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Here's the truth about the difference between the AC PF 58 and PF 59 #311127
12/01/02 06:26 PM
12/01/02 06:26 PM
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 666
Triad, NC
Alex D Offline OP
Alex D  Offline OP
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 666
Triad, NC
I e-mailed AC Delco and here is their response:
-----------------------------------------------

Thank you for writing ACDelco.

The PF59 is the same as the PF58 except that it has an antidrainback valve.
The antidrainback valve keeps a slight amount of oil in the engine for
start up. We recommend asking for the PF59. No other manufacturer has a
PF59. They have a version of the PF58, and may cross reference that as
'close enough.' The PF59 is relatively new and because the Silverado and
Sierra were the only vehicles that originally called for this filter, you
may have a bit of difficulty finding one. If you are unable to find a PF59
at your local ACDelco facility, a GM Dealer can always order one for you.

Thank you for your interest in ACDelco.
ACDelco Customer Assistance


Subject: ACD - ACDelco - Other Suggestions
11/30/2002 06:07
PM

Re: Here's the truth about the difference between the AC PF 58 and PF 59 #311128
12/01/02 06:48 PM
12/01/02 06:48 PM
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 666
Triad, NC
Alex D Offline OP
Alex D  Offline OP
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 666
Triad, NC
If I had a lathe, I'd be cutting oneof each of these babies open.............I don't have one though........is there someone here who can do this for us ???

I also wrote back to them asking if we can replace the PF 44 with the PF 59 instead the PF58 like I have done in the past......let's see what they say...

Re: Here's the truth about the difference between the AC PF 58 and PF 59 #311129
12/01/02 09:39 PM
12/01/02 09:39 PM
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 229
Louisville, KY
RobZ71LM7 Offline
RobZ71LM7  Offline
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 229
Louisville, KY
FYI: Silverado's/Sierra's originally came from the factory with PF58's but a TSB came out that stated to switch them to PF59's because of excessive valvetrain noise at startup.

Re: Here's the truth about the difference between the AC PF 58 and PF 59 #311130
12/01/02 09:52 PM
12/01/02 09:52 PM
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 666
Triad, NC
Alex D Offline OP
Alex D  Offline OP
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 666
Triad, NC
In all of this I still wonder why GM doesn't just discontinue the PF58...... [I dont know]
quote:
Originally posted by RobZ71LM7:
FYI: Silverado's/Sierra's originally came from the factory with PF58's but a TSB came out that stated to switch them to PF59's because of excessive valvetrain noise at startup.


Re: Here's the truth about the difference between the AC PF 58 and PF 59 #311131
12/01/02 10:43 PM
12/01/02 10:43 PM
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 901
Northern Illinois
dickwells Offline
dickwells  Offline
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 901
Northern Illinois
Somewhere I recently read that the PF58 is required for some kind of Cadillac.

Re: Here's the truth about the difference between the AC PF 58 and PF 59 #311132
12/01/02 11:32 PM
12/01/02 11:32 PM
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 229
Louisville, KY
RobZ71LM7 Offline
RobZ71LM7  Offline
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 229
Louisville, KY
quote:
Originally posted by dickwells:
Somewhere I recently read that the PF58 is required for some kind of Cadillac.

My aunt's '86 Eldorado has a 4.1L V8 which takes PF58's.

Re: Here's the truth about the difference between the AC PF 58 and PF 59 #311133
12/01/02 11:45 PM
12/01/02 11:45 PM
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 3,013
USA-Michigan
Mike_dup1 Offline
Mike_dup1  Offline
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 3,013
USA-Michigan
I don't think they came with the PF58 but the Owners manual etc listed it as the filter to use. I had a 1999 and mine came with a PF59. There was a loose page in my owners manaul that told of the misprint. Mine was an early build 1999, it was built in August of 1998 in Oshawa. At the time the new 1999 models came out only 2 plants were building them, Oshawas and Pontiac East.

Sorry if these take long to load, I am on Cable so its only a second or two for me.
PF58.........PF59........Fram Equal to PF59..
 -
..
 -

Notice the Fram is smaller? The center hole goes all the way thru compared to AC which is only open on the inlet end. It uses that metal plate to block the hole.
 -

[ December 04, 2002, 06:08 PM: Message edited by: Mike ]

Re: Here's the truth about the difference between the AC PF 58 and PF 59 #311134
12/02/02 12:42 AM
12/02/02 12:42 AM
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 666
Triad, NC
Alex D Offline OP
Alex D  Offline OP
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 666
Triad, NC
Yeah...the PF 58 basically is a filter for early 80s to early 90s Cadillac/Chevrolet/Pontiac with the Cad V8 and some of the other small V8 such as the 307. it's an old filter design if it hasn't changed since then. maybe they are not even making them anymore, just selling off the stock.
quote:
Originally posted by dickwells:
Somewhere I recently read that the PF58 is required for some kind of Cadillac.


Re: Here's the truth about the difference between the AC PF 58 and PF 59 #311135
12/02/02 02:14 AM
12/02/02 02:14 AM
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 11,410
The Sandhills of NewYorkistan
GROUCHO MARX Offline
GROUCHO MARX  Offline
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 11,410
The Sandhills of NewYorkistan
That's a fine look at a cardboard endcap, no? There also appears to be more pleats in the Fram. Are my eyes playing tricks on me?

Re: Here's the truth about the difference between the AC PF 58 and PF 59 #311136
12/02/02 03:51 AM
12/02/02 03:51 AM
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 666
Triad, NC
Alex D Offline OP
Alex D  Offline OP
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 666
Triad, NC
Thank you Mike for opening these filters !! We owe you one! Looks like the PF59 has a bigger anti drain back valve than the PF58. Guess we should all move onto the PF59.....

Re: Here's the truth about the difference between the AC PF 58 and PF 59 #311137
12/02/02 08:28 AM
12/02/02 08:28 AM
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 258
IL
eldawg4100 Offline
eldawg4100  Offline
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 258
IL
the local book at my autozone has said use the PF58 for all my ex-cadillacs... i had an 85 eldo with 4.1, 89 fleetwood with 4.5 and now my 92 seville with 4.9...

funny, since yesterday was the first day I saw pf-59 at my autzone... still have plenty of PF-58's....

guess its time to move on to the 59? if the drainback valve helps, thats great! maybe a little better protection at start up?

Re: Here's the truth about the difference between the AC PF 58 and PF 59 #311138
12/02/02 06:25 PM
12/02/02 06:25 PM
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 666
Triad, NC
Alex D Offline OP
Alex D  Offline OP
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 666
Triad, NC
I went back to AC Delco after the first message on top of this thread and asked what the longer style replacement for the AC Delco PF44 would be. I told them that in the past I had always used the PF58 and wondered if I should use the PF59 now.
Here is their response:
--------------------------------------------------
Thank you for writing ACDelco.

Unfortunately sir, we can not tell you to use any thing other than stock
applications, but we can tell you that the PF58 and the PF59 is the exact
same filter other than the antidrain back valve. If your vehicle uses the
PF58 then you can interchange and use the PF59.

Thank you for your interest in ACDelco.
ACDelco Customer Assistance

Re: Here's the truth about the difference between the AC PF 58 and PF 59 #311139
12/03/02 08:59 AM
12/03/02 08:59 AM
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 3,013
USA-Michigan
Mike_dup1 Offline
Mike_dup1  Offline
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 3,013
USA-Michigan
Just to clarify the photo above, the rubber for the PF58 is not a valve, just a spacer. It a hard rubber.

The other 2 filters, 59 and the Fram, the rubber is a valve, teh 59 is very soft and the Fram is much harder. It blocks the holes in the filter base preventing flow when engine is not running on the 59 and Fram.

Re: Here's the truth about the difference between the AC PF 58 and PF 59 #311140
12/03/02 03:27 AM
12/03/02 03:27 AM
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 11
Derby, KS (Wichita)
DoctorZ Offline
DoctorZ  Offline
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 11
Derby, KS (Wichita)
quote:
Originally posted by Mike:
Just to clarify the photo above, the rubber for the PF58 is not a valve, just a spacer. It a hard rubber.

The other 2 filters, 59 and the Fram, the rubber is a valve, teh 59 is very soft and the Fram is much harder. It blocks the holes in the filter base preventing flow when engine is not running on the 59 and Fram.

Looking at the rubber valve for the PF59, wouldn't this also cause restriction in the oiling system during normal operation (vs. the PF58)? It would seem that the rubber valve that the oil has to "push out of the way" during normal operation is convoluting the the oil path and would cause a significant restriction to oil flow.

Anyone have any insight into this?

DoctorZ

Re: Here's the truth about the difference between the AC PF 58 and PF 59 #311141
12/03/02 04:27 AM
12/03/02 04:27 AM
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 666
Triad, NC
Alex D Offline OP
Alex D  Offline OP
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 666
Triad, NC
Well I wouldn't be worried about that. The filter receives full pressure from the pump since the oil has to pass the filter before it re-enters the engine. So look at you oil pressure gage.......after passing thru the filter, your engine mostly still has anywhere from 20 to 60 psi available.
quote:
Originally posted by DoctorZ:
quote:
Originally posted by Mike:
Just to clarify the photo above, the rubber for the PF58 is not a valve, just a spacer. It a hard rubber.

The other 2 filters, 59 and the Fram, the rubber is a valve, teh 59 is very soft and the Fram is much harder. It blocks the holes in the filter base preventing flow when engine is not running on the 59 and Fram.

Looking at the rubber valve for the PF59, wouldn't this also cause restriction in the oiling system during normal operation (vs. the PF58)? It would seem that the rubber valve that the oil has to "push out of the way" during normal operation is convoluting the the oil path and would cause a significant restriction to oil flow.

Anyone have any insight into this?

DoctorZ


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