I did recently after discovering a Neutra dealer in Shreveport. I ran it for at least 1-2,000 miles. No ill effects but it seemed to clean about the same as arx did. I will try it again in this fill as the last one had a little LC in, as well.
Startling Neutra Oil Flush Results!
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IMHO, seems Frank was just saying to email/contact the products manufacturer to see what they said, nothing more. I didn't see a cheap shot.
As we all know, the bottle, or some of the websites or printed data don't always provide the latest/greatest info on product use.
As we all know, the bottle, or some of the websites or printed data don't always provide the latest/greatest info on product use.
Franks product is great but that quote isn't. If you can't read 'you might as well' into that, you just choose not too.
Just for fun, I went back to page 176 on the additive forum dating to around 2002 and worked my way forward to dig up Neutra discussions. Forget searching. Very entertaining in general if one has the time and no life. Like me.
The original Bob was generally very enthusiastic about N131 in all applications including vacuum line feed for CC cleaning.
I am SURELY no chemist but the N-Butyl and CA from what I was able to glean are the apparent precursors which form the synthetic ester which in the host cranckase oil performs the cleaning and antioxidant effects. Whew! For a minute there I thought my Neutra application habits had ruined my 200k 4 bangers and might actually force my hand on a new car purchase. Panic subsiding now.... PS. IMHO, give the ARX Frank a break.
I've purchased ARX and like the product. No hate for Frank. I just thought that N131 deserved the same break, especially from a competitor. I'm done. Glad the N131 worked for you. Sounds like a nice product for an engine that's not very gunked.
Rick20. Now I'm wondering about Neutra in the oil at even a low or recommended dose if your take on it is correct. I do recall numerous posts on it here stating many have used it as such and for even longer periods and higher doses without harm. Also, why would the company recommend it for that use if the risk of harm and their possible liability existed? I wonder if a Schaeffer's rep could comment on your concerns. Also, what technically would be wrong with the butanol's effect on a host oil? The MSDS states that N-Butyl is 10-12% of total volume. So at a 4 oz treat rate that would be about 1/2 oz of N-Butyl in a 4 qt sump. Excessive? Thanks.
MolaKule
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I think Neutra and LC are both good solvent-based products for general cleaning, but ARX has my vote when it comes to cleaning the ring packs and increasing compression in a dirty engine.
@ one once per quart of oil the amount of crysilic acid and butanol are too small to cause any harm. Those of us that have been on this site for a number of years have seen some huge volumes of 131 put through a crankcase just to prove a point. In all cases even when an entire bottle of 131 was added the slight pump in wear numbers was minor. In one case Bob put a much larger dose then recomended in the crankcase then drove the car for 10,000 miles on that fill. It was nothing at all like what you would expect if you dumped a quart of kerosine of B12 Chemtool in the crancase and drove around!
To remove heavy sludge and varnish Molakule used to recomend putting an entire bottle of 131 in the vechile and driveing it (pre auto-rx). Usualy within 500 miles you could notice a huge improvment in the engine and the sludge removal.
I like Auto-RX and use the product. I do though think that it is silly to think that 131 or LC can not be used to clean an engine!Auto-Rx is not the only game in town.
To remove heavy sludge and varnish Molakule used to recomend putting an entire bottle of 131 in the vechile and driveing it (pre auto-rx). Usualy within 500 miles you could notice a huge improvment in the engine and the sludge removal.
I like Auto-RX and use the product. I do though think that it is silly to think that 131 or LC can not be used to clean an engine!Auto-Rx is not the only game in town.
I've used both Neutra and Auto RX. I tried the ARX to see if it would help stop a small power steering leak that I had. I put a couple ounces in the power steering and ran it for a couple of months and then changed out the power steering fluid. The leak is worse today than it was when I started so I couldn't see any improvement after trying the ARX and I really didn't see much change in fluid color during the time I was using it or in the rinse fluid either.
I've used Neutra in my crankcase, transmission and fuel. I have a very clean (spotless) top end after 200k miles. I don't know how much Neutra gets credit (if any) as I've often used synthetic oils but I'll buy more Neutra and don't believe I'll buy any more ARX.
Should have asked for my money back on the ARX as it didn't work as advertised but I haven't so far. Bottom line is I believe Neutra will perform as well as or better than ARX and is much less expensive when purchased by the gallon or more.
I've used Neutra in my crankcase, transmission and fuel. I have a very clean (spotless) top end after 200k miles. I don't know how much Neutra gets credit (if any) as I've often used synthetic oils but I'll buy more Neutra and don't believe I'll buy any more ARX.
Should have asked for my money back on the ARX as it didn't work as advertised but I haven't so far. Bottom line is I believe Neutra will perform as well as or better than ARX and is much less expensive when purchased by the gallon or more.
Thanks, JohnBrowning. Your post seems to be the confirmation of my earlier research efforts. I have all four of the primary non-OTC additives most often mentioned on this board, LC20, FP60, ARX, and N131. I have used them according to instructions (maybe a little more, 1.5x the recommended treat rate or so) because my rides were well worn (out) and sometimes I just like to live on the edge. Insert here 'nothing to lose.' So far, so good. To be honest, the ARX results were so good on all of the cars/trucks to my uninformed eye that I tend to hoard it rather than use it.
Putty knife can remove paint. Paint thinner can remove paint. Using "The One" logic, putty knife is akin to paint thinner. Maybe if you put a putty knife in the crankcase, rings will never get stuck.
To be honest, that paint thinner crack really makes me question that first purchase of Auto-RX I was planning for my Volvo.... I don't think it takes away from the cleaning power of the product, but it does tend to leave a bad taste.... I still want to try it, but I could have not read that just the same
I have been a long time user of Auto-Rx and it has always worked great for me the only thing I can say about Auto-Rx is try its guaranteed how can you go wrong.
The One:
When you suggest that AutoRX is akin to a solvent you have just begun the story, not ended it. Without some additional information as to what sort of reasoning would result in such a conclusion, I am left having to discount your position.
cougfan:
If an unsubstantiated "crack" influences your purchasing decisions, be prepared to do a lot of second guessing.
When you suggest that AutoRX is akin to a solvent you have just begun the story, not ended it. Without some additional information as to what sort of reasoning would result in such a conclusion, I am left having to discount your position.
cougfan:
If an unsubstantiated "crack" influences your purchasing decisions, be prepared to do a lot of second guessing.
BrianWC:
Thankyou, I was out of line.
The One:
I offer my appoligies. I misunderstood your position.
To All:
The MSDS sheet for Shaeffers #292 lists butanol at up to 12%. I would consider butanol as an organic solvent with a fairly large water holding capacity. It is not your typical paint thinner, but it is close. The MSDS also lists 0.6% cresylic acid. This component is also known as coal tar acids. It is a mix of methylated phenolics (including toluene, which is paint thinner). However, at less than 1%, I would not be comfortable defending #292 as paint thinner. I would not see AutoRX and #292 as identical products, but I can see how they are "akin". I can also see how they are also different.
Thankyou, I was out of line.
The One:
I offer my appoligies. I misunderstood your position.
To All:
The MSDS sheet for Shaeffers #292 lists butanol at up to 12%. I would consider butanol as an organic solvent with a fairly large water holding capacity. It is not your typical paint thinner, but it is close. The MSDS also lists 0.6% cresylic acid. This component is also known as coal tar acids. It is a mix of methylated phenolics (including toluene, which is paint thinner). However, at less than 1%, I would not be comfortable defending #292 as paint thinner. I would not see AutoRX and #292 as identical products, but I can see how they are "akin". I can also see how they are also different.
GMorg:
Unsubstantiated cracks never bother me, however, unprovoked ones do...
I am certainly guilty of not frequenting a place of business because of poor service/attitudes. I am equally guilty of frequenting local establishments and paying higher prices for superior service. I don't recall second guessing this position in the past and I do not do so now. But with that said, I do enjoy reading your opinions on this site and hope you have a great day!
Unsubstantiated cracks never bother me, however, unprovoked ones do...
I am certainly guilty of not frequenting a place of business because of poor service/attitudes. I am equally guilty of frequenting local establishments and paying higher prices for superior service. I don't recall second guessing this position in the past and I do not do so now. But with that said, I do enjoy reading your opinions on this site and hope you have a great day!
I agree with the following completely.Since i have worked with solvents in both industry and chlorinated parafinns in friction reducers in auto-industry (X-!R) have hands on knowledge of both.
The One:
To All:
The MSDS sheet for Shaeffers #292 lists butanol at up to 12%. I would consider butanol as an organic solvent with a fairly large water holding capacity. It is not your typical paint thinner, but it is close. The MSDS also lists 0.6% cresylic acid. This component is also known as coal tar acids. It is a mix of methylated phenolics (including toluene, which is paint thinner). However, at less than 1%, I would not be comfortable defending #292 as paint thinner. I would not see AutoRX and #292 as identical products, but I can see how they are "akin". I can also see how they are also different.
You bet there different. My health issues came from working with solvents and lc chlorinated paraffins
MolaKule Quote I think Neutra and LC are both good solvent-based products for general cleaning, but ARX has my vote when it comes to cleaning the ring packs and increasing compression in a dirty engine.
Auto-Rx holds an application patent for non hazardous cleaning of metal. Use what you want just don't confuse Auto-Rx with solvent or l/c chlorinated products.
The One:
To All:
The MSDS sheet for Shaeffers #292 lists butanol at up to 12%. I would consider butanol as an organic solvent with a fairly large water holding capacity. It is not your typical paint thinner, but it is close. The MSDS also lists 0.6% cresylic acid. This component is also known as coal tar acids. It is a mix of methylated phenolics (including toluene, which is paint thinner). However, at less than 1%, I would not be comfortable defending #292 as paint thinner. I would not see AutoRX and #292 as identical products, but I can see how they are "akin". I can also see how they are also different.
You bet there different. My health issues came from working with solvents and lc chlorinated paraffins
MolaKule Quote I think Neutra and LC are both good solvent-based products for general cleaning, but ARX has my vote when it comes to cleaning the ring packs and increasing compression in a dirty engine.
Auto-Rx holds an application patent for non hazardous cleaning of metal. Use what you want just don't confuse Auto-Rx with solvent or l/c chlorinated products.
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