue at all. Whatever the cause, it's not acceptable. I don't care if it's his first flight or 20th. Is he "normal" or special needs? Doesn't matter. The BEHAVIOR is unacceptable for the situation. What the mom tolerates in her own home is her business. But once she takes that kid into the alumi-tube, it becomes everyone's problem.


This was an 8 hour flight, not some puddle hop that lasts 45 minutes. His tantrum lasted on/off for HOURS.
Perhaps the kid didn't know any better, but the mom should and the flight crew did.
The mom should have offered to deplane prior to the flight; the red flags were already there for everyone to see.
The flight crew should have demanded they deplane.


I've said it before and I'll say it again; know your audience and know your surroundings. If you or someone in your charge cannot work within the societal norm of the situation, then it's YOUR responsibility to adapt by leaving, not other's obligation to endure.
_________________________
The act of preventative maintenance, in and of itself, is FAR MORE important than brand/grade/base choices among lubes and filters.
- under maintaining something is akin to abuse/neglect; that can kill equipment by shortening the lifespan
- over maintaining something has never been proven to be anything but a waste of time and money

Top
#4669242 - 02/18/18 12:42 AM Re: another example of societal norms ignored [Re: dnewton3]
daves87rs Offline


Registered: 02/23/09
Posts: 16963
Loc: Michigan
Still crazy...not sure why someone would take a young child on a flight that long not prepared at least..
_________________________
Coming together is a beginning; keeping together is progress; working together is success.

Henry Ford

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#4669249 - 02/18/18 01:36 AM Re: another example of societal norms ignored [Re: dnewton3]
DoubleWasp Offline


Registered: 05/21/12
Posts: 5236
Loc: Fort Lauderdale, FL
Originally Posted By: dnewton3
Originally Posted By: DoubleWasp
3 year olds get away with a lot of things that grown adults do not.

There is the possibility that it was the child's first flight and that it could not adequately deal with the pressure changes.



Somewhat true; kids do get away with stuff. And if this were in a Chuckee-Cheese eatery, I'd not even bring it up. But this is a close-quarter flight that lasted EIGHT hours! The point is that kids should NOT be excused for acting in an inappropriate manner. And if they cannot behave adequately, they should be removed from the situation. In the absence of good parenting, the flight crew should have dealt with this before take off. And this DID START prior to take off. Which means this wasn't a "pressure" adjustment issue at all. Whatever the cause, it's not acceptable. I don't care if it's his first flight or 20th. Is he "normal" or special needs? Doesn't matter. The BEHAVIOR is unacceptable for the situation. What the mom tolerates in her own home is her business. But once she takes that kid into the alumi-tube, it becomes everyone's problem.


This was an 8 hour flight, not some puddle hop that lasts 45 minutes. His tantrum lasted on/off for HOURS.
Perhaps the kid didn't know any better, but the mom should and the flight crew did.
The mom should have offered to deplane prior to the flight; the red flags were already there for everyone to see.
The flight crew should have demanded they deplane.


I've said it before and I'll say it again; know your audience and know your surroundings. If you or someone in your charge cannot work within the societal norm of the situation, then it's YOUR responsibility to adapt by leaving, not other's obligation to endure.


Before the flight?

1. Eject parents for failure to control the child.
2. Diplomatically eject the child as being too young to be an unaccompanied minor (since the parents were tossed).

That truly is 100% unacceptable. Shame on them for allowing this to go on.

A 3-year old can't help but be a 3-year old, but the parents duty was to control the child, or remove themselves from the plane.
_________________________
07 Lincoln Navigator M1 0w-40/FU
68 Charger R/T / Supercharged 440 VR1/DBL7349
07 Ram 3500 4x4 / Cummins 6.7 /DBL7349
17 Maserati GranTurismo Cabrio

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#4669290 - 02/18/18 05:59 AM Re: another example of societal norms ignored [Re: dnewton3]
Smoky14 Offline


Registered: 04/23/03
Posts: 1337
Loc: Nowhere NM
"Social Norms" no longer seem to count, today it is make your own norms and let others suffer. In the past I enjoyed air travel, since 911 I have flown once...never again.
Smoky
_________________________
99 Acura 2.3CL 5speed MT
12 Ford Fusion 2.5S 6speed MT
05 Suzuki Bandit 1200.

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#4669306 - 02/18/18 06:40 AM Re: another example of societal norms ignored [Re: dnewton3]
JeepWJ19 Offline


Registered: 09/09/15
Posts: 932
Loc: PENNSYLVANIA
Little kid + crying = the two most annoying things.

Makes me want to gouge my eyes out with rusty spoons.
_________________________
2002 Jeep WJ 4.0 | Mobil 1 HM 5w30 |
TG8A | 2.5" lift | 148k miles

Software Engineer :]

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#4669324 - 02/18/18 07:25 AM Re: another example of societal norms ignored [Re: dnewton3]
Mr Nice Offline


Registered: 09/12/04
Posts: 21182
Loc: Orlando, FL
Just spank that brat, problem solved.

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