Oil for '05 Scion xB - high ambient temps

[EvanR]

Hi.

I got my '05 xB with 22k miles on it. At 25k, I did a change with M1EP 5W30.

Commenced a 10k OCI from there.

I saw on BITOG a .pdf from Toyota Canada showing that the following oils were acceptable for the 1NZ-FE engine in my car.

0W20
5W20
0W30
5W30

But it doesn't get very hot in Canada! I live in Las Vegas, and I'm concerned about xW20 with ambient temps approaching 120F/50C.

Also, M1EP is only in 5W20 and 5W30, but I suspect regular M1 or M1AFE will be fine for my use and OCI.

I'm inclined to go to a 0W30 for my next change. What say the best and the brightest of BITOG?

 

[JimPghPA]

One of the best oils would be 0w30 GC.

As for the heat, have the cooling system gone over, either pull the radiator to have it cleaned inside and out, or blast all leaves and bugs from it with a hose and flush it, new thermostat, new water pump, replace any hoses and belts that are worn, use new clamps, new antifreze, and you should be good for 5 years. When you relpace surpentine also do idler.

I rebuild alternators and starters at first 60K and then every 50K after that.

Hot states eat batteries. Interstate batteries are built for heat. But if you never want it to not start, even with interstate batteries in hot states replace them every 2 years.

BTW ever chane the other fluids, PS PB drive train?

 

[EvanR]

Originally Posted By: JimPghPA
One of the best oils would be 0w30 GC.

When you relpace surpentine also do idler.


BTW ever chane the other fluids, PS PB drive train?



I don't get it. This car doesn't have a serpentine belt. How can you suggest I replace what's not there??

Brake fluid is hydroscopic. It absorbs moisture from the air. There is no moisture in the air in the desert. No need to change.

The gearbox has redline 75W90.

I'll change the PS fluid when I replace the rack.

 

[HTSS_TR]

Originally Posted By: EvanR
I'm inclined to go to a 0W30 for my next change.

If you like to use 0W30 in the Scion xB because of the Vegas summer heat, mixing 50:50 M1 AFE 0W20 with M1 0W40 will get you 0W30 with higher VI than AFE 0W30. Then in winter just use 0W20.

Some of the auto parts stores have M1 on sale almost every month, and the price is the same for whatever grade you like.

 

[fsdork]

Originally Posted By: EvanR

But it doesn't get very hot in Canada!


Yeah, but our igloos are insulated, so oil temps can still get quite high.

 

[oggb]

Sounds like you know it all about the rest of the vehicle.

What are the merits of using a 0w30 vs a 5w30 in such high ambient temperatures? Do you anticipate moving to somewhere colder?

 

[Artem]

Originally Posted By: JimPghPA
One of the best oils would be 0w30 GC.

As for the heat, have the cooling system gone over, either pull the radiator to have it cleaned inside and out, or blast all leaves and bugs from it with a hose and flush it, new thermostat, new water pump, replace any hoses and belts that are worn, use new clamps, new antifreze, and you should be good for 5 years. When you relpace surpentine also do idler.

I rebuild alternators and starters at first 60K and then every 50K after that.

Hot states eat batteries. Interstate batteries are built for heat. But if you never want it to not start, even with interstate batteries in hot states replace them every 2 years.

BTW ever chane the other fluids, PS PB drive train?

I life in Florida, it gets HOT here during the summer. I have batteries that are still working perfectly after 4-5 years. I have starters that are still functioning perfectly that are 6+ years old. The OEM alternator in my 98 Camry V6 is still working just fine. Why on earth would you go and start rebuilding / throwing away perfectly good batteries every 2 years is plain stupid, IMO and is a huge waste of time and money.

If you want to practice such wasteful maintenance regimes, go for it but don't recommend others to do the same because that's just plain wrong.

 

[simple_gifts]

If 20 weights are insufficient for Vegas, the roads would be littered with Fords and Hondas. JMO.

Signed, a 1nzfe owner.

 

[JimPghPA]

Some people spend money to be in an auto club to get free towing, or big discount when towed.

Some people spend money to do very good preventative maintenance so their vehicles never break down.

And then there are those without a clue who are surprised when their vehicle has a problem.

If you do not do preventative maintenance and you get away with it, great and more power to you.

As far as the recommendations regarding the serpentine belt and tensioner, and the other recommendations, these recommendations are general for keeping a vehicle reliable.

Some would say that some fluids should be replaced due to the heat. Oil used in hot environments will break down due to loss of the lighter molecules, and the shearing of the heavier molecules. Humidity is not the only thing that degrades oil. Many people never replace PS and PB fluid, and the end of life for those systems might or might not be effected by the fluid not being changed.

I have seen PS systems leak at just over 100 K miles, and I know how much it cost to fix them. Those systems may have not failed if the fluid had been changed once or twice during that the first 100K.

It is all in how reliable you want your vehicle to be. I have found problems when doing preventative maintenance and saved our vehicles from having a break-down.

If you or someone in your family are going to be driving across hot areas with no one around, what vehicle would you chose, one that was maintained or one that was not.

You pays your money and you takes your choice. I chose high cost preventative maintenance and the high reliability that goes along with it.

There are some people who trash vehicles so often that preventive maintenance is a real waste of money. There are some people who are physically fit enough and carry enough emergency supplies to handle a vehicle breaking down in the worst possible time and place.

I have a family friend who once got in a vehicle with a poorly maintained cooling system and it broke down in a desert environment. She and her friends with her spend several hot and thirsty hours before someone fortunately came along.

I have some older people in my family that can and still do drive, and I will not allow a vehicle to be in mechanical shape that might cause it to break down when they are using it.

The OP asked about oil as if the choice of oil for hot ambient is the end all and beat all for keeping an engine running in hot ambient. Sure some are better than others, but a mediocre oil in a vehicle with a good cooling system will outperform a great oil in a vehicle with a poor cooling system every time.

In general most chemical reactions double or half for every increase or decrease of 10 C / 18 F, and the actual viscosity of oil is greatly effected by the actual temperature the oil is at. In hot ambient that is controlled by the condition of the cooling system.

 

[JimPghPA]

A couple of years ago Interstate batteries had a different web site. Then it said how they tested their batteries to handle the heat of taxis in Las Vegas. That site also had a map that showed the life expectancy of batteries vs location in the United States and Canada. In the hot desert environment of Las Vegas the reliable life of a battery is only two years.

Keep in mind that the average temperature of a battery has a big effect on life expectancy. If the over all average temperature of battery A is 18 Fahrenheit higher than the over all average temperature of battery B, you can expect battery A to only last half as long as battery B.

 

[JimPghPA]

Google "car batteries Las Vegas heat".

 

[HTSS_TR]

Originally Posted By: JimPghPA
Hot states eat batteries. Interstate batteries are built for heat. But if you never want it to not start, even with interstate batteries in hot states replace them every 2 years.

BTW ever change the other fluids, PS PB drive train?

I agree that high heat is main cause of battery failure, that why some cars have battery heat shield to reduce the heat from hot engine transfers to battery, while others have air duct to blow cool air over battery.

Automobile battery in Vegas may not lasted 6-7 years, but replace battery every 2 years is over maintenance, IMO.

 

[JimPghPA]

According to the YouTube video, when a battery goes bad in a vehicle in Phoenix heat it can cause the alternator to over-heat to the point of damaging the alternator.

And also according to the YouTube video 2 to 3 years is the life expectancy of batteries in the Phoenix heat.

 

[Artem]

If i was tossing out batteries every 2 years, I'd definitely make a custom heat shield for it.

 

[EvanR]

Gee, I never meant to start a flame war. I think I'll just switch to 0W30 next change and see what happens.

 

[oldmaninsc]

Originally Posted By: EvanR
Hi.

I got my '05 xB with 22k miles on it. At 25k, I did a change with M1EP 5W30.

Commenced a 10k OCI from there.

I saw on BITOG a .pdf from Toyota Canada showing that the following oils were acceptable for the 1NZ-FE engine in my car.

0W20
5W20
0W30
5W30

But it doesn't get very hot in Canada! I live in Las Vegas, and I'm concerned about xW20 with ambient temps approaching 120F/50C.

Respectfully, is the 120 F heat any "hotter" in Las Vegas than it is in California, Arizona or any other southern state?

I drive to Phoenix several times a year - and 5W-20 works just fine in my Grand Marquis's V8! When I had the Trailblazer with the I6 engine, I used 5w30. That was driving up the long hills in Ca. on Interstate 10 going east to Arizona. The ambient temperature was often 115 - 120F with both a/c units running and doing 80 MPH or better. The Trailblazer was running great when I sold it with 70,000 miles on it - the Mercury has 95,000 miles and still runs great!

The Aerostar in my signature also had 5w30 oil (mostly Valvoline dino) and I have drove all over the Ca. and Arizona desert with 6 adults in it. 200K plus miles and it still runs strong (4.0 V6).

Remember - many car companies have been known to test their vehicles in Death Valley, Ca.

 

[JimPghPA]

The OP is talking about a 05 vehicle with at least 35K miles on it. I do not know if that vehicle has had routine preventative maintenance done on it. But at 7 years age and 35K miles there are things that should be done to keep a vehicle reliable for average use, let alone one that would be used in hot ambient. And this is why I mentioned things other than oil.

If the vehicle were only a couple of years old, and had lower millage I would have not mentioned the routine maintenance items.

There are a lot of gotchas out there to pay attention to. For instance, how many would look at the speed rating of their tires, the air pressure, and take into consideration: the amount of weight the vehicle is carrying, the condition of the parts that maintain the alignment, and how long it has been since an alignment, before traveling at high speed on a hot stretch of desert highway?

 

[EvanR]

Originally Posted By: JimPghPA
traveling at high speed on a hot stretch of desert highway?


Clearly you've never driven an xB. They are not capable of high speed.

 

[pezzy669]

Some of the "routine" maintenance suggested here seems to be overkill central - like a rebuild of alternator every 50k and new battery every 2 years?

What? I have never had a battery not last 5 years here in admittedly not quite as hot Florida, but still not unusual to see sitting in traffic temps over 100 degrees for months.

My '91 Toyota Pickup truck with 190k miles when I sold it was on the original alternator and 3rd battery. My partners '02 Toyota Celica was sold in '08 with 160k on the clock and just had the OEM battery changed @ 140k, everything else mechanical was still factory including the brakes and clutch (not joking).

 

[oldmaninsc]

Originally Posted By: pezzy669
Some of the "routine" maintenance suggested here seems to be overkill central - like a rebuild of alternator every 50k and new battery every 2 years?

What? I have never had a battery not last 5 years here in admittedly not quite as hot Florida, but still not unusual to see sitting in traffic temps over 100 degrees for months.

My '91 Toyota Pickup truck with 190k miles when I sold it was on the original alternator and 3rd battery. My partners '02 Toyota Celica was sold in '08 with 160k on the clock and just had the OEM battery changed @ 140k, everything else mechanical was still factory including the brakes and clutch (not joking).
Exactly what I was thinking. Talk about OCD!
I tend to buy cars that don't need rebuilt every 50K or 60K miles!
I replaced the alternator on my Aerostar at 190K miles (give or take a few) as PM - only because my daughter and I were going "out in the desert" in July. The alternator was still charging very well, but the bearings were just starting to get noisy.
Also I consider a car with only 35K miles on it practically new.

But we are getting off topic here - the o/p was asking what oil to use in Las Vegas.