Opposite question to the Pennzoil/QS ones.....

[addyguy]

On this board, we have seen lots of questions about whether Pennzoil/QS oils cause sludge, b/c of problems they had years ago that have persisted as stories to the present day.

I worked at a W-M LOF counter for a couple of years, we used Pennzoil, and none of the techs, young or old, liked it much. They all said in general that it was crap..etc...

When asked what kind of oil they liked and used, almost all of them said 'Valvoline' without hesitating. In a similar vein, a lot of people who came to the shop, and specified what oil they wanted, chose Valvoline as well.

Just like where did the penn/QS sludge rep come from, where did the idea that Valvoline is so good come from? Is/was it really that superior of an oil that it didn't cause problems as much as other oils? Or was it just good marketing on V's part?

 

[Black Thunder]

i'm guessing that Pennzoil used to be bad....so people are set in saying that it is.

Same with Valvoline, probably used to be good, now its not so hot.

 

[J. A. Rizzo]

I'm voting for the marketing. "People who know use Valvoline" is their slogan, right? Sounds pretty good. Can you name any other oil slogans? Just like AutoRX marketers log onto car/truck/oil forums and spout B.S. "testimonials" about how well the product works, the marketing works for Valvoline as well. How many of these old sludge stories trace their history back to the bad old days of 10W-40 oils all turning into sludge in the 70's? Why did they stick to Pennzoil and QS and not Valvoline? Marketing.

 

[2004 F150 4x4]

If Pennzoil was as bad as everyone says you could'nt get home tonite for all the sludged up broken down cars. I have used it off and on since 1981 and I have never had an oil related failure. Period. I agree that Valvoline slogan about more mechanincs use Valvoline that any other or whatever probably has some people fooled. Some of these people should know better some don't.
My .02

 

[HondaMan]

I am half way past the big 30 ... the whole PZ has 'wax' thing started way back then when I was in my early teens ... Valvoline was more expensive at the time, I remember that well and they had just introduced their 20W50 'Racing' bottle.

Valvoline has run their 'People who know' ad for all these years, maybe this has just stuck with people.

I was shown a video in my small engine repair class in high school where they where running these really big engines in a plant and the oil reserves (sumps) where these big clear drums .... they showed how their 'former' oil left the drums with a dingy coating and their new oil did not.
They did not mention any oil by name, but we were all told the sorry oil was PZ.

 

[TR3-2001SE]

I am old enough to remember how bad quaker state oil was in the 60-70's. It was bad news during that time and I think this is why it is not very popular today. I switched to Castrol because of their support for SCCA racing at the time and the difference was very significant. Never used Penzoil so can't comment on it but would never use quaker state again. It was thin as water and sludged badly.

 

[ddean]

QS had a major problem back in the mid 1970's with smog engines sludging up badly, as in during or just after the warranty period for the car (2-3 yrs, 24-36K miles). QS said that nothing was wrong with their oil and paid out nothing in warranty claims. Also had a problem back during the mid to late 1980's.

Interestingly my 1986 Buick Century "pre" 3800 ran 139K miles on QS and is the cleanest motor that I have seen. Only a bit of soft, black, greasy sludge on a few spots on several rocker arms and the pushrods, and a light orange varnish on aluminum parts.

Currently running MC 5w30 last 9K miles to help a sometimes leaky lifter, which pumps up and quiets down in mile or two on the coldest mornings. With 5w30 QS it was noisy up to 5 miles.

From all that I have read on this forum, Valvoline is no better than QS/PZL, and if anything, inferior except for the Maxlife Synthetic and Maxlife (really a PAO blend).

[ December 22, 2005, 10:15 PM: Message edited by: ddean ]

 

[Slick17601]

Please, please, please let the "Pennzoil produces sludge mentality die"!

 

[ToyotaNSaturn]

Rizzo said: "Just like AutoRX marketers log onto car/truck/oil forums and spout B.S. "testimonials" about how well the product works,"

B.S.?? You're treading in rough water with that statement. I saw first hand how much better my car ran with Auto-RX. If it's B.S., then why did it work in my car? Evidently, it's not B.S.

addyguy, Pennzoil got the bad rap with the lesser quality oils from the past (as did Quaker State). Oils today are soooooo much more robust. Technology has helped the quality of oil exponentially in the last 10-15 years.

Another thing that doesn't get mentioned is the emissions regulations that demanded more from older oil formulations. So sludge was more likely, with almost ANY oil back then. Fast forward to now, only a handful of suspect "sludgey" engine designs exist. I know first hand, I recently owned one!

Good luck convincing them of fact over marketing. Challenge them with evidence of an oil analysis to base their opinions upon. They'll quickly see that most any SL or SM rated oil will easily go 3-4000 miles per oil change without problems. We all have our favorite oils, which is fine and all, but admission of fact takes alot of the marketing blah blah out of the equation.

 

[Mr Magoo]

Alot of people make their buying decisions based on marketing & TV advertising.


If Earnhardt Jr uses Fram oil filters and Slick 50 in his car.....that what I want to use in my car.

 

[pbm]

If I bought a new car and was offered a lifetime supply of dino oil (fantasy of course) Pennzoil would be my first choice. Havoline would be a very close second. If the choice was between Pennzoil, QS and Valvoline AC I would choose in that order.

 

[Triple_Se7en]

Quote:
-----
If Earnhardt Jr uses Fram oil filters and Slick 50 in his car.....that's what I want to use in my car.

Earnhardt gets a new vehicle every year or two. Why should he care what supplement or filter is in it?

Besides, if you paid me enough in a product endorsement & I knew the product was serviceable/mediocre, I would say it worked fine also.

 

[dave1251]

Triple_Se7en
Member
Member # 5626

posted 25 December, 2005 23:00
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Quote:
-----
If Earnhardt Jr uses Fram oil filters and Slick 50 in his car.....that's what I want to use in my car.

Earnhardt gets a new vehicle every year or two. Why should he care what supplement or filter is in it?

Besides, if you paid me enough in a product endorsement & I knew the product was serviceable/mediocre, I would say it worked fine also.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posts: 1330 | From: Southeast Michiganistan | Registered: Dec 2004 | IP: Logged |

And trips you would not be fibbing because these products work fine. But there are better out there.

 

[Chris 2421]

I have used Quaker State most of my "oil change history" in my own cars.Nothing and I repeat NOTHING is wrong with it.

Yes they did have a problem in the mid 70's.It was due to a additive package they were buying from another oil mfgr.They caught the problem and they did pay for engine damage,although Quaker State's reputation was hurt as well.I still use Quaker State when I can find it(I use 15w40 in all of my vehicles)but now it's usually Mobil Delvac.

I used Quaker State in my race cars,and never had a problem with any of my engines,nor the Fram filters they had on them either.

 

[Dark Jedi]

I have used Pennzoil in most of my vehicles. one was a 95 2.3l ranger. engine had over 70,000 on the clock and never burned, used oil. never saw any sign of sludge in it.I guess its like people that dont like fram. I used fram filters for years and never had no troubles with it. I switched because I saw how they are built from posts in here.but as far as my engines went. I dont see a prob with fram as long as you stay the 3,000 OC. I would not have a prob using pennzoil in my vehicle but I want to see what else is out there. I have used M-1 5w30 in the last 2 OC on my dakota but gas mileage has gone down from using pennzoil. I dont know if its the oil or what. but I am going to try some GC this time and see if the engine likes the thicker weight oil.

 

[csandste]

I think both Pennzoil and QS outsell Valvoline so SOPUS's marketing can't be that bad. There was a post on here talking about QS and Pennzoil having very similar can designs for detergent and non-detergent oils back in the fifties and early sixties. I think some of the sludge stories can be traced to people putting non-detergent oil to save a few bucks.

 

[Ray H]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Slick17601:
Please, please, please let the "Pennzoil produces sludge mentality die"!

---

Whatever for? That, and bashing QS for the same "reason", would permanently elliminate the second and third most popular urban-myth topics on BITOG.

(My driving days began in 1961. Oils of that decade, the next two, and all prior decades were known for sludging - it was an accepted fact of life and it made NO difference what brand, either. Once Group II and Group III base oils came to the forefront as reasonably priced blending agents, the situation finally made a sea change. But, it's always fashionable on this site to keep resurrecting Grampa's and Uncle Ernie's favorite stories for the ill-informed to at least appear knowledgeable.)