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#4630866 - 01/10/18 08:01 PM Hyundai/Kia Theta II oil pump?
Alex_V Offline


Registered: 04/10/16
Posts: 1155
Loc: Campbellsville, KY
I have a '11 Kia Sportage in the shop with barely any oil pressure; 182K, Theta II 2.4L MPI engine if my research is right. It came in because the owner was complaining of a noise that, by his description, I thought was going to be a bad belt tensioner, but I've not gotten it to make any noise since I've had it; however, the low oil light would come on after running just a couple minutes, afterward coming on any time the engine dropped to at or near idle. Only DTC was P0014 "Camshaft B timing over-advanced" - I figure this is a result of the low oil pressure. Hooked up a manual gauge at the low press. sensor fitting and it read 2-3 PSI on cold start. Replaced oil filter (Napa Gold both times), no change. I've done the last two OC's with Maxlife in decent proximity to one another - currently the oil looks fairly clean and right at the full mark. Next step, check the pickup screen - pulled the pan and it's clean. No debris in the pan but there's plenty of varnish on the pump and bottom of the bed plate.

My plan was to inspect (in order) the pickup screen, bypass valve, then the pump itself. The drive chain off the crank is intact and appears fine.

I can't find any information on how the pump is designed or where the relief valve is - anybody here with some pointers? It's part of the "balance shaft module" and it's not as simple as a couple bolts to pop it off so if the relief valve can be inspected without removing that assembly that would be preferable.

FYI, the engine still sounds and runs fine so I believe it's still solid and finding/fixing the oil pressure problem will yield a good repair.
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#4630871 - 01/10/18 08:09 PM Re: Hyundai/Kia Theta II oil pump? [Re: Alex_V]
spasm3 Online   content


Registered: 05/30/10
Posts: 8642
Loc: North Carolina
Worn main bearings can also cause low oil pressure. 2-3 psi cold is really low.

Here is a part and basic diagram This is for a 2.0 , i'm looking for a 2.4


https://www.wholesalekiaparts.com/oem-pa...AiABEgIww_D_BwE



Edited by spasm3 (01/10/18 08:16 PM)
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#4630883 - 01/10/18 08:25 PM Re: Hyundai/Kia Theta II oil pump? [Re: Alex_V]
spasm3 Online   content


Registered: 05/30/10
Posts: 8642
Loc: North Carolina
I found this on ebay, but i can't cross reference the numbers to factory numbers.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Genuine-OEM-PUMP-ASSY-OIL-For-Tucson-10-13-Sportage-10-13-213102F301/152794984505?fits=Year%3A2011%7CMake%3AKia%7CModel%3ASportage&hash=item23934a7039:g:0gEAAOSwPDBaEXfT
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#4630891 - 01/10/18 08:34 PM Re: Hyundai/Kia Theta II oil pump? [Re: Alex_V]
dishdude Offline


Registered: 11/14/08
Posts: 8730
Loc: Phoenix
Probably the main bearings, at 182k I'd quote a short block or used motor. Chances of it being the oil pump are near zero.
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#4630906 - 01/10/18 08:47 PM Re: Hyundai/Kia Theta II oil pump? [Re: Alex_V]
Alex_V Offline


Registered: 04/10/16
Posts: 1155
Loc: Campbellsville, KY
Hmmmm... duly noted. So it's possible the mains could be too loose to hold oil pressure but still not make any noise?

Thanks for the links, but neither of them are for the assembly this engine uses. This is what I'm trying to find a blowup or repair info for:
https://www.ebay.com/i/132194809781?chn=ps
_________________________
I like Chevy and Valvoline.

'13 Cruze, 1.4T, 112K
'85 GMC C3500, 454, 130K
'82 Mercedes 300CD, OM617 turbo, 167K
'67 Suburban, 350, 331K

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#4630909 - 01/10/18 08:50 PM Re: Hyundai/Kia Theta II oil pump? [Re: Alex_V]
spasm3 Online   content


Registered: 05/30/10
Posts: 8642
Loc: North Carolina
Originally Posted By: Alex_V
Hmmmm... duly noted. So it's possible the mains could be too loose to hold oil pressure but still not make any noise?




Yes and very likely.


Edited by spasm3 (01/10/18 08:52 PM)
_________________________
13 elantra 68k 5w30 QSUD
03 chevy avalanche76k synpwr 10w30
01 saturnsc1 185k synpwr rebuilt
17 mazda cx-5 3900 miles m1 0w20/0w40 mix

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#4630966 - 01/10/18 10:13 PM Re: Hyundai/Kia Theta II oil pump? [Re: Alex_V]
michaelluscher Offline


Registered: 10/07/12
Posts: 2419
Loc: Staten Island, NY
That 2.4 is covered in the fustercluck that is the Hyundai/Kia engine recall

I'd give it a fresh oil change, and limp it into the nearest Kia dealer to get on the waiting list for a new engine

Even though it's past the 15y/150k cut off, they've been good willing them left right and center for the sake of customer satisfaction
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#4631287 - 01/11/18 10:28 AM Re: Hyundai/Kia Theta II oil pump? [Re: michaelluscher]
pbm Offline


Registered: 04/19/04
Posts: 7597
Loc: New York
Originally Posted By: michaelluscher
That 2.4 is covered in the fustercluck that is the Hyundai/Kia engine recall

I'd give it a fresh oil change, and limp it into the nearest Kia dealer to get on the waiting list for a new engine

Even though it's past the 15y/150k cut off, they've been good willing them left right and center for the sake of customer satisfaction



If Hyundai/Kia goodwilled an engine on a vehicle with 182K I'd be very impressed....I just don't see it happening.
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#4631297 - 01/11/18 10:38 AM Re: Hyundai/Kia Theta II oil pump? [Re: Alex_V]
MParr Offline


Registered: 10/28/17
Posts: 513
Loc: Georgia
This particular vehicle may fall within the engine recall.
https://www.kia.com/us/en/content/owners/safety-recall
https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/rcl/2017/RMISC-17V224-9711.pdf
This vehicle may be well out of range of the recall. My suggestion is to put on an OE oil filter and drive the xxxx out of it until it blows. Then, put it on a rollback and haul it to the nearest dealership.
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#4631799 - 01/11/18 07:20 PM Re: Hyundai/Kia Theta II oil pump? [Re: pbm]
michaelluscher Offline


Registered: 10/07/12
Posts: 2419
Loc: Staten Island, NY
Originally Posted By: pbm
Originally Posted By: michaelluscher
That 2.4 is covered in the fustercluck that is the Hyundai/Kia engine recall

I'd give it a fresh oil change, and limp it into the nearest Kia dealer to get on the waiting list for a new engine

Even though it's past the 15y/150k cut off, they've been good willing them left right and center for the sake of customer satisfaction



If Hyundai/Kia goodwilled an engine on a vehicle with 182K I'd be very impressed....I just don't see it happening.


Search around, I heard of them putting a long block in a 400k '11 Sonata, didn't even flinch

TBF, these engines pop like popcorn, they should learn from there mistakes
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'13 Chrysler 300 3.6 Pentastar 230k

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#4631938 - 01/11/18 09:54 PM Re: Hyundai/Kia Theta II oil pump? [Re: Alex_V]
Scdevon Offline


Registered: 09/07/09
Posts: 325
Loc: Rockies
Pretty sure this was one of the engines that they installed the rod bearings backwards in. Can't remember anything being said about the mains, but if it's anything to do with the bottom end on that engine at all, I'd run it by a dealer. There might be a new engine or at least a short block in your near future and I doubt they're going to quibble about mileage. This is a PR nightmare for them.


Edited by Scdevon (01/11/18 09:58 PM)
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#4631975 - 01/11/18 10:31 PM Re: Hyundai/Kia Theta II oil pump? [Re: Alex_V]
Alex_V Offline


Registered: 04/10/16
Posts: 1155
Loc: Campbellsville, KY
I put it back together today and advised the owner of the situation, and that he take it to a dealer to see about an engine. It's in generally good shape but the tranny is making a little noise - so IMHO anything more than a free engine relegates it to selling as-is. (Doesn't make sense to spend the money on a reman engine and leave the noisy transmission, but to buy/install both would cost more than it's worth.) With VML 10w40 in it the oil pressure jumped to about 12 on startup, but crept back down to 3-4 pounds. After running 4-5 minutes I observed pressure increase and it was pretty linear up to about 50 PSI at 3,000 RPM but the low pressure light still came on at idle.

If the dealer won't do anything for him I honestly think he should run it until it gets noisy then cut his losses - maybe 2 weeks, maybe 6 months?

Is having an OEM filter on it really going to make a diference at the dealer, vs. a Napa Gold?


Edited by Alex_V (01/11/18 10:33 PM)
_________________________
I like Chevy and Valvoline.

'13 Cruze, 1.4T, 112K
'85 GMC C3500, 454, 130K
'82 Mercedes 300CD, OM617 turbo, 167K
'67 Suburban, 350, 331K

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#4631986 - 01/11/18 10:45 PM Re: Hyundai/Kia Theta II oil pump? [Re: Alex_V]
HoosierJeeper Offline


Registered: 11/23/16
Posts: 1276
Loc: WI
In my inexperienced opinion, an OEM filter is hope against hope. Napa Gold is about as good as it gets.

I think he should try for a new engine under warranty, and if that works, get it back and sell it. If he can't get a new engine now, sell it now while it drives normally. Unless he's deeply in love with it.
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#4632106 - 01/12/18 05:12 AM Re: Hyundai/Kia Theta II oil pump? [Re: Alex_V]
pezzy669 Offline


Registered: 03/27/04
Posts: 211
Loc: Atlanta, GA
Did this affect the 1st gen 2.4 as well? Read about this the other day and thought to myself I have not seen an 5th gen '06-10 Sonata in quite some time so I have kept my eyes peeled on my daily 30 minute commute, I have seen exactly 1 5th gen Sonata over the past 3-4 days. Mind you I have probably seen 25-30 97-02 Camry's and way more '02-'XX Camry's than I can count over the same time frame.

10/100k warranty - seems like the cars are just thrown straight in the garbage, even after the Phoenix rising rebirth of Hyundai/Kia that started around '05. Looking at it how many of the 2 gens ago bubble ('07-10) Elantras do you see out in the wild, I can probably count on one hand how many I have seen in the last 3 months.

Mind you I get them all the time as rental cars and while they are nothing spectacular they seem well built and they perform adequately in rental duty (Sonata 2.4 HWY mileage is WAY overstated), never imagined them being junkyard ready at such low miles.
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#4632180 - 01/12/18 07:47 AM Re: Hyundai/Kia Theta II oil pump? [Re: Alex_V]
Alex_V Offline


Registered: 04/10/16
Posts: 1155
Loc: Campbellsville, KY
In good concience I can't advise him to sell it as a supposedly solid car (for a solid-car price) when the engine may come to a literal grinding hault at any time.

From the skimming I did online about these engines and their problems, it seems to me the problem wasn't just "mfg. process error" in not properly cleaning and finishing the rotating assembly - the nature of the failures (and that it seems it takes most of them quite a while to fail) would suggest it's a fundamental shortcoming in design or metallurgy. I've heard Kia dealer ads on the radio for years, raving about their incentives and "best trade-in offers" - to me that ads up to them being able to net less per car, which means less of something, somewhere in the vehicle. Design? Parts quality? Kia and Hyundai may get good reviews and be nice when new, but I've yet to come across information that changes my mind about what's really under their skin.
_________________________
I like Chevy and Valvoline.

'13 Cruze, 1.4T, 112K
'85 GMC C3500, 454, 130K
'82 Mercedes 300CD, OM617 turbo, 167K
'67 Suburban, 350, 331K

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