Why does Rotella T6 cost less than others?

[dave1251]

Originally Posted By: skellyman
Originally Posted By: dave1251
Originally Posted By: Garak
Originally Posted By: dave1251
How did you come up with the Data to quantify this statement?


Believe it or not, in some ways he's right. But, that depends upon what one is comparing it to. If one compares it to Delvac 1 5w-40, the Delvac is more expensive, much harder to find, at least seems to be Group IV based, and might have the edge in certifications, and is used in some M1 0w-40 applications.

For the average person, though, they're never going to notice the difference.


I am sorry but the quality of Oronite and Royal Dutch Shell Plc are both tops in the industry factor this along with all the additive and base oil trading that each company engages with each other who knows when you buy a jug of Rotella or a Jug of Delo you are not getting an additive and/or base stock from Chevron or Shell respectively.


While what you quote as a fact, is true of refined fuels, lube oil stocks are rarely traded as you describe.
While Royal Dutch Shell has some great products , Sopus is rather lacking on great base oils an additive packs for the North American market.


You stated that SOPUS is lacking on great base oils in the N.A. market yet Rotella T6 has a slightly more stout additive package than Delo and a slightly higher flashpoint with a lower viscosity.

So how does this factor into lacking a comparable base oil or additive package?

 

[A_Harman]

I've compared specs among many different 5w40 diesel oils and came away thinking that RT6 is the best value. It's doing very well in my truck.

 

[Quattro Pete]

Originally Posted By: WillB
Why does Rotella T6 cost less than other Synthetics?

I don't know about Canada, but in the US, it does not really cost less. Take Walmart for example: A 4qt jug of T6 costs $21.50, which is around $5.30 per quart. Most other synthetics at Walmart go for around $26.50 for a 5qt jug, so that's about $5.30 per quart as well.

 

[CATERHAM]

Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Originally Posted By: WillB
Why does Rotella T6 cost less than other Synthetics?

I don't know about Canada, but in the US, it does not really cost less. Take Walmart for example: A 4qt jug of T6 costs $21.50, which is around $5.30 per quart. Most other synthetics at Walmart go for around $26.50 for a 5qt jug, so that's about $5.30 per quart as well.

I agree. In the States it's not that cheap but it has widespread availability. But with M1 0W-40 as cheap as 6 bucks/qt (sometimes with an oil filter thrown in) I'm at a lose as to why anyone would buy the inferior, heavier T6 for a gas application.

In Canada it's not much more than the States but everything else like the lighter M1 0W-40 is much more expensive. We have a slew of superior 0w30 and 0W-40 HDEOs but they are more expensive and simply don't have the same wide spread distribution.

 

[Garak]

Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
I don't know about Canada, but in the US, it does not really cost less.


As CATERHAM mentioned, it's a bit different up here. And there are several reasons. Other than Rotella, finding a synthetic or synthetic blend HDEO on the shelf easily up here is difficult. Walmart carries the Castrol semi-synthetic HDEO. TDT is more available than the Castrol, but not as widely available as the Rotella, but winds up being in a larger bottle, which distorts the total price. I haven't compared the price per litre, lately, though.

Getting Delvac 1 or a Chevron synthetic HDEO is much more of a chore, tending to require a trip to a distributor or a dedicated trucking service centre. I never complained much about getting Delvac 1, though, since the Imperial Oil distributor is only a few blocks from one of my businesses. Besides, I don't feel like hauling a pallet of Delvac 1 in my G, either, not least of all because I don't need it.

 

[HerrStig]

Originally Posted By: CATERHAM
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Originally Posted By: WillB
Why does Rotella T6 cost less than other Synthetics?

I don't know about Canada, but in the US, it does not really cost less. Take Walmart for example: A 4qt jug of T6 costs $21.50, which is around $5.30 per quart. Most other synthetics at Walmart go for around $26.50 for a 5qt jug, so that's about $5.30 per quart as well.

I agree. In the States it's not that cheap but it has widespread availability. But with M1 0W-40 as cheap as 6 bucks/qt (sometimes with an oil filter thrown in) I'm at a lose as to why anyone would buy the inferior, heavier T6 for a gas application.

In Canada it's not much more than the States but everything else like the lighter M1 0W-40 is much more expensive. We have a slew of superior 0w30 and 0W-40 HDEOs but they are more expensive and simply don't have the same wide spread distribution.


Now we can discuss how many angels can fit on the head of a pin.

 

[skellyman]

PM Re: Delvac 1300 Super 15w40 [Re: Sonataman]
dave1251


Registered: 07/15/05
Posts: 4138
Loc: Maricopa, AZ Thanks for posting this. Delvac is a pretty stout HDEO good stuff.
_________________________

I guess you just disagree with people to cause discussion?

 

[dave1251]

I am calling you out of your false information about Rotella. But you can not come up with the slightest rebuttal. So why are you giving opinion when the question at hand requires a fact?

When someone puts all the facts together you gave a response that has no basis in fact, can not even provide the slightest bit of data to back your opinion, then you look up a response on another HDEO the best you can come up with is I stated it was stout. Rotella is stout, Delo is stout, Delvac is stout, Citgard is stout, Supertech is stout. Get the idea?

Also I can be rash, you will get over it.

 

[skellyman]

Well.... you've shown me you know nothing except what someone else parrots, when you ignore other members who post facts like a grpIII oil vs grpIV or even pao type syn's on the market.
Do you even know what goes in the base oils to meet API specs
let alone Engine Mfgr specs.
Let alone the use of Supertech oils an Citgo. Both barely meet the bare minimum to pass API specs ,in some instances Citgo oils did not meet spec ! Guess where it was sold , to blenders like Warren to add other additives so they could package an sell on the open market to discount stores.
I worked for an sold Skelly Oil Co. products, made the change to Getty an Texaco , an they were taken over by Chevron.
I do know whats what in oils.
So go ahead drink the Kool-aid.

 

[dave1251]

For some reason I doubt your ability to analyze a formation the only thing you have told me was look at the VOA's between DELO 5W40 and Rotella 5W40. I told you the difference which is nearly non-existent. So other than saying you have worked for the petroleum industry what makes Shell's base stocks so inferior along with their additives? Because it is not showing up in the real world. Are you going to answer with some data or you going to resort to name calling?

 

[skellyman]

What's "rather lacking" about Shell XHVI base oils?
Jim Allen were you refering to Shell HX VI oils ? as in Helix ?
If so, Sopus does not offer these products in N.America, at least not at his time.

 

[skellyman]

Originally Posted By: dave1251
For some reason I doubt your ability to analyze a formation the only thing you have told me was look at the VOA's between DELO 5W40 and Rotella 5W40. I told you the difference which is nearly non-existent. So other than saying you have worked for the petroleum industry what makes Shell's base stocks so inferior along with their additives? Because it is not showing up in the real world. Are you going to answer with some data or you going to resort to name calling?

Dave ? Were you trying to say analyze a formulation?
And maybe you should readthe API white paper on Grp III vs Grp IV oils before you try to spout off more nonsense?

 

[roadrunner1]

I have been following this thread from the beginning, and I have also been hesitant to post, up until now.

I tried the RTS 5w-40 in my '07 6.0 Powerstroke a few years ago for three consectitive runs of 7,500 OCI, and the results were less than spectacular compared to the Deere Plus 50 15w40 I had been using at the same interval.
Wear metals went up and viscosity sheared out of grade, a low 30 wt.

I thought why am I spending twice the money on something that isn't giving me results I had been seeing prior?

Well thats been about 80,000 mi. ago and after those three OCI with the RTS I switched back to the Plus 50, but at that time I went with 10w30, wear metals came back down and viscosity never sheared as low with a 30 wt. as it did with the 5w-40.

I don't know what formulation changes happened if any when Shell changed the name from RTS to T6, but I learned my lesson.

In most applications I'm sure that Rotella performs as advertised, but in an HEUI system it didn't hold up as well for me.
On this particular truck I have UOA's from 30,000mi. (currently 156,800mi.) I bought it new and its my work truck. I feel that the number of miles and UOA evidence qualifys my comment on this topic.

 

[dave1251]

I would recommend that you follow your own advice. Because you stated Delo is superior to Rotella, yet you have not given a reason why. White paper? What does that have to do with anything? There is very poor performing group IV base synthetics, by the same token there are also poor performing group III and II products.

But at the same time you have done nothing to prove your claims and it is now almost 96 hours later. Next you will say that there is not any GTL products from Shell available. For Rotella's base oil blending it is so well formulated it rivals HDEO's with majority of PAO without most of the shortcomings of PAO.

I am certain you do want to go down the road of technical advantages and disadvantages of each API individual group base stock and how you can use all with the proper additive package to formulate a far superior product than a product with a single base. This has been discussed and it does not further any statement you have posted.

Judging from your posts that you have not been able to bring any technical data and keep on spouting off about white papers but unable to elaborate anything on said papers, it is my personal opinion is you have a axe to grind with SOPUS. Presenting any factual technical information must not be a priority. Until you provide some facts with information to substantiate your claims I will not respond to anymore posts from you in this thread.

 

[TiredTrucker]

Side note here.... current pricing at Wally World near me for Delo 400 LE synthetic...$19.98 Rotella T6... $21.36

 

[DBMaster]

My 1989 Accord LXi engine would puff a little smoke at startup with Super Tech 10w30 synthetic. I used synthetic in the car from day one in 1989. The cast iron block/aluminum head engine was bullet proof but high mileage engines would sometimes leak at the valve stem seals. I found that using the Rotella T 5W-40 minimized oil consumption and eliminated any smoke. The internals on the engine were super clean with not a bit of buildup after 300,000 miles. I was using a 10,000 mile OCI on this car for 18 of its 23 years. If I hadn't crashed it at 355,000 miles it would still be my daily driver.

 

[HerrStig]

I too noticed the absence of a start up puff in two high milage Camrys after switching to T6. Why this is I don't know, and I would like to find out. Either it burns cleaner

or it does something good to valve seals.

 

[Volvohead]

Originally Posted By: WillB
Why does Rotella T6 cost less than other Synthetics? Is it a true Group 3/4 synthetic? Is it a bad option, whether gas or diesel?


All the other issues above aside, unless it is a very demanding or special application, or it doesn't meet an approval for an engine still under warranty, or it is outside the optimum viscosity range for the engine, it tends to be an excellent G-III oil at a good price. It is a G-III, but so are a lot of other excellent oils.

Provided it meets the above parameters, I've used it in everything short of a high pressure turbo with good results.

I'm running T6 right now in an older MB M113 engine. The Total Quartz 5w-40 that the dealer pumps into them for $100 is G-III too.

But it's not an uberoil, nor is it a true universal oil that will work well in everything. And it's not priced like an uberoil, either.

 

[ib516]

Originally Posted By: Garak
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
I don't know about Canada, but in the US, it does not really cost less.


As CATERHAM mentioned, it's a bit different up here. And there are several reasons. Other than Rotella, finding a synthetic or synthetic blend HDEO on the shelf easily up here is difficult. Walmart carries the Castrol semi-synthetic HDEO. TDT is more available than the Castrol, but not as widely available as the Rotella, but winds up being in a larger bottle, which distorts the total price. I haven't compared the price per litre, lately, though.

Getting Delvac 1 or a Chevron synthetic HDEO is much more of a chore, tending to require a trip to a distributor or a dedicated trucking service centre. I never complained much about getting Delvac 1, though, since the Imperial Oil distributor is only a few blocks from one of my businesses. Besides, I don't feel like hauling a pallet of Delvac 1 in my G, either, not least of all because I don't need it.

Pretty easy to find it for me. The Co-op store on the north end of Winnipeg Street has it in spades. 0w40 Group IV PAO too. D-Mo SL Gold 0w40.

 

[Garak]

That's true, but I left the Co-op oils out of the discussion intentionally, since it's certainly not widely available to our American readers, and I don't even know what's available out of province.

For Co-op products, I'd personally prefer to check their bulk outlet to see if pricing is more reasonable. I'm definitely interested in their 10w30 HDEO for my old truck, but the Petro-Canada 10w30 has some of the best cold weather specs I've seen for such oils.