Motorcycle specific oil

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Harley Davidson runs on the old Volkswagen business model. Sure they are more technologically advanced bikes out there...but if people will keep on buying what ya make...ya don't need to change it. The brand sells itself with some clever marketing.

Would I buy a new Harley? Only a 1200 Sporty or V Rod. For a big twin model...Id rather have an Evo anyday.
 
Originally Posted By: Robenstein
Harley Davidson runs on the old Volkswagen business model. Sure they are more technologically advanced bikes out there...but if people will keep on buying what ya make...ya don't need to change it. The brand sells itself with some clever marketing.

Would I buy a new Harley? Only a 1200 Sporty or V Rod. For a big twin model...Id rather have an Evo anyday.


The rear cylinder on the Evos overheat too...
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: grampi
Originally Posted By: Robenstein
Harley Davidson runs on the old Volkswagen business model. Sure they are more technologically advanced bikes out there...but if people will keep on buying what ya make...ya don't need to change it. The brand sells itself with some clever marketing.

Would I buy a new Harley? Only a 1200 Sporty or V Rod. For a big twin model...Id rather have an Evo anyday.


The rear cylinder on the Evos overheat too...


Well you have to remember the Harley Vtwins are a very old design. But I could show you how to remap a TC88 to make it run cool, get great gas mileage, smooth top end, and increase the TQ/HP by about 15% for under $1000. Once done you have a really fun bike to ride that is really durable as well. When you ride a Harley is it like riding a timeless piece of machinery. Much that same as driving a 1967 Corvette. Lots of fun and easy to understand why many people like them in this crazy world of high technology.
 
By the time VW was through with the BUG there only a handful of parts which were common to the entire start to finish production run. Many of the improved parts would retrofit, however.
 
Originally Posted By: grampi
Originally Posted By: Robenstein
Harley Davidson runs on the old Volkswagen business model. Sure they are more technologically advanced bikes out there...but if people will keep on buying what ya make...ya don't need to change it. The brand sells itself with some clever marketing.

Would I buy a new Harley? Only a 1200 Sporty or V Rod. For a big twin model...Id rather have an Evo anyday.


The rear cylinder on the Evos overheat too...


They get hotter cause they are more oil cooled than air cooled, but they do not overheat unless you are sitting in the summer idling forever like a dummy.
 
Originally Posted By: Doog
Well you have to remember the Harley Vtwins are a very old design. But I could show you how to remap a TC88 to make it run cool, get great gas mileage, smooth top end, and increase the TQ/HP by about 15% for under $1000. Once done you have a really fun bike to ride that is really durable as well. When you ride a Harley is it like riding a timeless piece of machinery. Much that same as driving a 1967 Corvette. Lots of fun and easy to understand why many people like them in this crazy world of high technology.


The overheating problems weren't as prevalent until Harley started making the bigger displacement engines (96 CI and up). All those cubes generate a lot of heat. If Harley wants to participate in the dispalcement wars and do it reliably, they'll have to go to liquid cooling...which means a complete redesign...something they don't want to do because they don't want to turn off the bulk of their buying customers...the people who don't want the newer technologies...
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: Robenstein
Originally Posted By: grampi
Originally Posted By: Robenstein
Harley Davidson runs on the old Volkswagen business model. Sure they are more technologically advanced bikes out there...but if people will keep on buying what ya make...ya don't need to change it. The brand sells itself with some clever marketing.

Would I buy a new Harley? Only a 1200 Sporty or V Rod. For a big twin model...Id rather have an Evo anyday.


The rear cylinder on the Evos overheat too...


They get hotter cause they are more oil cooled than air cooled, but they do not overheat unless you are sitting in the summer idling forever like a dummy.


Last summer when we had all that hot weather my buddy's Street Glide would shut down the rear cylinder while he was riding down the highway...he took it to the Harley dealership and their service guy told him not to ride it if the temp was above 90...no thanks, I'll keep my liquid cooled bike...
 
I see lots of Harleys overheating in stop and go traffic on I95 in the D.C. area.....pulled over and shut down to cool down in the summer. I like harleys, but cant afford an expensive bike that I cant ride to work. Sooooo BMW it is.
 
Originally Posted By: 95busa
I see lots of Harleys overheating in stop and go traffic on I95 in the D.C. area.....pulled over and shut down to cool down in the summer. I like harleys, but cant afford an expensive bike that I cant ride to work. Sooooo BMW it is.


Mines a 106,cammed,big bore kit,decked heads with oversized valves and not once has it overheated.
I would put that in the operator error category.
I like lots of bikes. Harley's were never at the top of my list. In fact i liked Yamaha's v4s however I liked the style and seating position of my street bob. That was the determining factor for me,not the name on the gas tank.
New Harley's don't need 1000 bucks worth of tuning and tuners and remap's or whatever. A conscientious operator is all they need.
My bike has idled in traffic for hours when it gets congested here. I'll just split lanes or ride the sidewalk if I get frustrated but never has it overheated on me.
 
Adding an oil cooler to a HD (if it does not have one) and if its injected, putting a richer map in it will indeed help. Problem is those engines may not overheat to the point of being a mechanical problem, but they sure can cook your legs. The human leg is less heat resilient than aluminum. LOL
 
Originally Posted By: grampi

Last summer when we had all that hot weather my buddy's Street Glide would shut down the rear cylinder while he was riding down the highway...he took it to the Harley dealership and their service guy told him not to ride it if the temp was above 90...no thanks, I'll keep my liquid cooled bike...


([censored] flag thrown.) I hope he told the tech to GFY. If he had on of the 103 or 110 big stroke motors then all he would need to do is add a stock HD oil cooler and run 20w50 or 20w60 synthetic oil. He may have had a bad ECM as well. But you can run a Harley at 100F+ all day and many guys do it. What do the literally thousands of guys who live in Texas, NM,AZ, CA, MS ,LA, AL, GA SC and FL and ride Harley's do?
 
Originally Posted By: grampi
Originally Posted By: Doog
Well you have to remember the Harley Vtwins are a very old design. But I could show you how to remap a TC88 to make it run cool, get great gas mileage, smooth top end, and increase the TQ/HP by about 15% for under $1000. Once done you have a really fun bike to ride that is really durable as well. When you ride a Harley is it like riding a timeless piece of machinery. Much that same as driving a 1967 Corvette. Lots of fun and easy to understand why many people like them in this crazy world of high technology.


The overheating problems weren't as prevalent until Harley started making the bigger displacement engines (96 CI and up). All those cubes generate a lot of heat. If Harley wants to participate in the dispalcement wars and do it reliably, they'll have to go to liquid cooling...which means a complete redesign...something they don't want to do because they don't want to turn off the bulk of their buying customers...the people who don't want the newer technologies...


Those motors are the TC88 design with more stroke. Which in turn creates more internal mass and more heat. All you need is an oil cooler.
 
Originally Posted By: 95busa
I see lots of Harleys overheating in stop and go traffic on I95 in the D.C. area.....pulled over and shut down to cool down in the summer. I like harleys, but cant afford an expensive bike that I cant ride to work. Sooooo BMW it is.


All they need is some Redline 20w60 and they would be GTG

http://www.redlineoil.com/product.aspx?pid=111&pcid=21

Then add a Jagg cooler and zama...you are outa the heat

http://www.jagg.com/
 
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Like I said, why bother with an air cooled design...get something liquid cooled and be done with it...
 
Originally Posted By: grampi
Like I said, why bother with an air cooled design...get something liquid cooled and be done with it...


Cause then you have a more complex engine, with more parts that can fail or be damaged, and one more fluid that can spring a leak. I see the beauty of the simplicity of an air or air/oil cooled engine. Suzuki and many other metrics have had some darn good engines with air or air/oil cooling.
 
Originally Posted By: Robenstein
Originally Posted By: grampi
Like I said, why bother with an air cooled design...get something liquid cooled and be done with it...


Cause then you have a more complex engine, with more parts that can fail or be damaged, and one more fluid that can spring a leak. I see the beauty of the simplicity of an air or air/oil cooled engine. Suzuki and many other metrics have had some darn good engines with air or air/oil cooling.


True. But the reason I like them is that riding a Harley has it's own primal kind of animal beast like machine appeal to it. You crack the throttle on a Harley and it shakes, vibrates and growls at you. So riding one is really lots of fun.
 
Originally Posted By: Robenstein
Originally Posted By: grampi
Like I said, why bother with an air cooled design...get something liquid cooled and be done with it...


Cause then you have a more complex engine, with more parts that can fail or be damaged, and one more fluid that can spring a leak. I see the beauty of the simplicity of an air or air/oil cooled engine. Suzuki and many other metrics have had some darn good engines with air or air/oil cooling.


I guess I can understand an attraction to simplicity...the metrics are definitely more difficult to work on...for the most part though they don't require much maintenance...they're pretty much like a car these days, change the fluids, filters and plugs once in a while and ride 'em for for 100K or so...
 
Originally Posted By: Doog
Originally Posted By: Robenstein
Originally Posted By: grampi
Like I said, why bother with an air cooled design...get something liquid cooled and be done with it...


Cause then you have a more complex engine, with more parts that can fail or be damaged, and one more fluid that can spring a leak. I see the beauty of the simplicity of an air or air/oil cooled engine. Suzuki and many other metrics have had some darn good engines with air or air/oil cooling.


True. But the reason I like them is that riding a Harley has it's own primal kind of animal beast like machine appeal to it. You crack the throttle on a Harley and it shakes, vibrates and growls at you. So riding one is really lots of fun.


I do like the sound of a Harley...but not enough to give up the performance other bikes offer...
 
Originally Posted By: grampi
Originally Posted By: Doog
Originally Posted By: Robenstein
Originally Posted By: grampi
Like I said, why bother with an air cooled design...get something liquid cooled and be done with it...


Cause then you have a more complex engine, with more parts that can fail or be damaged, and one more fluid that can spring a leak. I see the beauty of the simplicity of an air or air/oil cooled engine. Suzuki and many other metrics have had some darn good engines with air or air/oil cooling.


True. But the reason I like them is that riding a Harley has it's own primal kind of animal beast like machine appeal to it. You crack the throttle on a Harley and it shakes, vibrates and growls at you. So riding one is really lots of fun.


I do like the sound of a Harley...but not enough to give up the performance other bikes offer...


Nobody buys a Harley as a performance bike.
13.gif
 
Originally Posted By: Doog
Nobody buys a Harley as a performance bike.
13.gif



Some of us don't buy them because they don't perform
grin.gif
 
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