New tires-front or rear?

[Lowflyer]

Originally Posted by Zaedock
The best tires should always go in the back, regardless of driven wheels.
Absolutely right.

Originally Posted by Char Baby
In regards to puting the best tires on the REAR, I believe that the tire companies, testers & other publications are talking about more extreme conditions, not just driving straight down the road on a sunny day in July.
Its true.
If you driving the road on a sunny day in July, no matter. Older tyres with less tire tread having lees % MORE grip as newer, on those days. But that its never the question.

The question is, always, what happen, if your ideal driving conditions are changing. Suddenly. Sand, sludge/capot and of course rain.
Therefore, if front and rear having the same size, new tyres -> rear. Understeer is ever simplier to master for DSC (ESP), and for you.

 

[Lolvoguy]

Originally Posted by Zaedock

The best tires should always go in the back, regardless of driven wheels.

+1

As my grandfather used to say back in the late 1900s:
"To keep it on track, gotta put the new tires on back"
Still holds true to this day

 

[Duffyjr]

I've always had a problem with miss matched tires or tires that don't have close to the same wear all the way around. My solution would be to put new all the way around and try and sell the other two good ones, just my two cents.

 

[HangFire]

Usual advice now is best tires in back to avoid oversteer, since oversteer is a scary loss of control to most drivers.

If oversteer is just another driving mode for you, well, do whatever you want.

 

[edwardh1]

michelin web has info also

 

[4WD]

Originally Posted by rekit
I see the rear is recommended by Discount. This is a Kia Optima Front WD. Going to replace the fronts. The rears are 75%. The concern is hydroplaning. I think the fronts move the water for the rears. And in the dry the fronts do all the driving and most of the breaking. What am I missing?

 

[edwardh1]

https://www.michelinman.com/mixingTires.html

 

[spk2000]

Agree with an earlier post why would you put best tires on rear in fwd car. For braking your fronts do around 80% of the braking anyways so why compromise that. For traction I want to get through snow and don't want to be stuck. The rear end sliding around thing is a farce. Never had it happen without trying to make it happen such as donuts in a parking lot. If the weather is bad enough that your rear end might slide around then you need to drive accordingly not like it 75 and dry out.

 

[CT8]

The front tires steer the car the back tires keep is under control. It seems the opposite but new tires in the rear.

 

[CT8]

"I think I know is much different than I actually know. Thinking you know is bad mindset to get into." A quote by G.Barnes .

 

[aquariuscsm]

Originally Posted by DrDanger
Plenty of people falling for the new player trap.
FWD car - better tyres always on the front. Front does at least 2/3rd of the braking, the steering and the power delivery. In a rain situation:
per Michelin, your rear generally tracks the front and benefits from the siping/clearing water already done.




^^This.

My 3000GT always ate up front tires and that car was bad about hydroplaning if the fronts were the last bit worn. Replace the fronts first on your Kia.

 

[92saturnsl2]

I always put new tires in the back EXCEPT if the tires are closely matched (within 25%).

The reason for this is that if you put the worn tires on the front and new on back, you'll never be able to rotate and even the wear out. On a FWD car, the worn tires will continue to wear faster than the rears, so when the fronts are finished, you have two tires on the rear with 60+% tread left, then you're back to square one with throwing good tires away or installing mismatched tires again.

If you put the new on the front and old on the rear, in 10k miles or less you have a perfect matching set and can begin normal rotations. One has to realize that with regular tire rotations, at one point or another the rear set WILL have less tread than the front, this can't be avoided on a fwd car where front wears quicker than the rear. I don't consider myself putting my life on the line by rotating my tires regularly, do you?

Is there a safety argument for putting new on the rear? Sure. But sometimes the economics outweigh the tiny fraction of a chance you'll be in a situation where that extra 2/32 of tread on the rear would have made a difference between an accident and staying on the road.

 

[bullwinkle]

Originally Posted by redbone3
I was brought up in NE Pennsylvania. Everything was rear wheel drive. Snows on the back, best summer tires on the front. We survived and we got up the hill in the snow. Later I got a SAAB and put snows on the front (tire shop was very confused). I survived and got up the hill in the snow.
I tried that with my old '90 Civic wagon (back when winter was a thing here)-guy made me a killer deal on a pair of STUDDED snows, already on rims, put them on the front (FWD only). It would go anywhere, but you had to be really careful on ice-the back end was almost impossible to keep from fishtailing!

 

[geeman789]

Question ...

Is it better to have two new tires up front, then spin off the road and crash in a rainstorm when the back end lost grip ?

Or,

Is it better to have two new tires on the rear, then hydroplane off the road in a rainstorm when the front tires couldn't handle the water ?


The key factor is what is the actual tread depth on the rear tires. Did the OP measure them, or just eyeball it ?


IF the rear tires at 75 %, neither of theses scenarios are very likely.

Mount those new tires up front, and soon the wear will even them up nicely.

However, mount them on the back, and soon you will be looking at having severely mis-matched tread depth front to rear as the fronts wear down below 50 % , and the rears barely wear at all.

 

[Quattro Pete]

Originally Posted by geeman789
Question ...

Is it better to have two new tires up front, then spin off the road and crash in a rainstorm when the back end lost grip ?

Or,

Is it better to have two new tires on the rear, then hydroplane off the road in a rainstorm when the front tires couldn't handle the water ?
The difference is that when your front tires begin to lose grip, you will usually easily feel it in the steering wheel and can back off in time to avoid an uncontrollable condition. On the other hand,by the time you figure out that your back end lost grip, it's usually too late and much more difficult to recover.

Granted, all modern vehicles have electronic stability control, which should help avoid a spin out, but effectiveness of it is often indirectly proportional to the driver's stupidity.

 

[jhs914]

I am a contrarian on what most recommend. I prefer the newer tires on the front, even on a rear wheel drive vehicle. The reason is here in Florida the greatest risk is hydroplaning and if the front hydroplanes you loose the ability to steer and brake so you keep plowing straight ahead. It happened to me once. Never again.

If the rear looses traction and the front has grip I can brake to slow down and I can steer. I can correct for over steer if the rear breaks loose as long as I have traction in the front. Counter steering when the rear loses traction is instinctual for me. 80% of your braking and 100% of your steering comes from the front two tires. Give me the best rubber up front.

 

[Wolf359]

Originally Posted by jhs914
I am a contrarian on what most recommend. I prefer the newer tires on the front, even on a rear wheel drive vehicle. The reason is here in Florida the greatest risk is hydroplaning and if the front hydroplanes you loose the ability to steer and brake so you keep plowing straight ahead. It happened to me once. Never again.

If the rear looses traction and the front has grip I can brake to slow down and I can steer. I can correct for over steer if the rear breaks loose as long as I have traction in the front. Counter steering when the rear loses traction is instinctual for me. 80% of your braking and 100% of your steering comes from the front two tires. Give me the best rubber up front.


You must be an above average driver. Most drivers can't get out of the situation where traction is lost in the rear. I've hydroplaned before. You can feel it in the steering wheel. It's fine when you're going straight, the car keeps going straight. Usually it's because you hit a big patch of water. While you can't brake or steer, letting go of the gas slows the car down and you get traction again. On the other hand if the rears lose it, you may already be in a spin which even if you're good enough to control it, it's not a good situation to be in on the highway. Still, if the rears have a lot of tread, it's probably to put the new ones on the front. Ideally, sometimes it's just time to bite the bullet and get a new set of tires. With AWD, didn't have a choice, got tired of driving on two tires that had patches, one was somewhat worn so I ditched the whole set.

 

[HangFire]

One caveat on (what I call) the "can you handle oversteer" discussion. Hydroplaning can start with any wheel at any time. It doesn't always start with the wheel that has the least tread, the front, rear, driver or passenger side. Usually it starts with the wheel in the deepest water, sometimes with the least weight on it.

 

[bbhero]

Originally Posted by Quattro Pete
Originally Posted by geeman789
Question ...

Is it better to have two new tires up front, then spin off the road and crash in a rainstorm when the back end lost grip ?

Or,

Is it better to have two new tires on the rear, then hydroplane off the road in a rainstorm when the front tires couldn't handle the water ?
The difference is that when your front tires begin to lose grip, you will usually easily feel it in the steering wheel and can back off in time to avoid an uncontrollable condition. On the other hand,by the time you figure out that your back end lost grip, it's usually too late and much more difficult to recover.

Granted, all modern vehicles have electronic stability control, which should help avoid a spin out, but effectiveness of it is often indirectly proportional to the driver's stupidity.





In my experience and my opinion....

People just way over react and put too much steering wheel input into the circumstance.

I had a serious hydroplaning incident where I just about got my left side tires off the pavement by about a foot away from doing that.. I barely, barely put a bit of steering wheel input to the right and I ended up 4 ft into the right lane. Had I grabbed and jerked the wheel hard to the right... It would have been spinning in circles time and who knows where I end up or what I hit or who I could have hit... Being honest I was going way, way too fast at 68 mph in a driving rain storm and when I came over a overpass and started going downhill on that overpass the rain water was deep and wide sheeting down that pavement.. What saved me that day was not overreacting too much. What got me really into trouble that day was the gas pedal... What kept me from a bad accident was not putting a whole lot of steering wheel input...

Or the time where going on Rte 5 and my car started to have the back end stepping out... I was only going 20 mph on 4 inches of hard packed snow... I was going up a hill and the road had a tilt that went higher from my left to lower in my right side... What kept me good there was simply taking my foot completely off the gas pedal and putting very, very, little steering input in my car to keep it on the road.... That stretch of road was seriously bad... I cane eastbound on the same road and saw a mini van with it's nose facing into the ditch... With the nose if the vehicle missing the dirt embankment by about 2-3 feet. I felt bad for the guy because he lost his vehicle and overreacted with too much steering input and got himself stuck. It was obvious he was not going all that fast because he did not slam his minivan into the ditch and dirt embankment behind it. But he just overreacted and got himself in trouble with the steering wheel.

I still would much rather have my good tires up front to cut a path through either rain or snow. That what your front tires clear the way for the back ones.

And it really is the steering wheel and or the gas pedal or possibly both that get people into trouble. I'd bet in snow conditions in my area it almost always is the gas pedal that is the number 1 cause for people getting into bad spots.... And steering wheel being in second place behind that... In rain it is very likely the same order of causation of issues.