Looking for a $1000-$2000 commuter car
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6 years ago i bought my oldest son a 97 escort, 2.0 auto 90,000 mi;
youngest son now has same car with 160,000 mi commuting to college, i've changed 1 alternator and the oil @ 5,000 mi intervals, thats it.
for obvious reasons they are not the most refined car, but this one has been maintainence free, i'm very satisfied
youngest son now has same car with 160,000 mi commuting to college, i've changed 1 alternator and the oil @ 5,000 mi intervals, thats it.
for obvious reasons they are not the most refined car, but this one has been maintainence free, i'm very satisfied
Originally Posted By: Chris Meutsch
Originally Posted By: The Critic
The engine has never given me any serious problems. The rest of the car though, is an entirely different story. Here are the things that have failed:
Alternator
Starter
PCV Breather Hose
Radiator
Radiator Cap
Thermostat
Valve Cover Gasket Kit
Upper Motor Mount
Trunk Wiring Harness
Serpentine Belt Tensioner
Front Strut Mounts
Sway Bar End Links
Engine Coolant Temp Sensor
Pre-Cat Oxygen Sensor
Heater Core
Transmission Top Cover Gasket
With 140k on the clock, now I am due for a master cylinder, two lower control arms, possibly a rack and pinion, another upper motor mount, lower transmission mount and a new cruise control unit.
Not to hijack the thread but MAN, are you just keeping it alive because you're in this deep already or what? Get out while you can unless you're emotionally tied to it due to the amount of work you've done on it.
I'd take the Civic but that's just the Honda in me speaking.
Since I do the work myself, it's isn't that expensive to keep the car in top condition. As long as I keep with the repairs, I'm sure the car will keep running. Judging from the list, it's pretty evident that I have already replaced the majority of the wear and tear parts on the car. Aside from the things that I need replace now, the only other problems I can foresee in the future are a water pump and a transmission valve body.
If I recall correctly, your Civic has more miles than my Saturn. Haven't you had some of the same issues?
Originally Posted By: The Critic
The engine has never given me any serious problems. The rest of the car though, is an entirely different story. Here are the things that have failed:
Alternator
Starter
PCV Breather Hose
Radiator
Radiator Cap
Thermostat
Valve Cover Gasket Kit
Upper Motor Mount
Trunk Wiring Harness
Serpentine Belt Tensioner
Front Strut Mounts
Sway Bar End Links
Engine Coolant Temp Sensor
Pre-Cat Oxygen Sensor
Heater Core
Transmission Top Cover Gasket
With 140k on the clock, now I am due for a master cylinder, two lower control arms, possibly a rack and pinion, another upper motor mount, lower transmission mount and a new cruise control unit.
Not to hijack the thread but MAN, are you just keeping it alive because you're in this deep already or what? Get out while you can unless you're emotionally tied to it due to the amount of work you've done on it.
I'd take the Civic but that's just the Honda in me speaking.
Since I do the work myself, it's isn't that expensive to keep the car in top condition. As long as I keep with the repairs, I'm sure the car will keep running. Judging from the list, it's pretty evident that I have already replaced the majority of the wear and tear parts on the car. Aside from the things that I need replace now, the only other problems I can foresee in the future are a water pump and a transmission valve body.
If I recall correctly, your Civic has more miles than my Saturn. Haven't you had some of the same issues?
That low mileage escort looks interesting. If I had to get an automatic I'd get a saturn; they aren't perfect but they make the most of an underpowered 4 cyl engine. They're heavy on the torque convertor lockup so they feel like they're shifting like a stick shift. Escorts are the most likely to be found in a wagon if you keep looking.
Newer hyundais roll through CL quickly, worth snapping up. Roll them right to the garage for a timing belt though. They're the sort of car that spaztic college students get bought by their parents; unvalued, they sell cheaply and suddenly. Would prefer a stick shift in most hyundais.
Otherwise I like the looks of your list. Agree the civic is probably too old. No neons? They're plausibly ok if gotten cheaply enough. Sure they need head gaskets but those look pretty easy. Neon expressos join y2k era prisms with the dubius honor of the last 3 speed automatics remaining in this country.
Newer hyundais roll through CL quickly, worth snapping up. Roll them right to the garage for a timing belt though. They're the sort of car that spaztic college students get bought by their parents; unvalued, they sell cheaply and suddenly. Would prefer a stick shift in most hyundais.
Otherwise I like the looks of your list. Agree the civic is probably too old. No neons? They're plausibly ok if gotten cheaply enough. Sure they need head gaskets but those look pretty easy. Neon expressos join y2k era prisms with the dubius honor of the last 3 speed automatics remaining in this country.
Ceteris paribus (all things equal), I'd go for the Focus.
Younger is almost always better in any car.
However, addyguy has a really good point in that condition really matters.
If the car looks to have been well looked after, it probably has been. If the owner cared enough to keep the car in good looking condition, then the owner probably took care of the mechanics as well.
Condition is really everything in an older used car.
Condition determines the car's value, and is a likely indicator of future reliability.
After all of the above, if the Civic has had a documented T-belt service, and if the car is otherwise decent, it would be my personal pick. If the car still needs the T-belt service, stay away unless you can get seller down to 14-1500, since it must be done at once.
Younger is almost always better in any car.
However, addyguy has a really good point in that condition really matters.
If the car looks to have been well looked after, it probably has been. If the owner cared enough to keep the car in good looking condition, then the owner probably took care of the mechanics as well.
Condition is really everything in an older used car.
Condition determines the car's value, and is a likely indicator of future reliability.
After all of the above, if the Civic has had a documented T-belt service, and if the car is otherwise decent, it would be my personal pick. If the car still needs the T-belt service, stay away unless you can get seller down to 14-1500, since it must be done at once.
That Civic is at a Kia dealer in Austin (Capitol) so I doubt they have maintenance records for the car. I have found a few more cars to add to the list, specifically a NICE 2001 Saturn SL1 in bright blue. It's $2195 but it's also $2195 down from $2495 so they might have a little more wiggle room. The downside of that one is that it's 3 hours away in Greenville and the ad has no miles. So I've got a phone call to make in the morning.
I'm leaning more towards the Escorts at this point, seeing as how cheap they are and all. I did a scrubbing for Escorts again and came up with six identical ones, maroon, 5 automatics, 1 stick, two from my list plus four more at $1000, $1000, $1100, and $1250. Downside here, the stick one already has 299K on it. Downside #2 is the $1000 and $1100 cars have check engine lights on. But 4 cars for $3500? Register and insure two, drive the snot out of them, then register and insure the other two and use the first two for parts.
Wifey won't go for that, I don't think. But think I might just take the 5-speed one for myself, deal it down from $1000 to $700 or so, then also get the nicest one ($1595 with all synthetic fluids and books and records and stuff) and let wifey drive that one. Call it $1300, for $2000 plus taxes and fees we'd have two great cars, one nice for her because she likes that sort of thing, and a beater for me to play with and try to get 40mpg...
I'm leaning more towards the Escorts at this point, seeing as how cheap they are and all. I did a scrubbing for Escorts again and came up with six identical ones, maroon, 5 automatics, 1 stick, two from my list plus four more at $1000, $1000, $1100, and $1250. Downside here, the stick one already has 299K on it. Downside #2 is the $1000 and $1100 cars have check engine lights on. But 4 cars for $3500? Register and insure two, drive the snot out of them, then register and insure the other two and use the first two for parts.
Wifey won't go for that, I don't think. But think I might just take the 5-speed one for myself, deal it down from $1000 to $700 or so, then also get the nicest one ($1595 with all synthetic fluids and books and records and stuff) and let wifey drive that one. Call it $1300, for $2000 plus taxes and fees we'd have two great cars, one nice for her because she likes that sort of thing, and a beater for me to play with and try to get 40mpg...
Originally Posted By: The Critic
Originally Posted By: Chris Meutsch
Originally Posted By: The Critic
The engine has never given me any serious problems. The rest of the car though, is an entirely different story. Here are the things that have failed:
Alternator
Starter
PCV Breather Hose
Radiator
Radiator Cap
Thermostat
Valve Cover Gasket Kit
Upper Motor Mount
Trunk Wiring Harness
Serpentine Belt Tensioner
Front Strut Mounts
Sway Bar End Links
Engine Coolant Temp Sensor
Pre-Cat Oxygen Sensor
Heater Core
Transmission Top Cover Gasket
With 140k on the clock, now I am due for a master cylinder, two lower control arms, possibly a rack and pinion, another upper motor mount, lower transmission mount and a new cruise control unit.
Not to hijack the thread but MAN, are you just keeping it alive because you're in this deep already or what? Get out while you can unless you're emotionally tied to it due to the amount of work you've done on it.
I'd take the Civic but that's just the Honda in me speaking.
Since I do the work myself, it's isn't that expensive to keep the car in top condition. As long as I keep with the repairs, I'm sure the car will keep running. Judging from the list, it's pretty evident that I have already replaced the majority of the wear and tear parts on the car. Aside from the things that I need replace now, the only other problems I can foresee in the future are a water pump and a transmission valve body.
If I recall correctly, your Civic has more miles than my Saturn. Haven't you had some of the same issues?
The only parts to go bad at 208k are the alternator at 179k (did it myself) and the thermal overload circuit on the A/C compressor, twice. That cost me $100 grand total. Timing belt and water pump twice over routine mileage. Oil/trans/coolant fluids over routine mileage. I've been lucky.
And, the "dreaded" Honda A/T keeps going perfectly. Honda A/T's have become the new "Pennzoil makes wax in your engine" theme. Just ain't true. They had a design issue over 3-4 years, fixed it, and it doesn't seem like they still have that issue.
Originally Posted By: Chris Meutsch
Originally Posted By: The Critic
The engine has never given me any serious problems. The rest of the car though, is an entirely different story. Here are the things that have failed:
Alternator
Starter
PCV Breather Hose
Radiator
Radiator Cap
Thermostat
Valve Cover Gasket Kit
Upper Motor Mount
Trunk Wiring Harness
Serpentine Belt Tensioner
Front Strut Mounts
Sway Bar End Links
Engine Coolant Temp Sensor
Pre-Cat Oxygen Sensor
Heater Core
Transmission Top Cover Gasket
With 140k on the clock, now I am due for a master cylinder, two lower control arms, possibly a rack and pinion, another upper motor mount, lower transmission mount and a new cruise control unit.
Not to hijack the thread but MAN, are you just keeping it alive because you're in this deep already or what? Get out while you can unless you're emotionally tied to it due to the amount of work you've done on it.
I'd take the Civic but that's just the Honda in me speaking.
Since I do the work myself, it's isn't that expensive to keep the car in top condition. As long as I keep with the repairs, I'm sure the car will keep running. Judging from the list, it's pretty evident that I have already replaced the majority of the wear and tear parts on the car. Aside from the things that I need replace now, the only other problems I can foresee in the future are a water pump and a transmission valve body.
If I recall correctly, your Civic has more miles than my Saturn. Haven't you had some of the same issues?
The only parts to go bad at 208k are the alternator at 179k (did it myself) and the thermal overload circuit on the A/C compressor, twice. That cost me $100 grand total. Timing belt and water pump twice over routine mileage. Oil/trans/coolant fluids over routine mileage. I've been lucky.
And, the "dreaded" Honda A/T keeps going perfectly. Honda A/T's have become the new "Pennzoil makes wax in your engine" theme. Just ain't true. They had a design issue over 3-4 years, fixed it, and it doesn't seem like they still have that issue.
Originally Posted By: addyguy
Occupant,
Your Torino not cutting it as a DD? Too much oil sludge?
dang kids keep trying to steal it
fwiw, the escort is a protege chassis but the larger escort engines seem to get better mpg's
and don't forget about the mercury tracer
what are the prices like for older honda accords? mazda 626?
Occupant,
Your Torino not cutting it as a DD? Too much oil sludge?
dang kids keep trying to steal it
fwiw, the escort is a protege chassis but the larger escort engines seem to get better mpg's
and don't forget about the mercury tracer
what are the prices like for older honda accords? mazda 626?
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Originally Posted By: occupant
I have SCOURED and SCRUBBED the local CL and AutoTrader listings and came up with around 30 vehicles that fit our parameters:
priced at $2000 or less
automatic transmission
better than 25mpg combined (from fueleconomy.gov, 80% hwy)
4-door sedan, 4-door hatchback, or 4-door wagon
I have this all set up in a spreadsheet and I sorted them by fuel mileage to come up with a top ten. This top ten includes:
93 Civic LX sedan, 107K, $1988
99 Saturn SL1, 113K, $1940
99 Saturn SL1, 144K, $1590
00 Escort sedan, 147K, $1595 (seller claims only M1 used)
98 Escort sedan, 131K, $1650
98 Escort sedan, 96K, $1200
01 Focus SE sedan, 122K, $1800
98 Prizm sedan, 148K, $1995
97 Saturn SL1, 135K, $1300
04 Elantra GLS sedan, miles unkn, $2000
It seems the automatic Escorts and Saturns do quite well on the EPA cycle. I'm also considering buying two vehicles, at which point the budget goes to $3000 and I'd get two of the same, either two Escorts or two Saturns I guess, and make one stick and one automatic.
With Saturn gone and known as oil burners and the Escort history of spotty reliability, where is the happy medium?
04 Elantra GLS sedan, miles unkn, $2000 Just my
I have SCOURED and SCRUBBED the local CL and AutoTrader listings and came up with around 30 vehicles that fit our parameters:
priced at $2000 or less
automatic transmission
better than 25mpg combined (from fueleconomy.gov, 80% hwy)
4-door sedan, 4-door hatchback, or 4-door wagon
I have this all set up in a spreadsheet and I sorted them by fuel mileage to come up with a top ten. This top ten includes:
93 Civic LX sedan, 107K, $1988
99 Saturn SL1, 113K, $1940
99 Saturn SL1, 144K, $1590
00 Escort sedan, 147K, $1595 (seller claims only M1 used)
98 Escort sedan, 131K, $1650
98 Escort sedan, 96K, $1200
01 Focus SE sedan, 122K, $1800
98 Prizm sedan, 148K, $1995
97 Saturn SL1, 135K, $1300
04 Elantra GLS sedan, miles unkn, $2000
It seems the automatic Escorts and Saturns do quite well on the EPA cycle. I'm also considering buying two vehicles, at which point the budget goes to $3000 and I'd get two of the same, either two Escorts or two Saturns I guess, and make one stick and one automatic.
With Saturn gone and known as oil burners and the Escort history of spotty reliability, where is the happy medium?
04 Elantra GLS sedan, miles unkn, $2000 Just my
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Originally Posted By: gtx510
Originally Posted By: addyguy
Occupant,
Your Torino not cutting it as a DD? Too much oil sludge?
dang kids keep trying to steal it
fwiw, the escort is a protege chassis but the larger escort engines seem to get better mpg's
and don't forget about the mercury tracer
what are the prices like for older honda accords? mazda 626?
The 91-96 escorts have protege roots, I'm pretty sure the 97-00 ones don't but I could be wrong. I like the old 4cyl accord idea, maybe a 4 cyl 626 but the V6 ones are very complex for beater duty IMO.
Originally Posted By: addyguy
Occupant,
Your Torino not cutting it as a DD? Too much oil sludge?
dang kids keep trying to steal it
fwiw, the escort is a protege chassis but the larger escort engines seem to get better mpg's
and don't forget about the mercury tracer
what are the prices like for older honda accords? mazda 626?
The 91-96 escorts have protege roots, I'm pretty sure the 97-00 ones don't but I could be wrong. I like the old 4cyl accord idea, maybe a 4 cyl 626 but the V6 ones are very complex for beater duty IMO.
Originally Posted By: IndyIan
I'm pretty sure the 97-00 ones don't
They do. I've worked on both a '97 and a '91 Escort. Many things are the same.
I'm pretty sure the 97-00 ones don't
They do. I've worked on both a '97 and a '91 Escort. Many things are the same.
Originally Posted By: The Critic
Originally Posted By: saaber1
I had one 96 SL2 engine failure at 76k miles due to oil starvation. I have had around 15 of the SL1's and never had problems really even over 200k miles so I think sl1 is more reliable but that is based on the 20 total samples I have owned only.
The engine has never given me any serious problems. The rest of the car though, is an entirely different story. Here are the things that have failed:
Alternator
Starter
PCV Breather Hose
Radiator
Radiator Cap
Thermostat
Valve Cover Gasket Kit
Upper Motor Mount
Trunk Wiring Harness
Serpentine Belt Tensioner
Front Strut Mounts
Sway Bar End Links
Engine Coolant Temp Sensor
Pre-Cat Oxygen Sensor
Heater Core
Transmission Top Cover Gasket
With 140k on the clock, now I am due for a master cylinder, two lower control arms, possibly a rack and pinion, another upper motor mount, lower transmission mount and a new cruise control unit.
A friend of mine also had a 96 SL2...He had the same issues as the The Critic...It was totaled out by a Tahoe at 135K miles [thank heavens] as I hated to even ride in it.
Originally Posted By: saaber1
I had one 96 SL2 engine failure at 76k miles due to oil starvation. I have had around 15 of the SL1's and never had problems really even over 200k miles so I think sl1 is more reliable but that is based on the 20 total samples I have owned only.
The engine has never given me any serious problems. The rest of the car though, is an entirely different story. Here are the things that have failed:
Alternator
Starter
PCV Breather Hose
Radiator
Radiator Cap
Thermostat
Valve Cover Gasket Kit
Upper Motor Mount
Trunk Wiring Harness
Serpentine Belt Tensioner
Front Strut Mounts
Sway Bar End Links
Engine Coolant Temp Sensor
Pre-Cat Oxygen Sensor
Heater Core
Transmission Top Cover Gasket
With 140k on the clock, now I am due for a master cylinder, two lower control arms, possibly a rack and pinion, another upper motor mount, lower transmission mount and a new cruise control unit.
A friend of mine also had a 96 SL2...He had the same issues as the The Critic...It was totaled out by a Tahoe at 135K miles [thank heavens] as I hated to even ride in it.
Originally Posted By: bigdreama
You have to look at the cars!
The internet won't help you much there.
I don't even have to post Captain Obvious's photo. I'm sure you have your own copy by now.
I don't want to waste my time looking at vehicles which aren't worth looking at in the long run. But I do want to narrow my search down to about ten cars and I think between the many Escorts and Saturn SL1's and the few Corollas and Civics that fall into our needs, I'll stick to those brands and might even get lucky enough to find a blue, gray, or black one.
You have to look at the cars!
The internet won't help you much there.
I don't even have to post Captain Obvious's photo. I'm sure you have your own copy by now.
I don't want to waste my time looking at vehicles which aren't worth looking at in the long run. But I do want to narrow my search down to about ten cars and I think between the many Escorts and Saturn SL1's and the few Corollas and Civics that fall into our needs, I'll stick to those brands and might even get lucky enough to find a blue, gray, or black one.
My 99 SL2 has been one of the best vehicles I have owned. Running very strong with 159,000 miles on it. Top engine mount, thermostat, ECTS, water pump, radiator, and muffler replaced. The rest has been regular maintenance for the 88,000 miles I have had it. The problem I see as Saturn dealerships close is getting parts. One repair I did not mention. The slider on my back passenger window broke. It was a $15 part from the dealer. With Richpin06a on You Tube and Saturnfansforums I did the repair myself. I would say the Saturn but as time goes on some Saturn OEM parts may be harder to get.
Get an old Volvo.
JHZR2
Staff member
an old E30 BMW. Mine is great as a commuter.
I couldn't trust my life and livelihood to a $1,000 vehicle.
Originally Posted By: Papa Bear
I couldn't trust my life and livelihood to a $1,000 vehicle.
well news to you on the lofty perch: some people have to because of not enough money! Mike
I couldn't trust my life and livelihood to a $1,000 vehicle.
well news to you on the lofty perch: some people have to because of not enough money! Mike
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