Oil weight question for 2009 Challenger

[pwr2tow]

I have a 2009 Dodge Challenger R/T Classic with the 5.7 Hemi and auto transmission. It has MDS and the owners manual states to use 5-20 oil for the MDS to work properly. I drive normal most of the time but do go WOT at least once every 100 miles of drive time. Now WOT maybe just to spin the tires or a blast up to 80 MPH but rarely over that speed. A 1/4 mile WOT about every 200 miles.

I know about fluid dynamics and lower weight oils flowing faster to mechanical parts at WOT. I know these engines are set up with tighter clearances than yesteryears engines. I do use NAPA synthetic 5-20. I change oil and filter (NAPA Gold) every 5,000 miles. Cold weather climate does not matter since I park it for the winter.

My question is with the type of driving I do would my engine be better off using a heavier weight oil such as 5-30, 0-30, 0-40? Rotella synthetic 5-40?

Any information about these engines or oil in performance engines would be greatly appreciated.

Thank You,

 

[2oldtommy]

Do NOT use any oil Vis other than 5-20 in this engine. You are right on with your present choice. Stick with it. FWIW Oldtommy

 

[Rand]

Originally Posted By: pwr2tow
=It has MDS and the owners manual states to use 5-20 oil for the MDS to work properly.



that would be enough for me right there.

That being said a thin 30weight like castrol edge isnt much thicker and should work fine.

something like maxlife probably not.

 

[SLJ2137694]

I don't see any reason why you should consider anything other than what the manufacturers engineering staff says you should use. Performance engines, and yours is not one of them, are generally set up with looser tolerances in the bearings and other areas that would require a higher weight oil. These engines usually turn very high RPM and have a much higher output than your regular production stock engine.

 

[pwr2tow]

O.K. thanks for the information so far, not much technical infor but at least the pep talk makes me feel better.

I should have included I don't care about the MDS working, all cylinders firing sounds better anyhow.

Now if the MDS is not working because of parasitic fluid flow that would mean a liter weight oil would be better. Which is the case I beleive.

Really just seeing what other have to say and would use in this situation.

Thanks for the replys so far.

 

[HTSS_TR]

If cost is not a real concern for you, Redline 5W20 with high HTHS is the one you like to try in your engine.

 

[zulu]

You'll care about the MDS working properly if you develop a problem. Trust me.

0/5W-20 oils... period. A lifetime powertrain warranty depends on it.

 

[ARCOgraphite]

Ive seen some highe mileage engine 5w-20s on the shelf that would be at the bottom of the 30wt vis if that would move you into a comfort zone. If it were mine, id be trying the redline. The Ester base oils will give you very nice piston skirt lube and maybe a few HP to boot. I hope you have a good running SB hemi, I havent met one on the road yet though.

 

[pwr2tow]

Originally Posted By: zulu
You'll care about the MDS working properly if you develop a problem. Trust me.

0/5W-20 oils... period. A lifetime powertrain warranty depends on it.


Just to clarify, The MDS is an ECM program that shuts down 4 cylinder out of the eight so basically your running a 4 cylinder car when it kicks in. This is only for MPG improvement. There is nothing mechanical different between the MDS engine and non MDS engine. Now the newer eagle engine has VVT which is different than the old old MDS and non MDS engines but don't confuse VVT and MDS.

Lifetime powertrain warranty is a small concern but I cann't see myself keeping it as I'm addicted to power and even a minor exhaust improvement could void your warranty if the dealership decides they want to. The dealership has the discrepancy to void or honor a warranty and the manufacturer usually goes along with the dealerships decision. Have never heard of a warranty being reversed by the company after the dealership has void a warranty. I've experienced warranty on other vehicles and the dealerships seem to be in void mode for anything.

 

[pwr2tow]

Originally Posted By: HTSS_TR
If cost is not a real concern for you, Redline 5W20 with high HTHS is the one you like to try in your engine.


I do want what's best for my engine but if a lower costing oil will perform just as well then a lower costing oil will leave more money for other add on goodies.

Thanks for the come back, I'll be adding this to my recommendation list.

 

[pwr2tow]

Originally Posted By: ARCOgraphite
Ive seen some highe mileage engine 5w-20s on the shelf that would be at the bottom of the 30wt vis if that would move you into a comfort zone. If it were mine, id be trying the redline. The Ester base oils will give you very nice piston skirt lube and maybe a few HP to boot. I hope you have a good running SB hemi, I havent met one on the road yet though.


High mileage 5-20, now that might be a consideration. 30 weight oils shear down faster and get closer to 20 weight with age. Got me thinking on the high mile 5-20, good info, thank.

Your last sentence has me thinking what could he mean by that comment.

Come on over to www.challengertalk.com and you'll see alot of SB 5.7 R/T Hemis running low 13's and some in the high 12's in stock trim. Now in a heavy 4,000 lb car like my Challenger that's pretty impressive for a small block engine in stock form.

 

[ARCOgraphite]

They shouldnt give you a hassle about a catback exhaust. Just talk it up with the service manager before it goes on the car. I dont listen to the dealer on "voiding" a warranty. Get in arbitration. They have to prove that the mods caused the problem. They play that game to toss aside those that dont have the intestinal fortitude (and personal time) to follow through.

 

[ARCOgraphite]

Low 13's in a 4,000 lb smogged out car is good. I just dont like the 4000 lb thing. One of the most fav cars Ive driven was a lowly 72 furyIII with a 318. Nowdays even stock Hyundai v6 are running 100+mph in the 1/4.

 

[pwr2tow]

Just checked on prices for Redline 5-20, $9.95 per quart plus $8.85 flat rate shipping.

7 quarts for the sump and another 8.85 for shipping = ouch to me if another oil will perform just as good. Not knocking Redline as I think it's a great oil. It's just that I buy synthetic oils when they are on sale. Just bought 4 cases of NAPA 5-20 synthetic for $2.99 per quart.

I know some ones thinking, if you just bought 4 cases of oil why are you thinking of changing. Deserves an answer I guess. If some thing is better or resonably priced I would rather run that. I could always sell the oil I have to some one else and probably for a profit at the price I paid for it.

 

[pwr2tow]

Originally Posted By: ARCOgraphite
Low 13's in a 4,000 lb smogged out car is good. Nowdays even stock Hyundai v6 are running 100+mph in the 1/4.


True but with alot more factory add ons such as turbo or supercharger.
When the model 1320 Challenger comes out stock with 550 Hp..............stock can mean anything. Our wallets are the deciding limits.

 

[Jason2007]

If you like the NAPA/Valvoline syn 5w20 then run it. Should do fine, though if it were my car I would run M1 AFE 0w-20.

 

[zulu]

Originally Posted By: pwr2tow
Originally Posted By: zulu
You'll care about the MDS working properly if you develop a problem. Trust me.

0/5W-20 oils... period. A lifetime powertrain warranty depends on it.


Just to clarify, The MDS is an ECM program that shuts down 4 cylinder out of the eight so basically your running a 4 cylinder car when it kicks in. This is only for MPG improvement. There is nothing mechanical different between the MDS engine and non MDS engine. Now the newer eagle engine has VVT which is different than the old old MDS and non MDS engines but don't confuse VVT and MDS.

Lifetime powertrain warranty is a small concern but I cann't see myself keeping it as I'm addicted to power and even a minor exhaust improvement could void your warranty if the dealership decides they want to. The dealership has the discrepancy to void or honor a warranty and the manufacturer usually goes along with the dealerships decision. Have never heard of a warranty being reversed by the company after the dealership has void a warranty. I've experienced warranty on other vehicles and the dealerships seem to be in void mode for anything.





You are correct that the ECU/ECM electronically commands cylinder activation and deactivation based upon throttle load and adapted driver inputs, but the actual activation and deactivation of the cylinder is based upon high pressure oil flowing in/out of a solenoid to locking pins on each of the intake and exhaust valve lifters. The ECM then shuts off fuel/spark. Apparently the solenoids are very sensitive to oil weight. See TSB#s 09-015-04 and 09-013-04

There have been a large number of issues posted on vaious web forums regarding issues associated with heaver weight oils in MDS equipped hemis.

 

[NHHEMI]

Originally Posted By: zulu
Originally Posted By: pwr2tow
Originally Posted By: zulu
You'll care about the MDS working properly if you develop a problem. Trust me.

0/5W-20 oils... period. A lifetime powertrain warranty depends on it.


Just to clarify, The MDS is an ECM program that shuts down 4 cylinder out of the eight so basically your running a 4 cylinder car when it kicks in. This is only for MPG improvement. There is nothing mechanical different between the MDS engine and non MDS engine. Now the newer eagle engine has VVT which is different than the old old MDS and non MDS engines but don't confuse VVT and MDS.

Lifetime powertrain warranty is a small concern but I cann't see myself keeping it as I'm addicted to power and even a minor exhaust improvement could void your warranty if the dealership decides they want to. The dealership has the discrepancy to void or honor a warranty and the manufacturer usually goes along with the dealerships decision. Have never heard of a warranty being reversed by the company after the dealership has void a warranty. I've experienced warranty on other vehicles and the dealerships seem to be in void mode for anything.





You are correct that the ECU/ECM electronically commands cylinder activation and deactivation based upon throttle load and adapted driver inputs, but the actual activation and deactivation of the cylinder is based upon high pressure oil flowing in/out of a solenoid to locking pins on each of the intake and exhaust valve lifters. The ECM then shuts off fuel/spark. Apparently the solenoids are very sensitive to oil weight. See TSB#s 09-015-04 and 09-013-04

There have been a large number of issues posted on vaious web forums regarding issues associated with heaver weight oils in MDS equipped hemis.


I was going to jump on this as well. There IS a mechanical difference between a non MDS and a MDS HEMI. The MDS engines have special lifters that collapse and that is handled as the poster I quoted mentions. The solenoid allows oil to flow to the lifter where it cause a pin to disengage and thus allow the lifter to collapse. Yes the computer does part of it but there is a mechanical aspect to all of this. Stick with a 20 weight oil period.

 

[Realfine69]

I would use RP 5W-20, works great for me. Buy it off the shelf at walmart.

 

[exranger06]

Originally Posted By: zulu
You'll care about the MDS working properly if you develop a problem. Trust me.

0/5W-20 oils... period. A lifetime powertrain warranty depends on it.

Chrysler dropped the lifetime warranty ever since they went bankrupt. They now have 5 year/100k mile powertrain warranty.