M1 ESP 5w-30 in 08 VW Rabbit 5359 mi

[JHZR2]

In my last UOA showing the Schaeffer's 9000 in the rabbit, we say 4% fuel and high Si. None of that is present in this UOA, and this one seems to match pretty well to the VOA I did on the M1 ESP posted here:

https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/posts/1621103/

So this makes the Schaeffer's 9000 UOA more suspect, and also, IMO shows that the M1 ESP is a good oil doing a decent job as an A3 rated 5w30, other than TBN. Its retention is quite poor, and this is not a 10k mile oil, which is the OCI per our owner's manual. My wife averages 26-27 MPG in 100% city driving in this car.

Code:




Unit Age 20307 14948 10100m 4958m

Comp Age 20307 14948 10100m 4958m

Time on Oil 5359 4848 5146m 4958m

Time on Fltr 5359 4848 5146m 4958m

Fluid M1 ESP 5w30 504/507 Schaeffer's 9000 5w-40 Amsoil 5w40 Euro OEM FF

Fe 19 23 24 60

Cr 0 0 0.3 0.5

Ni 0 0 1.1 0.3

Ti 0 0 0 0.1

Ag 0 0 0 0

Al 14 6 16 16

Pb 1 0 3.5 5.1

Cu 7 4 20 49

Sn 2 4 2.3 0

Si 3 44 1.2 39

Na 4 6 1.4 5.2

K 4 10 4.1 4.9

B 77 49 38 46

Ba 0 0 1.9 6.4

Mo 92 255 0.2 0

Mg 105 41 7.4 25

Ca 601 1914 1553 1401

P 741 742 616 710

Zn 900 938 702 746

S N/A N/A 1569 2093

Cd 0 0 0 0

Mn 16 16 16 53

V 1 1 0 0

Sb 0.1 0.1 0.1 0.1

TAN 3.08

TBN 1.7 5.9 4.4

Kv@100°C 12 8.9 12.3 12.2

 

[JAG]

Virgin TBN is ~5.1 so it dropped by ~3.4 units. That's not poor on a rate of loss basis but it is getting low. MG was 9 in your VOA and is 105 in the UOA so that's puzzling...not that it matters. Viscosity retention was either superb or the oil thinned initially then thickened back up. I doubt it did the latter because that would be lousy oxidative stability and the VW 504/507 spec. requires that to be high. Thanks for the UOA.

 

[panthermike]

Weird? Despite the Viscosity/Fuel/Si, the Schaeffer's did well. I would give the 9000 some more runs.

 

[JHZR2]

I still doubt the 9000 results because the car did not have Si issues or fuel issues subsequently, and nothing was done on the car but oil changes...

 

[Mark_S]

Calcium = 601?

Mark

 

[daman]

Originally Posted By: JAG
Virgin TBN is ~5.1 so it dropped by ~3.4 units. That's not poor on a rate of loss basis but it is getting low.

I agree,it's low to begin with,didn't to to bad IMO.

 

[Gary Allan]

For the most part all of the UOA's are in sensible ranges. Perhaps I'd rather say that they have more likenesses than they do differences, but the differences stick out in a substantial way. The visc cannot be right. It's a 20 grade.

So, yes, the Schaeffer's UOA has some issues to it, but the WHOLE UOA isn't trashed because of it.

 

[JHZR2]

But the uoa stated 4% fuel dilution... That could cause substantial thinning. Question is why and why no longer... Si flags dust leak, fuel could mean funny operation, but we log every tank of fuel, get consistent mileage, qnd nothing happened to the car over the entire time. The M1 uoa was the wintertime fill too, fwiw.

 

[JHZR2]

Originally Posted By: daman
Originally Posted By: JAG
Virgin TBN is ~5.1 so it dropped by ~3.4 units. That's not poor on a rate of loss basis but it is getting low.

I agree,it's low to begin with,didn't to to bad IMO.


yes but keep in mind that the car's owners manual and service indicator indicate 10k mile OCIs on VW 502 oil. Sure it has some tbn left and it went 5k, but I'm looking for a 10k oil... And don't see this as it. I put it in again with high hopes, and will resample at 5k again given the performance.

I have no indication that this oil will do 10k. Since we are effectively titrating acid into a well mixed sump, and I know how chemical systems act near the equivalence point, I do have real issues/concerns with the kinetics of the neutralization... And the time/chance that acids may have to cause issues...

 

[JHZR2]

Originally Posted By: Mark_S
Calcium = 601?

Mark


yep, check my voa. Something else going on in there, I guess.