When looking at the VOA add packs, why does it appear that Valvoline, Castrol and PUP have the strongest? I know that does not count for the base oils that are used..
VOA add packs
- Thread starter Scott S
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dnewton3
Staff member
Have you looked at Amsoil or HPL? I'd say they are "stronger" than the ones you mentioned.
Also, please do realize that not all additives show up in a simple ICP spectrometry analysis.
Most importantly, don't judge a lube by what's in the bottle. (inputs)
Judge it by how well it performs in the crankcase. (outputs)
Also, please do realize that not all additives show up in a simple ICP spectrometry analysis.
Most importantly, don't judge a lube by what's in the bottle. (inputs)
Judge it by how well it performs in the crankcase. (outputs)
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Because not everyone cheaps out like Mobil does. /s
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If you look at something like Pennzoil Euro L 5W-30 you start wondering how it even works, or Shell Rotella T6 MV 5W-30. Yet they both have several OEM and industry leading approvals.
I was going by what's on shelves..
So does Mobil 1, thinking about trying Castrol or Valvoline EP?
Mobil 1 sells some of the highest-quality, most-certified oils available on shelves anywhere. I’d hardly call them skimping on anything even though Mobil 1 is not my preferred brand.
VOA doesn't show enough. There are additives which don't appear in a VOA and you can't deduce the type of additive. VOA's are rather pointless. UOA is good for things like viscosity retention, fuel dilution, and excessive wear metals. Not so much about additives.
It's really difficult to determine how good an add pack is from looking at an elemental analysis. Some additives are non-metallic and won't even show up. There are also many different forms of similar additives that are made up of the same elements. Some forms require higher concentrations than others to be effective.
Many additives also compete at the surfaces of engine components. An oil that has more calcium-based detergents will also require more friction and anti-wear additive to perform well.
How well additives hold up over an OCI also depends on the anti-oxidant performance of the oil. An oil with good oxidation performance won't require as much of certain additives.
Also, more is not always better. Some additives can contribute to deposits, increase friction, increase the risk of LSPI, etc.
There's a reason oil standards are based on expensive engine testing requirements, and not on elemental analysis (aside from phosphorus and sulfur limits).
Many additives also compete at the surfaces of engine components. An oil that has more calcium-based detergents will also require more friction and anti-wear additive to perform well.
How well additives hold up over an OCI also depends on the anti-oxidant performance of the oil. An oil with good oxidation performance won't require as much of certain additives.
Also, more is not always better. Some additives can contribute to deposits, increase friction, increase the risk of LSPI, etc.
There's a reason oil standards are based on expensive engine testing requirements, and not on elemental analysis (aside from phosphorus and sulfur limits).
I don't doubt that.. what do you personally use?
Strongest!
I wouldn't say Mobil cheaps out, compare base stocks.
Also not everything shows up on oil analysis, and when you compare UOA's Mobil 1 consistently does great, and this is coming from a QS fan.
Really, what about there ESP Line? Sounds 2 me that you are Making a Claim Without any Evidence!
I run HPL in all my vehicles (except my Subaru with leaky HGs), in my zero turn and hydrostats, in my Polaris Sportsman 450HO, and my generator.
HPL Dave has made at least 3 new product lines for my applications, so I happily spend the slightly higher amount for the added protection and customer service they provide. Some members get their panties in a wad about my enthusiasm for HPL, even though I agree it’s not right for everyone and that many can resort to WM shelf-stock their entire lives without issue.
My job depends on having known suppliers who ALWAYS come thru, from machine shops, to parts distributors, to HPL. They’re transparent about what’s in their products, and just this week I placed a hot order with HPL’s Mary Jane at 2:30pm Tuesday, and at 10am Wednesday morning my company had the case of HPL custom lube in-hand in Oklahoma. Now that’s justification!
VOAs are necessary so you know initial concentrations, oxidation, etc, if you’re really going for maximum length OCIs. If you’re changing Mobil 1 EP at 3k, not so much.
Well, now you know. And as the PBS commercial after Masters of the Universe used to say, “knowing is half the battle”That sounds like menothing like throwing away good oil..
That's why I usually don't even use EP, but I use Advanced protection.. because I change it within 4 to 5,000 MI.Well, now you know. And as the PBS commercial after Masters of the Universe used to say, “knowing is half the battle”
This is a copy of a UOA I had done using Mobil 1 Advanced about 3,000 MI after I had my timing chain, water pump, and tensioners replaced.
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