Short trips and sub-zero temps. I can't win!!!

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Saturn_Fan

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As posted in another thread I started, my wife's 08 Corolla is a short tripper. 8.5 miles to work and little weekend use.

In the summer/fall/spring already decided to do a 3 month OCI with respected name conventionals, but in winter time it seems like I'll be wasting perfectly good synthetic because of her driving regimen.

It gets -10F here routinely and for probably 15-20 days you'll see -25F without wind chill, so the need for a full synthetic is essential. I love Pennzoil yellow bottle and Mobil Clean 5000, but I am not running that in those temps.

It just sucks that I have to do what basically seems very wasteful; that is dumping 5-8 buck per quart synthetic in the winter because of how short the trips are. I am worried about condensation big time here and is the reason for the worry.

Any thoughts as to whether I could go 6 months with a high end synth like Amsoil's marvelous 0w-30 or will the oil be spent due to fuel dilution/condensation?

Thanks guys!
 
The SSO will work just fine, but is expensive. Another thought is to run your favorite oil and substitute 1 qt of oil with a qt of MMO. You will be amazed at how well the engine will fire up in the cold with the MMO added to it. Not to mention the cleaning it will do. I've done this many times with good results.
 
8.5 miles isn't that short, in my opinion.
Also, it sounds like about 5-6 K miles a year. I would easily run synth 6 months to a year with that low mileage.
The owners manual on my last car said to change oil at least once a year if the mileage was less than X. (I think 5000 miles.)
I did it every 6 months.
 
Her engine can not feel wind chill so don't worry about that.

Plenty of engines up in your area ARE RUNNING conventional 5w-20/30 with no problems.

If you tell her to take it easy for the first few miles/minutes you'll be fine.

What is the pour point of Pennzoil YB? Well below -10 or -25f.
wink.gif


I've had Castrol GTX 5w30 in temps around what you are describing in my Corolla and the UOA came back with a TBN of 4.4 after 5.8k miles.

I know UOAs do not prove anything (according to the new BITOG) and conventional oil stinks below 30 degrees (again according to the new BITOG) but I've seen MANY motors (incl mine) go hundreds of thousands (incl 370k on the Jetta) with yesterdays conventional oils.

Todays oils are better. But what do I know...

I'd also rather change out the condensation and by products too. You are correct that 8.5 miles is a short trip (esp during the winter)

My 3 cents. Not worth much to most here...

Take care, bill
 
By gum!!! It's good to hear from you Bill. The other day I was pondering where you had gone - your posts are always a joy to read!

You are bitogs most excellent nonsense filter! ( i had another kind of filter in mind but..) The fine folks that manufacture conventional oils owe you....

Now, just where did pscholte go......
 
Bill, those who know which people are respectable members, know that you are one of them. I take your 3 cents very seriously
thumbsup2.gif


As Bill mentioned, you don't "need" a syn oil, you just prefer one. MC5000 or PYB will serve you well. If you're not comfortable with that, PP is sold at Walmart for 20/5qt jug.
 
Originally Posted By: pbm
SF: I think you would be fine with PYB 5w20 in those conditions.


The pour point for synthetic oil is around 10-15 degrees colder than the average dino. of the same wt.
 
My wife's Acura showed good UOA's with PZYB 5w-20 in this kind of service. We get a significant number of -30C days and tons of -20C days in the winter here.

I stuck to 4-5k mile OCI's in this service (the Acura was a fuel diluter), and I suspect your car will last a long time on this regimen like bill said.
 
I used to do a lot of short trips in the winter and used Valvoline 5w30 for a couple of years with no issues at all. I've also used Amsoil 5w30 and Pennzoil Platinum 5w30 with lots of short trips in the winter with no problems.
 
There are oil warmers available that require no permanent modifications or significant expense. It's a no brainer, really.
 
Walmart recently had $20 jug of PP with a $15 Walmart gift card. That would make it cheaper than just about any conventional you could buy. I waste a lot of good synthetic oil. My car burns 4 quarts per 3,000. I just buy what is on sale for the most part. Work is 4 miles away and the speed limit is 30 mph most days. But it sounds like it will not matter if you just follow what others have recommended.
 
Originally Posted By: river_rat
8.5 miles isn't that short, in my opinion.


+1

Now mine is short.

1 mile to a parking lot each weekday all winter. Drive home 1 miles each night.
 
My wife is in the same situation, but our winter temps run zero to about 30 degrees most of the time....so we aren't quiet as cold. Anyway, we have one of those handy little 100k extended warranties on our 4Runner and need to stay on the regime. For us, it is Mobil 1, 0w30....year around on 6 month OCI's. With short trips and cold driving conditions, it is only synthetic for us. In my son's Accent and my daughter's Yaris, we will do 0w20 every 6 months. In my other son's Rabbit, it is Castrol 5w40 every 6 months.
 
Originally Posted By: Bill in Utah
Her engine can not feel wind chill so don't worry about that.

Plenty of engines up in your area ARE RUNNING conventional 5w-20/30 with no problems.

If you tell her to take it easy for the first few miles/minutes you'll be fine.

What is the pour point of Pennzoil YB? Well below -10 or -25f.
wink.gif


I've had Castrol GTX 5w30 in temps around what you are describing in my Corolla and the UOA came back with a TBN of 4.4 after 5.8k miles.

I know UOAs do not prove anything (according to the new BITOG) and conventional oil stinks below 30 degrees (again according to the new BITOG) but I've seen MANY motors (incl mine) go hundreds of thousands (incl 370k on the Jetta) with yesterdays conventional oils.

Todays oils are better. But what do I know...

I'd also rather change out the condensation and by products too. You are correct that 8.5 miles is a short trip (esp during the winter)

My 3 cents. Not worth much to most here...

Take care, bill


Hi Bill!

Long time no see. I took a hiatus from the board for awhile, but I am now back full time. Anyways, good to talk to you again.

You and Gary Allan remain a couple of my favorite posters, so I do value what you say. That, coupled with the fact you have the same vehicle I do is stands out with me.

I think it was your posts and UOAs that got me on the Pennzoil,
MC5000, whatever SM dino is on sale bandwagon and it has worked for me thus far.

I just get this idea in my brain that 5w30 dino has the consistency of molasses below 0, but I realize it does not.

Take care,

Jon in WI

ETA: I have noticed a dozen posts here recently that say "UOA's are not indicative of an oil's performance". What the heck is going on around here?
21.gif
 
Originally Posted By: 21Rouge
Originally Posted By: river_rat
8.5 miles isn't that short, in my opinion.


+1

Now mine is short.

1 mile to a parking lot each weekday all winter. Drive home 1 miles each night.


Wow! I could not bring myself to shut her down after a mile or an even three. I would make myself take a bit longer road, but I have oil OCD. LOL
 
Originally Posted By: tig1
Originally Posted By: pbm
SF: I think you would be fine with PYB 5w20 in those conditions.


The pour point for synthetic oil is around 10-15 degrees colder than the average dino. of the same wt.


Pennzoil conventional oil specs

39 BELOW zero pour point for 5w30.

Mobil 1 (your brand) specs

48 BELOW zero pour point for 5w30 (and I find it interesting that Mobil 1 does not even list cold pour points on some of its oils...)

In his car at those temps very little to no difference. With either oil I'd make sure I warm up (not by idling but be operating it easy) slowly not for the engine but the rest of the car. As -25 below I've seen some "interesting" things happen to suspension parts. (and windshields, doors, mirrors, etc)

Take care, Bill
 
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