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Wrong Oil Filter #4453502
07/08/17 02:44 PM
07/08/17 02:44 PM
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 502
Tennessee
C4Dave Offline OP
C4Dave  Offline OP
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 502
Tennessee
I recently purchased a 2002 Ford Expedition with the 4.6 V-8. Changed the oil and filter today and discovered that the old filter was significantly smaller than the new filter. The old filter had been in place for 5000 miles.

Went to Fram's website and compared the specs. The small filter is rated at 10-12 gpm flow and relief valve setting of 9-12 psi. The correct filter was rated at 11-13 gpm and relief of 12 psi.

Thread size was identical and gasket size was within about 1 mm. The small filter was not leaking when removed.

The new filter is speced for many GM and Dodge vehicles, among others. Some of the models include the GM 5.3 and Dodge 5.7 V-8's.

Being smaller, it was certainly easier to remove. With the large filter the front wheels have to be turned to clear the pitman arm.

Any reason I shouldn't use the smaller filter going forward?

Re: Wrong Oil Filter [Re: C4Dave] #4453515
07/08/17 02:57 PM
07/08/17 02:57 PM
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 20,743
Upstate NY
Donald Offline
Donald  Offline
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 20,743
Upstate NY
I would use the recommended filter big or small. Probably would not matter but I like to use the proper part.


2015 Subaru Forester 2.5 engine/CVT
2015 Ford F250 w/Powerstroke
2016 Subaru Crosstrek CVT (wife's)
Re: Wrong Oil Filter [Re: Donald] #4453530
07/08/17 03:12 PM
07/08/17 03:12 PM
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 5,648
Champlain/Hudson Valley
Kira Offline
Kira  Offline
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 5,648
Champlain/Hudson Valley
+1 on the proper part. Motorcraft FL820S, no?.

Look up what WIX and Hastings have listed for that application.

Re: Wrong Oil Filter [Re: C4Dave] #4453543
07/08/17 03:26 PM
07/08/17 03:26 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 4,219
Port Orange, Florida
Panzerman Offline
Panzerman  Offline
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 4,219
Port Orange, Florida
What you were seeing is the new Ford filter alot of oil change places are using. I think it's the FL500 filter.
It's sort of a one filter fits all Fords so it cuts on inventory. Being that I had alot of 4.6 L Fords. The 820S is the correct filter but the new smaller filter will suffice. I found out about all this when I bought my Ford F150 with the 5.4 L engine and found the small filter and was exactly like you [censored]. I researched it and it's what I found out.



2006 Dodge Ram 2500 Hemi 4x4
2016 Dodge Challenger Scat Pack
Re: Wrong Oil Filter [Re: C4Dave] #4453547
07/08/17 03:32 PM
07/08/17 03:32 PM
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 9,794
Florida, Cape Coral
Eddie Offline
Eddie  Offline
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 9,794
Florida, Cape Coral
I am also of the opinion that one should used the recommended filter. Ed


CX5 Touring 2.5L :-)
Re: Wrong Oil Filter [Re: C4Dave] #4453555
07/08/17 03:42 PM
07/08/17 03:42 PM
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 502
Tennessee
C4Dave Offline OP
C4Dave  Offline OP
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 502
Tennessee
On Fram's site, it doesn't list any Ford applications for the small filter. Part # is PH10060. Mostly GM, Chrysler/Dodge/Jeep, and several other makes. But no Ford's, not that it really matters.

Last edited by C4Dave; 07/08/17 03:47 PM.
Re: Wrong Oil Filter [Re: C4Dave] #4453558
07/08/17 03:50 PM
07/08/17 03:50 PM
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 11,316
Santa Barbara, CA
bdcardinal Offline
bdcardinal  Offline
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 11,316
Santa Barbara, CA
FL-820S is the filter you should be using. A lot of quick lubes use the equivalent of the FL-500S. FWIW we have had a couple engines go south that had the wrong filter installed by a quick lube and the quick lube ended up paying for it. Ford's opinion was the wrong filter was installed regardless of what their interchange said.


2014 Ford Mustang GT Track Pack
1995 Ford Mustang GT

Ford/Mazda Parts Counter
NRA Benefactor Member
Opinions expressed are my own.
Re: Wrong Oil Filter [Re: C4Dave] #4453621
07/08/17 05:27 PM
07/08/17 05:27 PM
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 6,226
Waco, TX
Linctex Offline
Linctex  Offline
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 6,226
Waco, TX
The "FL-500" size filter you took off (Fram TG and XG 10575) will eventually phase out the FL-820 size filter (Fram TG2 and XG2)

You have nothing to worry about.
The smaller filter is used on the Coyote engines in the Mustangs - your engine puts out maybe 1/3 the HP theirs do!

Here's a TG10575 (the small one you have nothing to worry about) that was run for 15,000 miles:
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/4426839/

Last edited by Linctex; 07/08/17 05:28 PM. Reason: darn typos

"The evidence demands a verdict".
(Re:VOA)"it's nearly impossible to actually know the particular additives that are in there at what concentrations."
Re: Wrong Oil Filter [Re: C4Dave] #4453671
07/08/17 06:27 PM
07/08/17 06:27 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 4,219
Port Orange, Florida
Panzerman Offline
Panzerman  Offline
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 4,219
Port Orange, Florida
I don't think they will phase out the XG2/820s type filters because now that Dodge switched to metric threads that's also the same filter for thier Hemi line of motors.



2006 Dodge Ram 2500 Hemi 4x4
2016 Dodge Challenger Scat Pack
Re: Wrong Oil Filter [Re: C4Dave] #4453674
07/08/17 06:29 PM
07/08/17 06:29 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 4,219
Port Orange, Florida
Panzerman Offline
Panzerman  Offline
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 4,219
Port Orange, Florida
I have a company truck with the 4.6 motor and have to get the oil changed at Firestone and it's the small filter in it. 230,000 miles and still going but also a reason I like changing my own oil too.



2006 Dodge Ram 2500 Hemi 4x4
2016 Dodge Challenger Scat Pack
Re: Wrong Oil Filter [Re: C4Dave] #4453791
07/08/17 08:46 PM
07/08/17 08:46 PM
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 1,378
Houston, Texas
WellOiled Offline
WellOiled  Offline
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 1,378
Houston, Texas
^^^^^^
The last time I used Firestone, they used the wrong viscosity oil. They also used a Firestone TF-4651. It was my first eCore on the Ranger. Firestone did make it right. I don't trust them any more.

The eCore with combo valve loses ADBV function in less than 3000 miles. The Ranger does not seem to care.

I think your 4.6L would do better with an independent ADBV.


2004 Ford Ranger 4.0L V6
Valvoline Advanced Full Synthetic 5W30 + Fram Tough Guard
Re: Wrong Oil Filter [Re: C4Dave] #4453830
07/08/17 09:40 PM
07/08/17 09:40 PM
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 682
il usa
merconvvv Offline
merconvvv  Offline
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 682
il usa
Buy some fl 820s at walmart and carry them in the vehicle.
Thats what i do. They are a bargain. Pain to get on off sometimes.
Smaller one probably a lot easier.


1988 Mazda RX7 na PP 10w30 Noack 4.7
1994 Chrysler Concorde 3.3
1999 Ford Expedition 4.6 QSUD 10W30 NOACK 5.0
Re: Wrong Oil Filter [Re: Panzerman] #4453884
07/08/17 10:46 PM
07/08/17 10:46 PM
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 2,490
DELAWARE
Hootbro Offline
Hootbro  Offline
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 2,490
DELAWARE
Originally Posted By: Panzerman
I don't think they will phase out the XG2/820s type filters because now that Dodge switched to metric threads that's also the same filter for thier Hemi line of motors.


All the Hemi 5.7 and 6.4's with the exception of a few SRT engines, have gone over to a smaller FRAM PH10060 size equivalent filter. FL820 may fit and is what I ran in my 2015 RAM, but it is not cataloged for FCA Hemi engines.


2018 RAM 2500 Cummins 6.7L (Factory Fill 5W-40)
2017 Jeep Renegade 2.4L (Idemitsu 0W-20)

Re: Wrong Oil Filter [Re: C4Dave] #4453930
07/08/17 11:59 PM
07/08/17 11:59 PM
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 2,408
San Antonio, TX
Nyogtha Offline
Nyogtha  Offline
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 2,408
San Antonio, TX
Only true for 2013 and later MY Ram Hemi with electric power steering. My 2012 MY Ram Hemi and earlier years not spec'd for the MO-090 (PH16 equivalent) are spec'd for MO -899 (PH2 equivalent) I think it was 2009 MY the switch from SAE thread to metric thread began.

Last edited by Nyogtha; 07/08/17 11:59 PM.

"No matter how paranoid you are you're not paranoid enough. Tell the truth. Reach as many people as you can with it. That's your weapon." - Susanne Modeski, aka "Holly" to The Lone Gunmen
Re: Wrong Oil Filter [Re: Nyogtha] #4453936
07/09/17 12:16 AM
07/09/17 12:16 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 408
PA
dnastrau Offline
dnastrau  Offline
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 408
PA
Originally Posted By: Nyogtha
Only true for 2013 and later MY Ram Hemi with electric power steering. My 2012 MY Ram Hemi and earlier years not spec'd for the MO-090 (PH16 equivalent) are spec'd for MO -899 (PH2 equivalent) I think it was 2009 MY the switch from SAE thread to metric thread began.


Our '08 Jeep Commander 4.7 has the metric threads so it takes the MO-899 and equivalents (FL820S, PH2, etc.) The owner's manual states that as well. Maybe '08 was a transition year as I have seen application listings showing both the SAE and metric threaded filters for '08 on the 4.7 and 5.7.

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