Stop Changing Your Oil...

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OK, please tell me: what's the functional difference if I change my oil "early" (remember, not EVERY car is the same: manual says 3K miles severe, 4.8K miles MAX NORMAL). My usage is borderline severe. I change at ~4K miles. I fill up filter, it is dead vertical from the bottom and topped up. I don't see ANY difference with an oil change to a normal overnite startup. Please elaborate on this OUTLANDISH claim, thanks. Some peer reviewed evidence wouldn't hurt.
 
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Ha! This is America. We seem to believe that doing EVERYTHING to excess is our God-given right. We obsess over the least likely cause of engine problems and throw our hard-earned money away disposing of perfectly functional oil. The earlier post about OCI's giving us the "feeling" that we have a modicum of control over the longevity of our engines rings true to me. Just a few years ago, lots of experts were stating that synthetic oil was overkill for a car engine. Now, many more cars than Corvettes are coming from the factory filled with synthetics. I guess that's due to CAFE. (Maybe that's a good thing.) Throw out your outdated dogma, folks. It's a new age. Do you still stand in line at the bank because you miss the wonderful interaction with the bank teller? We should be looking to run the maximum time/mileage between OCI's. This is a classic example of a paradigm shift and extreme resistance to change.
 
Originally Posted By: LineArrayNut
OK, please tell me: what's the functional difference if I change my oil "early" (remember, not EVERY car is the same: manual says 3K miles severe, 4.8K miles MAX NORMAL). My usage is borderline severe. I change at ~4K miles. I fill up filter, it is dead vertical from the bottom and topped up. I don't see ANY difference with an oil change to a normal overnite startup. Please elaborate on this OUTLANDISH claim, thanks. Some peer reviewed evidence wouldn't hurt.


I don't need any peer-reviewed evidence to tell me that the only time I ever get a "low oil pressure" oil light is when I change my oil and filter... That's one of the reasons I do the filter every other change. Obviously it depends on the engine design, but on some engines doing an oil change results in draining most of the oil out of the oil pump. There's nothing "outlandish" about that at all... If the oil pump isn't primed, it takes longer to pump oil through the system. Is it going to blow up your engine? probably not. Does it result in a marginal increase in wear? probably.
 
Originally Posted By: DBMaster
Ha! This is America. We seem to believe that doing EVERYTHING to excess is our God-given right. We obsess over the least likely cause of engine problems and throw our hard-earned money away disposing of perfectly functional oil. The earlier post about OCI's giving us the "feeling" that we have a modicum of control over the longevity of our engines rings true to me. Just a few years ago, lots of experts were stating that synthetic oil was overkill for a car engine. Now, many more cars than Corvettes are coming from the factory filled with synthetics. I guess that's due to CAFE. (Maybe that's a good thing.) Throw out your outdated dogma, folks. It's a new age. Do you still stand in line at the bank because you miss the wonderful interaction with the bank teller? We should be looking to run the maximum time/mileage between OCI's. This is a classic example of a paradigm shift and extreme resistance to change.


+1 LOL!!!!!!!!
 
Originally Posted By: DBMaster
Ha! This is America. We seem to believe that doing EVERYTHING to excess is our God-given right. We obsess over the least likely cause of engine problems and throw our hard-earned money away disposing of perfectly functional oil. The earlier post about OCI's giving us the "feeling" that we have a modicum of control over the longevity of our engines rings true to me. Just a few years ago, lots of experts were stating that synthetic oil was overkill for a car engine. Now, many more cars than Corvettes are coming from the factory filled with synthetics. I guess that's due to CAFE. (Maybe that's a good thing.) Throw out your outdated dogma, folks. It's a new age. Do you still stand in line at the bank because you miss the wonderful interaction with the bank teller? We should be looking to run the maximum time/mileage between OCI's. This is a classic example of a paradigm shift and extreme resistance to change.
Depends on the Bank Teller.
 
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Though, I now change mine every 5k miles, at the very least.
 
Originally Posted By: tommygunn

Valvoline sucks.



There's a word I'm thinking of... I use it to cover up at night. Oh, BLANKET... statement!

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Seems to me the old saw of 3-mos/3000 miles is perpetuated for several reasons, including (in no particular order):

1. The car service industry not wanting to let go of a money-making practice.

2. The general conservatism of service technicians in terms of acknowledging new techniques, materials, etc.

3. The industry's probably well-intentioned desire, long ago, to devolop an effective and easy-to-remember slogan that would more than amply cover just about every car owner out there, even the absolute worst in terms of how he or she takes care of their cars. Ample protection for the worst of the worst.

3a: Human nature. Tell someone oil is legitimately good for 6-10K miles and you know people are going to neglect or forget to a point way beyond that. Tell them it's good for 3K miles and when people finally come in at 5K or 6K, they're still well in the safety zone with modern oils.

3b: The disappearance of filling station attendents who used to check your oil. Let's face it, oil issues are not just issues of dirt but issues of leaks and burning, too, which leads to low levels. The industry probably figured "hey, better get most consumers in at 3-mos/3K miles because with no one checking oil levels anymore, that's probably the safest time period."

So, the money-making issue aside, IMO it's mostly a HUGE belt-and-suspenders way of the industry trying to protect consumers against themselves...the lazy, or forgetful, or truly unknowing consumers out there, which I'm guessing members of BITOG are definitely NOT....at least when it comes to their cars! :-)

But look at it this way, guys (and gals). There's many things automotive-related that we don't do anymore like our daddies or grandfathers did....like flush the radiator every year...even though (like frequent oil changes) it could be argued that it's "cheap insurance." And why don't we follow an old practice like that? Well, it's just not necessary anymore. Seems as natural and logical for us NOT to do something like that because componets have changed for the better. So in the very near future, when virtually every car somes with an OLM, and brand new generations of drivers know nothing of oil changing other than doing it when the OLM says it is time, these new drivers will never even think twice about some "old fashioned" practice of 3-mos/3K miles. And they will legitimately wonder about the sanity of anyone who still clings to that practice.
 
Originally Posted By: crazyoildude
1800-2500 mile oci is not only a waste but it can be bad for your engine if u change your oil filter every time... In the engine business we call that loving your engine to death.
every time you change your oil filter it takes a few seconds for the oil to build up even if you fill the oil filter


After doing my own oil changes for 46 years and filling filters for the last 40 or so, I'm not believing that... On the average with oil fill I see pressure within one or two seconds, which is about the same as average cold start...
 
This isn't really new. The owner's manual to a 1984 Pontiac recommends an OCI of 7,500 miles with conventional 1980s API SF oil. My reading of severe service doesn't apply to all that many people:
1) operating in dusty areas
2) towing a trailer
3) constant idling and low speed operation as seen in taxi/police/door to door delivery
4) frequent short trips less than 4 miles with temperature below freezing

Is that really most people? Doesn't seem like it to me. City slickers might be worried about point #3, but the way GM described it sounds like much more than just being in bumper to bumper traffic a couple times a day.

Making sure the oil level stays correct is a big concern though (and turned into a widespread problem in the early years of the car in question). The longer the oil sits in the car the more time it has to burn off or leak if something is wrong. Many people aren't going to check anything on their car, they rely on the mechanic to do that at the OCI.
 
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Originally Posted By: JAYCEE
(But I can't imagine going 20,000 mi on the same fill in a Porsche.)
Doesn't your Porsche take something like 9 quarts of very high quality oil? That large quantity of oil takes longer to become exhausted, and the high quality of the oil adds to the oil life.
 
Originally Posted By: KlooksKleek
3b: The disappearance of filling station attendents who used to check your oil. Let's face it, oil issues are not just issues of dirt but issues of leaks and burning, too, which leads to low levels. The industry probably figured "hey, better get most consumers in at 3-mos/3K miles because with no one checking oil levels anymore, that's probably the safest time period."


Funny you mention it. Where I work now, the fleet of trucks they have never gets regular proper maintenance. I was asked what was broken and if it didn't start when I checked the oil one morning. When I discovered the oil barely touched the end of the dipstick, my boss said it needs an oil change soon anyhow and to just ignore it.

I got the oil changed, which is done at the dealer where they have an account, but asked for an extra quart of oil so I could add it next time.

As a guy who changed his own oil and does all his own maintenance, I can say, I feel conflicted by all this. But whatever, not my money!
 
Originally Posted By: JOD

I don't need any peer-reviewed evidence to tell me that the only time I ever get a "low oil pressure" oil light is when I change my oil and filter... That's one of the reasons I do the filter every other change. Obviously it depends on the engine design.


Yep, I've noticed this effect in some engines and not in others.

I had an old VW Passat many years ago had a very noticeable few extra seconds of no oil pressure on the first start after an oil/filter change. It would sound dreadful, like shaking a jar of bolts, then suddenly the the oil pressure would come up and it would quieten down. Even though I don't notice this to any significant degree on my current cars, I still prefer to do my oil changes hot and fast to minimize any possible effect.

People who go to ridiculous lengths to get every last bit of old oil out are probably more at risk here. There was a thread once (not sure if here or another forum) where some guys were talking about leaving their sump plugs out all night for example. That's definitely getting into the "killing it with kindness" territory in my opinion.

I had to laugh about one case where one guy left his sump plug out overnight (to drain every last bit) and his wife had to go somewhere early the next morning. There was a spider or something in her car so she took his (with no oil).
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Originally Posted By: RiceCake
"I change my oil every 3000 miles, or whenever I get bored... Whichever comes first." - Hank Hill


That's absolutely classic!
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Originally Posted By: RiceCake


Funny you mention it. Where I work now, the fleet of trucks they have never gets regular proper maintenance. I was asked what was broken and if it didn't start when I checked the oil one morning. When I discovered the oil barely touched the end of the dipstick, my boss said it needs an oil change soon anyhow and to just ignore it.

I got the oil changed, which is done at the dealer where they have an account, but asked for an extra quart of oil so I could add it next time.

As a guy who changed his own oil and does all his own maintenance, I can say, I feel conflicted by all this. But whatever, not my money!


You must work for the same company that I do!
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even if your filter goes straight up and you fill the filter there is still a certain amount of oil that is lost up on top of the filter and you cant fill the filter up totally either. I spend lots of time in engine rebuilding seminars because i own a certified engine rebuilding shop..
Hey maybe the engine makers and the engine rebuilding associations and the people that design engines are all wrong.
 
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JOD has the idea and is correct
I just looked in an owners manual for a 96 Plymouth voyager and it says to change the filter every other oil change.
 
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