API SM has improved the quality of motor oil. The bar was raised so that most conventional oils are really synthetic blends using Group II+/III baseoils. This along with better, more expensive additives. For really long drains over 10k miles Amsoil is king and has actually improved under API SM IMHO.
Synthetics - What's The Point Anymore?
- Thread starter Mr_Incredible
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If it were to buy a car new id use nothing but synthetic. My belief is that using a group 4 will reduce the amount of wear compared to a group 1,2 or 3. That being said, it is also my belief that an engine with 200k miles on it, even if it will last the life of the car, is an exhausted motor and doesn't perform like new. And while wear isnt the only factor in that, it's a major one, and using a synthetic will help your engine keep young.
Bzzt.
You're saying supertech dino is going to protect just as good as amsoil? 110*, 0*, turbos, high rpms, lots of cold starts, the only advantage amsoil has is a longer OCI?
I know there have been a lot of UOA where wear has been less using havoline over redline or amsoil or whatever else, I don't believe a handful of examples proves anything. I've felt great eating burgers and pizza for one week, and felt like #@$%! eating steak and fish the next week.
Also like how I got 33 mpg on a tankful of unleaded from a backroads generic gas station, and the next week 28 mpg on a tank of shell gas on a busy highway.
I think that synthetic oils still have their place.
I have a vortech supercharged thunderbird, I wouldn't dream of using anything but a full synthetic motor oil in it.
Same goes for any factory supercharged car, or turbocharged vehicle.
But for my daily driver, motorcraft 5w20 is an excellent choice, and very cost effective.
I have a vortech supercharged thunderbird, I wouldn't dream of using anything but a full synthetic motor oil in it.
Same goes for any factory supercharged car, or turbocharged vehicle.
But for my daily driver, motorcraft 5w20 is an excellent choice, and very cost effective.
I've seen cars that use whatever oil is on sale and go over 200,000. If the oil is changed and the car kept up, 97% of the time the engine will out last the rest of the car. Before you say no way, I've seen cars-trucks go over 250,000 on Pennzoil and I've seen on go 271,000 on a different oil at every change (on sale oil).
Definition of synthetic oil from NORIA's lube dictionary:
"Oils produced by synthesis (chemical reaction) rather than by extraction or refinement. Many (but not all) synthetic oils offer immense advantages in terms of high temperature stability and low temperature fluidity, but are more costly than mineral oils. Major advantage of all synthetic oils is their chemical uniformity."
"Many (but not all)" is the stuff your pouring in a "many"?
"high temperature stability", does an automotive application get hot enough for this to be concern?
"low temperature fluidity" cold enough?
And what about wear? guess that wasn't noteworthy enough for NORIA?
"Oils produced by synthesis (chemical reaction) rather than by extraction or refinement. Many (but not all) synthetic oils offer immense advantages in terms of high temperature stability and low temperature fluidity, but are more costly than mineral oils. Major advantage of all synthetic oils is their chemical uniformity."
"Many (but not all)" is the stuff your pouring in a "many"?
"high temperature stability", does an automotive application get hot enough for this to be concern?
"low temperature fluidity" cold enough?
And what about wear? guess that wasn't noteworthy enough for NORIA?
The reason some of these cars use synthetic is because they use a performance engine. Note Chevorlet says to use synthetic in the Corvette but not in say a trail blazer. If fact GM says you only have to change oil when the oil monitor tells you to in most cases. And thats with dino oil, not synthetics. I've also read one reason Corvette went to synthetic is because they could do away with the oil cooler and save weight/money and get away with it. Thoughts to ponder...
Or a Volkswagen TDI.
Could also just be branding partnership thing? Mobile 1 has a percieved (if not actual) image of quality and performance, something that can't hurt the corvette.
A buyers thought process may be, "wow", this thing is so hot it need synthetic oil". A buyer of synthetic oil may think "wow, this oil is so good it's spec for the new corvette". Win win situation for both players, good partnership branding.
A prospective buyer of a blazer may see it as a negative, " what's up with this, I HAVE to buy synthetic oil"?
A corvette buy wouldn't care about the added cost.
Or a Dodge Truck for that matter. Gas or Cummins diesel. I know 2 that are over 350,000 miles and running like tops. American Iron!
The point of synthetics is for extreme situuations or engines with desing shortcomings.
Kestas
Staff member
... or for the general public, who are either too busy or too lazy to change their oil on a timely basis. I believe that's one reason manufacturers are specifying synthetic.
Another, and probably more significant, reason for manufacturers to specify sythetic oil is for "image". Doesn't it sound better when the manufacturer specifies synthetic for your performance machine? What if Mercedes dropped their synthetic requirement and went with dino, yet their competitors (BMW?) maintained their synthetic requirement? I think the average person would tend to look at Mercedes as a K-Mart brand of luxury.
Another, and probably more significant, reason for manufacturers to specify sythetic oil is for "image". Doesn't it sound better when the manufacturer specifies synthetic for your performance machine? What if Mercedes dropped their synthetic requirement and went with dino, yet their competitors (BMW?) maintained their synthetic requirement? I think the average person would tend to look at Mercedes as a K-Mart brand of luxury.
#@$%! i dont know anymore weither to switch or keep doing what im doing. I keep using Amsoil Series 2000 or 3000 in my Tacoma for six months only regardless or milage (5000-7500 miles) only because i do alot of shorter trips but now im thinking im wasting money.
Kestas
Staff member
I may step on some toes here, but if you spend a lot of time on this board, you may get sucked into this vortex of anal oil people who'll convince you that synthetic in the perfect grade is the only way to go. It's fine for the people whom oil is a hobby and are interested in the nuances of oil.
But you'll also find a lot of people here who are just fine with regular oil changed on a timely basis.
But you'll also find a lot of people here who are just fine with regular oil changed on a timely basis.
ARB1977,
Have you performed any UOA's on your Amsoil after that mileage?
Have you performed any UOA's on your Amsoil after that mileage?
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