possible to improve HANDLING of a 2007 Corolla ??

[mareakin]

I tried to PLUS-ZERO size the wheels/tire from an OEM Steel Wheel (15"X6" , 18 or 19lbs , +45mm offset) wrapped with a Goodyear Integrity 185/65/15 tire (weighs 18lbs) TO --> an Alloy VOXX Monza Wheel (15"X7" , 19 lbs , +38mm offset) Wrapped by a Goodyear TripleTred 205/60/15 (weighs 25 lbs) tire.

I obviously did it wrong because I did not like the results at all. I increased the unsprung weight at least 40 lbs. Everytime I would hit a bump the car would jump up thus losing contact with the road (this, I suppose is the opposite of good handling.) The tires are a good 30mm wider but this does not appear to do me much good as the contact patch appears to be just marginally wider.

I got sick of this heavy wheel/tire combo and currently I am riding on a set of Motegi SP10's (15"X7" , 14.4 lbs , +42mm offset) wrapped by General Altimax HP 195/60/15's (only 17 lbs)

I'm fairly OK with this 3rd wheel/tire combo but I still want to experiment with other ways I can improve the car's handling.

Question is, how?

And, what are the pitfalls (ie, the Unintended Consequences)

What should I be careful about?

 

[JHZR2]

Youre starting with a corolla... that is your first problem. Unsprung weight is always a bad thing, and Im not sure if changing the offset is doing anything for you.

 

[mareakin]

"modifying your suspension is like playing with a Rubic's Cube: An improvement in one area may mean a degradation in another. Modifications should be small and taken one step at a time. Also know that Conventional Wisdom is often wrong. Many (incorrectly) subscribe to the theory: the stiffer, the better. But the secret for good handling is—as soft as possible, as firm as necessary. Too stiff can handle worse than too soft!"

 

[gathermewool]

I'm not sure why you're going with wheels and rims first for handling. Is it the matrix that shares the same platform as the corrola? Maybe look into awapping struts and sways. This will give you the biggest bang for the buck. Down side of just sways might be outside wheel lifting on a hard corner if the sway is too stiff - shouldn't be a problem if you can swap parts with a matrix.

If you go aftermarket don't go crazy. I'd think a little thicker sways would make a big difference

 

[LS2JSTS]

Yeah, there is a sure fire way to improve your Corrolas handling. Trade it in on a Porsche Cayenne, you'll be riding on rails.

 

[CharlieJ]

Sway bars

 

[cos]

Do a search for Corolla forum, there should be some info to help you. The usual tricks are a bigger rear sway bar, better shocks, lower springs and poly bushings. Of course you do have a car that not to many owners mod, unlike a Mustang or Civic, so the aftermarket offerings will be limited.

 

[ryan2022]

Of course there is.

First thing I would do, is go on a toyota website and find out the sizes of the XR-S sway bars.

If they fit your car, I would check the dealer for pricing. Youd be surprised at how cheap they can be.

On a FWD car the rear bar will be most noticeable on turn in response and balance.

Also, look into upgrading the struts to a non-adjustable performance strut. You can go with adjustables but that really increases the price. Look into Tokico HP's for a decent budget strut.

Unfortunately your choice in rubber might not have helped you a lot, but you can work with them.

Take a look at what your recommended tire pressure is, and run it at the upper limit, or 5 psi overfilled, but no more.

This will take some of the roll out of the tire. I think the Triple tred is a "t" rated tire, so you wont have a ton of sidewall stiffness. This should help.

So basically, you should be able to upgrade your cars handling for under $800 or so. If money is tight, head to summit racing online, and instead of the sway bars, upgrade the front and rear sway bar bushings to poly urethane... roughly $20.

Have fun!

BTW: a firmer strut will really help with the negative effects of the unsprung wieght increase.

 

[ryan2022]

here is a quick glimpse of
some of the options for your car.

There is lots for Toyotas.

The Tokicos were less than Id thought for youre car.
If youve got big bucks, koni or bilstein are excellent.

http://www.shox.com/appguide/shoxshop/productsdisplay.php

 

[bepperb]

I think it's worth pointing out that the tripletreads aren't a great handling tire. No 600+ treadwear all season tire will be.

If it were mine, I'd look into keeping your third, current wheel/tire combo. See what you can get for OEM rear (and maybe front) anti roll bars, and see about a strut tower brace. You can probably hit both of those for 100 bucks apiece.

 

[IndyIan]

What are you looking to change about the handling? What's bothering you now?

I'll assume the car understeers too much.
Your fixes could be:
Slotting front struts to increase negative camber.
Adding some front toe out.
Adding some rear toe out.
Stiffer rear springs.
Stiffer rear sway bar.
Reducing rear negative camber.
Adding front tire pressure.
Reducing rear tire pressure.

I have 15 year old soft springs on my Neon and no budget for new springs and struts but was getting lots of understeer autocrossing. So I added some front camber, some front toe out, increased front tire pressure, and added a rear sway bar. It still leans alot but is now as neutral as I want it for the street and for fast slalom sections.
On ramps I can feel that the back tire is working pretty much equally with the front tire instead of the front taking most of the load. Feels alot better to me and I got a bit quicker on the autocross course.

 

[Kaboomba]

Your bouncing problem is probably from changing offset and/or running tire pressures that are too high for the new larger contact patch. There may be people on the Toyota or Corolla forums who know what the new pressure should be, but the only way to know FOR SURE is through trial and error.

In order of less cost/pain/hassle factor to more

1. Top-notch tires (Bridgestone Potenza RE960AS for year-round and whatever awesome thing you can find for summer)
2. Anti-sway bars front and rear + polyurethane bushings
3. Performance struts and shocks
4. Lowering springs. Eibach maybe? They are premium.
4b. Alignment done and adjusted for mods
5. Camber plates/other hardware to correct any bump-steer that might be introduced by 1-4
6. Shock/strut tower braces
7. Subframe improvements

 

[d00df00d]

Originally Posted By: LS2JSTS
Yeah, there is a sure fire way to improve your Corrolas handling. Trade it in on a Porsche Cayenne, you'll be riding on rails.

Wow. Never thought I would see someone hold up the worst handling Porsche ever made as an exemplar of good handling....

On a serious note, I actually prefer the agility of a well sorted econobox to the numb, brute grip of a large sporty vehicle. I'd take a (manual) Corolla over a Cayenne in a heartbeat...

 

[ueberooo]

Originally Posted By: d00df00d
Originally Posted By: LS2JSTS
Yeah, there is a sure fire way to improve your Corrolas handling. Trade it in on a Porsche Cayenne, you'll be riding on rails.

Wow. Never thought I would see someone hold up the worst handling Porsche ever made as an exemplar of good handling.


I was going to suggest you trade it in with a porsche 911. If that's not enough room maybe a subaru legacy wagon.

 

[Bill in Utah]

As a owner of a Corolla I bought it for dependable, safe and economical transportation.

If I wanted a true handling vehicle, I'd go for the other car that starts with a "C".

Corvette.

While it "handles" well, it will NEVER (nor should be) in a league of a Handling car. To ME spending ANY $$ on improving a Corolla (or Civic, or any other vehicle of this type) is a WASTE of $$.

Just my 3 cents.

 

[pcfxer]

You may want to hear what I have to say because I have competed in Formula SAE and was the Suspension Team Leader for my team.

The easiest upgrade is to purchase higher performance tires. Typically when you upgrade your tires however, you will also increase your unsprung weight. Unsprung weight is neat in that to increase the acceleration (reduce the time for suspension to react to a an acting force), you reduce it. Heh, easier said than done eh?

Rolling raidus is your friend. If you decrease the rolling radius you will increase the acceleration of the vehicle and this will also impact the dynamics of the car improving turn-in and reduces unsprung weight assuming all other things are equal.

I typically don't recommend changing sway bars previous to other methods (tire pressure adjustment PROPERLY) because it can create some seriously unleashed forces under tension -> "snap out oversteer" and "no point of return understeer". A lot of 'street tuners' hit this wall for performance often enough for me to get quite passionate about spouting as much truth as possible. BIG wheels is stupid, but that's another topic.

Your comment about how the car 'jumped up' over a bump may indicate that your spring/damper combination doesn't provide enough rebound in light/medium/heavy jounce scenarios. I doubt the car lost grip and if it did you should probably slow down and stop hitting such large bumps.

.

Best thing to do on a corolla with my experience in prepping a corolla for auto-x (1998) was to swap to B&G springs (1/4 coil cut from front, BUT don't do this unless you can analyze your system) and KYB GR2s. I'm certain upgrading your dampers/springs will provide the handling you would like to see from your car.

Afterwards or pre-sway bars, you may consider upgrading to urethane bushings. Outside of longer life, bushings flex less and everything that flexes in a suspension system is represented as a spring. For the best handling we typically try to eliminate these "springs" and encapsulate and control flex as much as possible.

Anyway, good luck, it is possible to get a competitive corolla on the track with some proper know-how.

 

[cchase]

I've read in multiple places that dropping a car by an inch is the equivalent of adding 50mm to the tire width. Might be something to consider.

 

[L_Sludger]

I'll second, third, fourth, fifth and possibly sixth the motion for sway bars.

 

[Mr Nice]

Trade it in for any 2 door BMW

 

[LS2JSTS]

Originally Posted By: d00df00d
Originally Posted By: LS2JSTS
Yeah, there is a sure fire way to improve your Corrolas handling. Trade it in on a Porsche Cayenne, you'll be riding on rails.

Wow. Never thought I would see someone hold up the worst handling Porsche ever made as an exemplar of good handling....

On a serious note, I actually prefer the agility of a well sorted econobox to the numb, brute grip of a large sporty vehicle. I'd take a (manual) Corolla over a Cayenne in a heartbeat...


LOL....you are so right dood, I meant to say the Cayman....must have snow and 4wd on my mind.