Originally Posted By: ekpolk
Well, let's consider the other side of that coin. As a preface, I worked for almost a decade as a plaintiff's lawyer myself, before deciding to return to my happy roots -- constitutional/criminal defense work.
Plaintiff's lawyers, love them or hate them, STRONGLY PREFER to get into cases like this with slam-dunk preparation. You can bet your next ten paychecks that they have, behind the scenes, spent a gazillion dollars having their hired computer and engineering experts reverse engineering things to find the source of this mysterious "sudden acceleration" issue. I'm sure that the careerist publicity-hungry feds have done the same.
And yet, this "issue" remains elusive. It's been hanging out there in the haze for several years now, and yet NOBODY, yes, NOBODY has been able to prove that the "problem" actually exists in the form of a true defect in the cars. Sure, cars today are more complex then they were decades ago, but I simply can not imagine that in the time that this steroid-injected "issue" has been "out there", that all the super-funded, brilliant minds looking at Toyotas have been unable to find a real problem. If the problem were real, it would be out there by now, in full detail.
Moreover, we all know that every car maker out there spends millions every year tearing apart and reverse engineering their competitors' products. If there REALLY IS a fundamental problem with the Toyotas, does any intelligent person really believe that Honda, Nissan, GM, Ford, Chrysler, Kia, Hyundai, and so on, with all their vast resources, would not have found it and exploited it???? I think not.
Look, this game has gone on for YEARS not, and still, NOBODY has offered any proof of the existence of a specific flaw in the design or build of these cars. Anyone? Step up and prove me wrong.
If this really was a systemic flaw, we'd see Toyotas running away in droves. But we don't. Just that simple. I've driven Toyotas for almost ten years now. I'm not a cheerleader, just a happy owner who has an allergy to nonsense. My current ride certainly has some defects, which happily, I'd characterize as cosmetic (yet annoying). A minor but noticeable vent rattle. Wipers that sometimes don't park all the way down. But in ten years, and several hundred thousand miles of driving Toyotas, I've never seen anything even remotely hinting at a runaway condition. Ever.
The 4-dead Lexus and freeway Prius cases are both highly questionable (perhaps outright bogus) stories. If you use that thing called a "brake pedal," the car WILL STOP even if the engine is, for some reason, running away. It's pretty clear that the runaway Prius guy is just a fraud. As for the Lexus case, it was a tragic case of operator error. I previously owned a V-6 Camry, one that had the DBW throttle system. I remember true "brake fade" from the 1970s, and this car, a close relative of the "runaway Lex" ES, never showed a hint of it. Had the panicked Lex driver simply mashed the brake pedal, and kept it mashed, the car WOULD have stopped just fine. In over 60k miles with my V-6 Cam, I never sensed that the car could begin to overwhelm its brakes. Sure, you can burn your brakes up if you try, but that's either driver stupidity or fraud, not a design problem (could happen to a Ford or Chevy too...).
It's truly sad that the internet, including of course this site, has become infested with speculative "discussions" like this, which in a more sensible time, would probably have been actionable as clear defamation. This thread was started by a guy who hates Toyota based upon his own claimed bad experience (at least he admits that, thank you), and links to an article that offers nothing but a rehash and recitation that adventurous plaintiff's lawyers are trying to keep the issue alive.
OK, here's a polite challenge to anyone who cares to accept. Let's see some actual proof of an objectively identifiable fault in some mechanical part, computer chip, programming, or other part in a Toyota/Lexus that can be shown to cause a runaway. They did floormats and possibly stick pedals, but those are now done, and apparently, some are still rallying on against these cars.
Now, let's see some ACTUAL PROOF of an ACTUAL PROBLEM, please.
1st off my link was not a rehash. While It did go over the case in general I linked to it for a specific part. It contained info that Toyota actually had bought back vehicles and made the consumer agree to a non disclosure agreement about it. It was the 1st link I could find to provide( I heard it on the TV the night before )"proof" of what I was syaing. It was a limited part of the link but it was a link to my source which you must always have here due to folks such as yourself who challenge everything. I think if I posted my real name you would want a copy of my birth certificate.
That was NEW info regarding this situation in the link that to my knowledge had no been discussed here prior. IT also points out Toyota lied when they claimed no knowledge of the problem. They absolutely did as they bought back the vehicles. So it is new info and is a relevant topic to discuss. Well, unless you are a pro Toyota person I guess.
Now, I have admitted( right along btw not recently or anything )that I dislike that company with a passion based on how bad they treated me. Detest, hate, despise, or whatever you want to call it. It is true and I make no apologies or excuses. So how about you finally admit your pro Toyota bias now and that it skews everything you post in threads like this? You are so clearly Pro Toyota it is not even close to being funny. You are as in love with them as I hate them. Also, I have a reason to hate them so how about you quit posting in a manner that implies I am some kind of crazy person? My opinion is every bit as valid as yours even if you are one of the Mod's here who control what we can post.
And you want us to provide proof of this how? That is a good one. You obviously went to the same school Toyota did. Intead of owning up to a problem and dealing with it let's deflect and put it on to others. None of us here are in a postion to have access to hard proof. Of course you know that already and is why you would issue a challenge like that. Congratulations on a hollow victory. We can't provide the info you want and you know it. If that makes you feel smarter and like you have won some kind of point in a game again I will say congratulations.
All we can do here is discuss what we hear and read about and post links to the sources. Sort of like we do with oil's and info on them but I guess here it doesn't qualify for you becuase it is anti Toyota? Kind of the point of these forums is to discuss things is it not? Where does it say we have to all agree before doing so?
Defamation? You can NOT be serious? Discussing public news stories and our feelings on the ethics of a company is not defamation. Wow that is a good one.
