You'all know I run it in my Harley year round... Anything lighter and it sounds like a thrashing machine. Of course I'm not going riding in a snow suite, so it needs to be at least 40*F outside to make a run to town
What is the lowest temp you all would use 20w50
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Originally Posted By: Shannow
Take much out of context ?
I was responding to the bemusement displayed by others that GM specced 20W50 for my L67, demonstrating that it's not a bad choice...not commenting on the OP's question of how cold's too cold for a 20W...which I addressed also in other parts.
As to your reply to zeng...do YOU refer to 20W50 as molasses or tar ?
His comments and mine were regarding those statements, and where they typically come from.
If you don't then again, you've taken it out of context.
I don't refer to 20w50 as tar and Ive used it in parts of this country that it makes sense for. It IS very tarlike in winter where I live. You live in Australia and Zeng in Malaysia. The temperature doesn't swing +/- 140F like it can in the United States. Partly why 5w30 is so popular here is because it can handle extreme cold and heat pretty darn well so that (and other CAFE requirement for energy conserving oils)have OEMs are speccing that . It makes it a no brainer for availability and the markets where 20w50 would be most popular would be the south and desert of the US. You know what else works fine there? 5w30. It's a grade that just makes more sense for the majority of climates and applications here.
As far as your supercharged v6, I read the context and it still didn't add much. The other poster was saying it was wild that the specs were so much different from 5w30 to your 20w50. Not "Wild it doesn't blow up with that thick tar running in it." Posting a video of it running doesn't prove anything one way or the other.
Originally Posted By: Shannow
Originally Posted By: Miller88
Depends on many things and the engine in which I am running it.
I wouldn't run it in anything but extreme (100+ air temps) in my Jeep 4.0, for example. Those engines are known for having weak oil pumps as it is - combine heavy oil with something around 0F and I'm not sure it would lubricate properly.
Funny, they lasted OK in Australia...or did only the special ones get shipped here ?
Miller states that 20w50 combined with 0F may not lubricate properly. You responded with "all the ones in Australia did"....... WHERE in Australia do you have winters where your average lows are below zero FAHRENHEIT for weeks or months at a time? Your experience in Australia of "20w50 is fine year round so it's fine for everybody year round" doesn't make sense to me.
Take much out of context ?
I was responding to the bemusement displayed by others that GM specced 20W50 for my L67, demonstrating that it's not a bad choice...not commenting on the OP's question of how cold's too cold for a 20W...which I addressed also in other parts.
As to your reply to zeng...do YOU refer to 20W50 as molasses or tar ?
His comments and mine were regarding those statements, and where they typically come from.
If you don't then again, you've taken it out of context.
I don't refer to 20w50 as tar and Ive used it in parts of this country that it makes sense for. It IS very tarlike in winter where I live. You live in Australia and Zeng in Malaysia. The temperature doesn't swing +/- 140F like it can in the United States. Partly why 5w30 is so popular here is because it can handle extreme cold and heat pretty darn well so that (and other CAFE requirement for energy conserving oils)have OEMs are speccing that . It makes it a no brainer for availability and the markets where 20w50 would be most popular would be the south and desert of the US. You know what else works fine there? 5w30. It's a grade that just makes more sense for the majority of climates and applications here.
As far as your supercharged v6, I read the context and it still didn't add much. The other poster was saying it was wild that the specs were so much different from 5w30 to your 20w50. Not "Wild it doesn't blow up with that thick tar running in it." Posting a video of it running doesn't prove anything one way or the other.
Originally Posted By: Shannow
Originally Posted By: Miller88
Depends on many things and the engine in which I am running it.
I wouldn't run it in anything but extreme (100+ air temps) in my Jeep 4.0, for example. Those engines are known for having weak oil pumps as it is - combine heavy oil with something around 0F and I'm not sure it would lubricate properly.
Funny, they lasted OK in Australia...or did only the special ones get shipped here ?
Miller states that 20w50 combined with 0F may not lubricate properly. You responded with "all the ones in Australia did"....... WHERE in Australia do you have winters where your average lows are below zero FAHRENHEIT for weeks or months at a time? Your experience in Australia of "20w50 is fine year round so it's fine for everybody year round" doesn't make sense to me.
Originally Posted By: jayg
Originally Posted By: Shannow
Originally Posted By: Miller88
Depends on many things and the engine in which I am running it.
I wouldn't run it in anything but extreme (100+ air temps) in my Jeep 4.0, for example. Those engines are known for having weak oil pumps as it is - combine heavy oil with something around 0F and I'm not sure it would lubricate properly.
Funny, they lasted OK in Australia...or did only the special ones get shipped here ?
Miller states that 20w50 combined with 0F may not lubricate properly. You responded with "all the ones in Australia did"....... WHERE in Australia do you have winters where your average lows are below zero FAHRENHEIT for weeks or months at a time? Your experience in Australia of "20w50 is fine year round so it's fine for everybody year round" doesn't make sense to me.
I was replying to the bit in italics...he wouldn't run it in anything less than extreme (100+) air temps in his jeep, as they are known for weak oil pumps...In Oz, they ALL got those grades, and not all of Oz is over 100F all of the time...and they all survived, down to the typical Oz extreme lows of -10C...saw them with my own eyes.
0F and 20W are a nonsense concept/combination that I ignored...just like you ignored the part I was clearly replying to.
Originally Posted By: Shannow
Originally Posted By: Miller88
Depends on many things and the engine in which I am running it.
I wouldn't run it in anything but extreme (100+ air temps) in my Jeep 4.0, for example. Those engines are known for having weak oil pumps as it is - combine heavy oil with something around 0F and I'm not sure it would lubricate properly.
Funny, they lasted OK in Australia...or did only the special ones get shipped here ?
Miller states that 20w50 combined with 0F may not lubricate properly. You responded with "all the ones in Australia did"....... WHERE in Australia do you have winters where your average lows are below zero FAHRENHEIT for weeks or months at a time? Your experience in Australia of "20w50 is fine year round so it's fine for everybody year round" doesn't make sense to me.
I was replying to the bit in italics...he wouldn't run it in anything less than extreme (100+) air temps in his jeep, as they are known for weak oil pumps...In Oz, they ALL got those grades, and not all of Oz is over 100F all of the time...and they all survived, down to the typical Oz extreme lows of -10C...saw them with my own eyes.
0F and 20W are a nonsense concept/combination that I ignored...just like you ignored the part I was clearly replying to.
Originally Posted By: Shannow
Originally Posted By: jayg
Originally Posted By: Shannow
Originally Posted By: Miller88
Depends on many things and the engine in which I am running it.
I wouldn't run it in anything but extreme (100+ air temps) in my Jeep 4.0, for example. Those engines are known for having weak oil pumps as it is - combine heavy oil with something around 0F and I'm not sure it would lubricate properly.
Funny, they lasted OK in Australia...or did only the special ones get shipped here ?
Miller states that 20w50 combined with 0F may not lubricate properly. You responded with "all the ones in Australia did"....... WHERE in Australia do you have winters where your average lows are below zero FAHRENHEIT for weeks or months at a time? Your experience in Australia of "20w50 is fine year round so it's fine for everybody year round" doesn't make sense to me.
I was replying to the bit in italics...he wouldn't run it in anything less than extreme (100+) air temps in his jeep, as they are known for weak oil pumps...In Oz, they ALL got those grades, and not all of Oz is over 100F all of the time...and they all survived, down to the typical Oz extreme lows of -10C...saw them with my own eyes.
0F and 20W are a nonsense concept/combination that I ignored...just like you ignored the part I was clearly replying to.
Couldn't tell what part you were replying to actually since you just italicized it. I have no doubt that somebody could turn on their vehicles the few times when you got down to -10C. That doesn't prove anything. What I'm saying that there are large parts of this country and MILLIONS of people that would have to start their vehicles at temperatures much colder than -10C for MONTHS at a time. 20w50 isn't a great choice for them wear wise and so for ease, lighter multigrades can be used year round and nationwide. That's why it's not as popular or a great fit in the US not because we're all dumb and think it's "tar" though, again it is is thick as tar in my winter ambient temperatures.
Originally Posted By: jayg
Originally Posted By: Shannow
Originally Posted By: Miller88
Depends on many things and the engine in which I am running it.
I wouldn't run it in anything but extreme (100+ air temps) in my Jeep 4.0, for example. Those engines are known for having weak oil pumps as it is - combine heavy oil with something around 0F and I'm not sure it would lubricate properly.
Funny, they lasted OK in Australia...or did only the special ones get shipped here ?
Miller states that 20w50 combined with 0F may not lubricate properly. You responded with "all the ones in Australia did"....... WHERE in Australia do you have winters where your average lows are below zero FAHRENHEIT for weeks or months at a time? Your experience in Australia of "20w50 is fine year round so it's fine for everybody year round" doesn't make sense to me.
I was replying to the bit in italics...he wouldn't run it in anything less than extreme (100+) air temps in his jeep, as they are known for weak oil pumps...In Oz, they ALL got those grades, and not all of Oz is over 100F all of the time...and they all survived, down to the typical Oz extreme lows of -10C...saw them with my own eyes.
0F and 20W are a nonsense concept/combination that I ignored...just like you ignored the part I was clearly replying to.
Couldn't tell what part you were replying to actually since you just italicized it. I have no doubt that somebody could turn on their vehicles the few times when you got down to -10C. That doesn't prove anything. What I'm saying that there are large parts of this country and MILLIONS of people that would have to start their vehicles at temperatures much colder than -10C for MONTHS at a time. 20w50 isn't a great choice for them wear wise and so for ease, lighter multigrades can be used year round and nationwide. That's why it's not as popular or a great fit in the US not because we're all dumb and think it's "tar" though, again it is is thick as tar in my winter ambient temperatures.
OP is in Caribbean
Quote:
The Caribbean climate is tropical, moderated to a certain extent by the prevailing northeast trade winds. Individual climatic conditions are strongly dependent on elevation. At sea level there is little variation in temperature, regardless of the time of the day or the season of the year. Temperatures range between 24°C and 32°C. In Kingston, Jamaica, the mean temperature is 26°C, whereas Mandeville, at a little over 600 meters high in the Carpenters Mountains of Manchester Parish, has recorded temperatures as low as 10°C. Daylight hours tend to be shorter during summer and slightly longer during winter than in the higher latitudes. The conventional division, rather than the four seasons, is between the long rainy season from May through October and the dry season, corresponding to winter in the northern hemisphere.
Quote:
The Caribbean climate is tropical, moderated to a certain extent by the prevailing northeast trade winds. Individual climatic conditions are strongly dependent on elevation. At sea level there is little variation in temperature, regardless of the time of the day or the season of the year. Temperatures range between 24°C and 32°C. In Kingston, Jamaica, the mean temperature is 26°C, whereas Mandeville, at a little over 600 meters high in the Carpenters Mountains of Manchester Parish, has recorded temperatures as low as 10°C. Daylight hours tend to be shorter during summer and slightly longer during winter than in the higher latitudes. The conventional division, rather than the four seasons, is between the long rainy season from May through October and the dry season, corresponding to winter in the northern hemisphere.
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: SR5
OP is in Caribbean
Quote:
The Caribbean climate is tropical, moderated to a certain extent by the prevailing northeast trade winds. Individual climatic conditions are strongly dependent on elevation. At sea level there is little variation in temperature, regardless of the time of the day or the season of the year. Temperatures range between 24°C and 32°C. In Kingston, Jamaica, the mean temperature is 26°C, whereas Mandeville, at a little over 600 meters high in the Carpenters Mountains of Manchester Parish, has recorded temperatures as low as 10°C. Daylight hours tend to be shorter during summer and slightly longer during winter than in the higher latitudes. The conventional division, rather than the four seasons, is between the long rainy season from May through October and the dry season, corresponding to winter in the northern hemisphere.
Right. I understand that. But the question wasn't "What oil should I use in the Caribbean?" It's "What is the lowest temp YOU would use 20W50?" The OP could use 20w50 with no problem if he was looking for an oil recommendation but he wasn't.
However my responses were to the Aussie's on the board commenting about people in the US thinking 20w50 is like tar.
Originally Posted By: Shannow
Originally Posted By: hpb
The US guys seem to think 20w50 is like tar!
there's a couple of vocals who use the term "engine molasses", and "tar" having no idea what they are talking about...gets a certain amount of traction with the then unknowing.
Saying that Jeeps survived in Australia on 20w50 year round just doesn't mean anything for anybody that experiences real seasons. Mostly hot/mild then a few days below freezing? Yeah everything would be fine with 20w50 in it with those conditions.
The majority of the US doesn't have that climate and that's why most don't use it here and that's the real reason it's not used here. Some in the US say it's like "tar" but most just don't use it because there are BETTER options for their climate and application.
OP is in Caribbean
Quote:
The Caribbean climate is tropical, moderated to a certain extent by the prevailing northeast trade winds. Individual climatic conditions are strongly dependent on elevation. At sea level there is little variation in temperature, regardless of the time of the day or the season of the year. Temperatures range between 24°C and 32°C. In Kingston, Jamaica, the mean temperature is 26°C, whereas Mandeville, at a little over 600 meters high in the Carpenters Mountains of Manchester Parish, has recorded temperatures as low as 10°C. Daylight hours tend to be shorter during summer and slightly longer during winter than in the higher latitudes. The conventional division, rather than the four seasons, is between the long rainy season from May through October and the dry season, corresponding to winter in the northern hemisphere.
Right. I understand that. But the question wasn't "What oil should I use in the Caribbean?" It's "What is the lowest temp YOU would use 20W50?" The OP could use 20w50 with no problem if he was looking for an oil recommendation but he wasn't.
However my responses were to the Aussie's on the board commenting about people in the US thinking 20w50 is like tar.
Originally Posted By: Shannow
Originally Posted By: hpb
The US guys seem to think 20w50 is like tar!
there's a couple of vocals who use the term "engine molasses", and "tar" having no idea what they are talking about...gets a certain amount of traction with the then unknowing.
Saying that Jeeps survived in Australia on 20w50 year round just doesn't mean anything for anybody that experiences real seasons. Mostly hot/mild then a few days below freezing? Yeah everything would be fine with 20w50 in it with those conditions.
The majority of the US doesn't have that climate and that's why most don't use it here and that's the real reason it's not used here. Some in the US say it's like "tar" but most just don't use it because there are BETTER options for their climate and application.
Don't worry mate, I'm with you. I haven't used 20W-50 in years, 15w40 is the thickest I have run in recent times. If I wanted thicker I would probably go a synthetic 10W-60 like Castrol Edge.
Right now I'm into 10w30 semi-synthetics and 5w30 full synthetics, both in Euro A3/B4 spec.
Right now I'm into 10w30 semi-synthetics and 5w30 full synthetics, both in Euro A3/B4 spec.
Originally Posted By: SR5
Originally Posted By: mazdamonky
My rx7 manual says 20w50 is good down to 10 degrees and 10w40 is good down to -10 degrees.
Yep 20W-50 down to 10 F (negative 12 C) sounds about right to me.
For many years my favourite oil was Penrite HPR 20W-60, I used it in everything.
If Penrite wasn't so expensive and hard to get in Spain i'd love to try it, i actually have found a Penrite carrier but it's about 40 Euro for a 5L jug so that puts me off
Originally Posted By: mazdamonky
My rx7 manual says 20w50 is good down to 10 degrees and 10w40 is good down to -10 degrees.
Yep 20W-50 down to 10 F (negative 12 C) sounds about right to me.
For many years my favourite oil was Penrite HPR 20W-60, I used it in everything.
If Penrite wasn't so expensive and hard to get in Spain i'd love to try it, i actually have found a Penrite carrier but it's about 40 Euro for a 5L jug so that puts me off
Originally Posted By: FordCapriDriver
If Penrite wasn't so expensive and hard to get in Spain i'd love to try it, i actually have found a Penrite carrier but it's about 40 Euro for a 5L jug so that puts me off
Depending on which Penrite oil(s) they carry, that is roughly on-par for what you'd pay for a typical synthetic (i.e. Mobil1) when not on special.
If Penrite wasn't so expensive and hard to get in Spain i'd love to try it, i actually have found a Penrite carrier but it's about 40 Euro for a 5L jug so that puts me off
Depending on which Penrite oil(s) they carry, that is roughly on-par for what you'd pay for a typical synthetic (i.e. Mobil1) when not on special.
Originally Posted By: B320i
Originally Posted By: FordCapriDriver
If Penrite wasn't so expensive and hard to get in Spain i'd love to try it, i actually have found a Penrite carrier but it's about 40 Euro for a 5L jug so that puts me off
Depending on which Penrite oil(s) they carry, that is roughly on-par for what you'd pay for a typical synthetic (i.e. Mobil1) when not on special.
They carry pretty much all Penrite oils , the HPR 15 15W-60 is about 40 Euro and so is the HPR 30 20W-60, Then they have all the classic low detergent oils which are slightly cheaper
Originally Posted By: FordCapriDriver
If Penrite wasn't so expensive and hard to get in Spain i'd love to try it, i actually have found a Penrite carrier but it's about 40 Euro for a 5L jug so that puts me off
Depending on which Penrite oil(s) they carry, that is roughly on-par for what you'd pay for a typical synthetic (i.e. Mobil1) when not on special.
They carry pretty much all Penrite oils , the HPR 15 15W-60 is about 40 Euro and so is the HPR 30 20W-60, Then they have all the classic low detergent oils which are slightly cheaper
FCD, put that HPR 30 on your bucket list for when you win lotto.
Where is Silk when you need him, he puts Penrite 40-70 in a few cars he services.
Where is Silk when you need him, he puts Penrite 40-70 in a few cars he services.
Just to prove it exists, and does get put in engines. A 2E Corolla engine, fouls plugs and will run out of oil between services...sorted. Probably just runs around town and never warms up, in a town that regually sees -3c in winter. Not worth repairing, not worth thowing away.
Thanks Silk, that's it, you use Penrite 30-70. I couldn't remember exactly which one.
20W-50 isn't my first pick anymore, except maybe for some motorcycles, but it can be used quite fine to a bit below freezing.
20W-50 isn't my first pick anymore, except maybe for some motorcycles, but it can be used quite fine to a bit below freezing.
Originally Posted By: Silk
Just to prove it exists, and does get put in engines. A 2E Corolla engine, fouls plugs and will run out of oil between services...sorted. Probably just runs around town and never warms up, in a town that regually sees -3c in winter. Not worth repairing, not worth thowing away.
Originally Posted By: SR5
Thanks Silk, that's it, you use Penrite 30-70. I couldn't remember exactly which one.
20W-50 isn't my first pick anymore, except maybe for some motorcycles, but it can be used quite fine to a bit below freezing.
There is 40W-70 as well. Penrite, Nulon
Just to prove it exists, and does get put in engines. A 2E Corolla engine, fouls plugs and will run out of oil between services...sorted. Probably just runs around town and never warms up, in a town that regually sees -3c in winter. Not worth repairing, not worth thowing away.
Originally Posted By: SR5
Thanks Silk, that's it, you use Penrite 30-70. I couldn't remember exactly which one.
20W-50 isn't my first pick anymore, except maybe for some motorcycles, but it can be used quite fine to a bit below freezing.
There is 40W-70 as well. Penrite, Nulon
Originally Posted By: jayg
Couldn't tell what part you were replying to actually since you just italicized it. I have no doubt that somebody could turn on their vehicles the few times when you got down to -10C. That doesn't prove anything. What I'm saying that there are large parts of this country and MILLIONS of people that would have to start their vehicles at temperatures much colder than -10C for MONTHS at a time. 20w50 isn't a great choice for them wear wise and so for ease, lighter multigrades can be used year round and nationwide. That's why it's not as popular or a great fit in the US not because we're all dumb and think it's "tar" though, again it is is thick as tar in my winter ambient temperatures.
but then so would a 20w40, 20w30 or 20w20 be... or even a 20w16 if they would ever make one
Couldn't tell what part you were replying to actually since you just italicized it. I have no doubt that somebody could turn on their vehicles the few times when you got down to -10C. That doesn't prove anything. What I'm saying that there are large parts of this country and MILLIONS of people that would have to start their vehicles at temperatures much colder than -10C for MONTHS at a time. 20w50 isn't a great choice for them wear wise and so for ease, lighter multigrades can be used year round and nationwide. That's why it's not as popular or a great fit in the US not because we're all dumb and think it's "tar" though, again it is is thick as tar in my winter ambient temperatures.
but then so would a 20w40, 20w30 or 20w20 be... or even a 20w16 if they would ever make one
Originally Posted By: SR5
FCD, put that HPR 30 on your bucket list for when you win lotto.
Where is Silk when you need him, he puts Penrite 40-70 in a few cars he services.
lol , if i win the lotto i will rebuild the whole car and the engine and just rebuild the engine with semi tight clearances so i can run a cheap 15w40 HDEO
FCD, put that HPR 30 on your bucket list for when you win lotto.
Where is Silk when you need him, he puts Penrite 40-70 in a few cars he services.
lol , if i win the lotto i will rebuild the whole car and the engine and just rebuild the engine with semi tight clearances so i can run a cheap 15w40 HDEO
My first 5$ car had 90 weight gear oil in to keep the main brgs quiet. I use 20w50 down to 10 F . I used to swap to 10w40 around New Years. Now, I add a pint of MMO for the winter.
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