Interesting Read
- Thread starter kanz
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thanks! interesting for sure as many big names spend $$$$ on advertising others can give a better product for less $$! never liked Fram but i guess their top of line filter is good + $$$ i still NEVER buy Fram products. comparing oil filters for actual performance is hard as manufacturers like it so they can bull pup you!!
From the link:
"Fram also has paper cover plates and a lower-grade of rubber for the anti-drain valve and the sealing ring."
I have no faith in someone who uses the term "paper cover plates" and has no way to determine what grade of rubber is used for the ADBV - which happens to be silicone now. He's not even up with the times.
"Fram also has paper cover plates and a lower-grade of rubber for the anti-drain valve and the sealing ring."
I have no faith in someone who uses the term "paper cover plates" and has no way to determine what grade of rubber is used for the ADBV - which happens to be silicone now. He's not even up with the times.
This guy is saying that the ST filter is 95% efficient @ 27 microns, which sounds similar to the WIX made ST filter numbers. The "old" Champ made ST filters were 94% @ 20 microns. So it sounds like efficiency took a step backwards with the new ST filters.
Ive had superb results and UOAs using proselect filters. Will continue using them.
Guy has no idea what he is talking about-he states Bosch OWNS Purolator?? Where do we find these automotive comedians? Dude works at a "major startup", but can't even take an in-focus profile photo?
Originally Posted by chainblu
This guy is saying that the ST filter is 95% efficient @ 27 microns, which sounds similar to the WIX made ST filter numbers. The "old" Champ made ST filters were 94% @ 20 microns. So it sounds like efficiency took a step backwards with the new ST filters.
Yes, they were. But Champ claimed a 5000 mile FCI. Walmart wanted a 10,000 mile FCI.
This guy is saying that the ST filter is 95% efficient @ 27 microns, which sounds similar to the WIX made ST filter numbers. The "old" Champ made ST filters were 94% @ 20 microns. So it sounds like efficiency took a step backwards with the new ST filters.
Yes, they were. But Champ claimed a 5000 mile FCI. Walmart wanted a 10,000 mile FCI.
And yet still a step forward in efficiency relative to the Wix made Supertech oil filters.
"New ecore style"? Many Ecores used in previous Champ made ST filter eg., ST3614. "Media... stiff synthetic material" in ST6607? Different than other ST? So not cellulose based media anymore? hmm Says 6607 can't be used for 10k miles, and yet same box as all the rest, up to 10k.
"enhanced SuperTech st9688 oil filter has steel cover plates". Yes now anecdote shows hybrid ecore with metal endcaps, previous ST9688 classic metal endcap construction. Other ecores like ST3614, still felt/fiber endcap with combo valve. When there's so many errors of omission, not sure what information can be trusted. Reads like an ST oil filter puff piece, imo.
Despite what box says, ST a ~5k mi. max oci filter imo.
"enhanced SuperTech st9688 oil filter has steel cover plates". Yes now anecdote shows hybrid ecore with metal endcaps, previous ST9688 classic metal endcap construction. Other ecores like ST3614, still felt/fiber endcap with combo valve. When there's so many errors of omission, not sure what information can be trusted. Reads like an ST oil filter puff piece, imo.
Despite what box says, ST a ~5k mi. max oci filter imo.
dnewton3
Staff member
Originally Posted by ZeeOSix
From the link:
"Fram also has paper cover plates and a lower-grade of rubber for the anti-drain valve and the sealing ring."
I have no faith in someone who uses the term "paper cover plates" and has no way to determine what grade of rubber is used for the ADBV - which happens to be silicone now. He's not even up with the times.
I would agree, Zee.
Additionally, he talks about the different sizes as if it's preferable to make a selection of your own accord; like we should be buying the filters based upon size, and not application. The ST filters have an application chart just like all the other brands do. This isn't a place where you get to select one on your own; you should be following the ST application guide like you would with any other. To that end, he dives off (as most do) into some theoretical bandwidth of capacity limits. Understandably, in concept, a smaller filter will have less capacity; that's true if all other things are equal. But there's no proof that smaller filters are "under-capacitized" relative to the applications in today's cars. Between good air filtration, sealed crankcases, and quality lubes, there's no reason to believe that even smaller filters are being over-taxed in capacity. We've all seen plenty of UOAs and PCs from cars that run small filters, and no evidence whatsoever exists that these applications were in perpetual bypass (indicating a "plugged" filter; aka filled to capacity).
Just more hogwash from the internet, if you ask me.
From the link:
"Fram also has paper cover plates and a lower-grade of rubber for the anti-drain valve and the sealing ring."
I have no faith in someone who uses the term "paper cover plates" and has no way to determine what grade of rubber is used for the ADBV - which happens to be silicone now. He's not even up with the times.
I would agree, Zee.
Additionally, he talks about the different sizes as if it's preferable to make a selection of your own accord; like we should be buying the filters based upon size, and not application. The ST filters have an application chart just like all the other brands do. This isn't a place where you get to select one on your own; you should be following the ST application guide like you would with any other. To that end, he dives off (as most do) into some theoretical bandwidth of capacity limits. Understandably, in concept, a smaller filter will have less capacity; that's true if all other things are equal. But there's no proof that smaller filters are "under-capacitized" relative to the applications in today's cars. Between good air filtration, sealed crankcases, and quality lubes, there's no reason to believe that even smaller filters are being over-taxed in capacity. We've all seen plenty of UOAs and PCs from cars that run small filters, and no evidence whatsoever exists that these applications were in perpetual bypass (indicating a "plugged" filter; aka filled to capacity).
Just more hogwash from the internet, if you ask me.
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Originally Posted by bullwinkle
Guy has no idea what he is talking about-he states Bosch OWNS Purolator?? Where do we find these automotive comedians?
To be fair he does not state Bosch owns Purolator, but he says: "Once Bosch finalized its takeover of Purolator and slowly phased it out in favor of the parent brand ...". This information is not fully correct too, but from somewhere 2007/2008 to 2013 Purolator was run by the joint venture of Mann+Hummel and Bosch in which M+H was handling OE market and Bosch was dealing with AM customers. After M+H took over Purolator in 2013 Bosch passed its customers to M+H. In view of this I would say that he has not presented the info in a right way, kind of a half-truth, and it seems he did it deliberately to demonize Bosch for some reasons.
Guy has no idea what he is talking about-he states Bosch OWNS Purolator?? Where do we find these automotive comedians?
To be fair he does not state Bosch owns Purolator, but he says: "Once Bosch finalized its takeover of Purolator and slowly phased it out in favor of the parent brand ...". This information is not fully correct too, but from somewhere 2007/2008 to 2013 Purolator was run by the joint venture of Mann+Hummel and Bosch in which M+H was handling OE market and Bosch was dealing with AM customers. After M+H took over Purolator in 2013 Bosch passed its customers to M+H. In view of this I would say that he has not presented the info in a right way, kind of a half-truth, and it seems he did it deliberately to demonize Bosch for some reasons.
Him
Quote
"However, for most makes and models, you can actually assume that most aftermarket oil filters will ultimately do a better job. In fact, the average OEM oil filter only filtered out about 72 percent of contaminants. On top of that, the filter's medium provided a whopping 10 microns of passage for contaminants, so not only was plenty of junk making it through, but the junk was pretty big too.
he has NO IDEA how large a 10 micron particle is....
Most diesel fuel filters are rated at 10 microns
Quote
"However, for most makes and models, you can actually assume that most aftermarket oil filters will ultimately do a better job. In fact, the average OEM oil filter only filtered out about 72 percent of contaminants. On top of that, the filter's medium provided a whopping 10 microns of passage for contaminants, so not only was plenty of junk making it through, but the junk was pretty big too.
he has NO IDEA how large a 10 micron particle is....
Most diesel fuel filters are rated at 10 microns
Wow, just wow.
As already pointed out, so much misinformation in this "article".
I am just reading this and saying in my head "um, no. That is wrong, so is that, and that, and that...".
He complains about the "metal mold spring" of the Fram, yet the blow-up of the ST shows what, oh a "metal mold spring".
And the video in the article, again, so many issues. Comparing a Wix made ST when the article is about a Champ made ST, plus why did he not open the Fram on camera, oh, thats right, he had to tear the fiber endcaps before showing the "cardboard" endcaps.
And then the High Mileage filter (which is no longer made) he showed, only 40-50 miles use my rear. And again, also cut before the video.
As already pointed out, so much misinformation in this "article".
I am just reading this and saying in my head "um, no. That is wrong, so is that, and that, and that...".
He complains about the "metal mold spring" of the Fram, yet the blow-up of the ST shows what, oh a "metal mold spring".
And the video in the article, again, so many issues. Comparing a Wix made ST when the article is about a Champ made ST, plus why did he not open the Fram on camera, oh, thats right, he had to tear the fiber endcaps before showing the "cardboard" endcaps.
And then the High Mileage filter (which is no longer made) he showed, only 40-50 miles use my rear. And again, also cut before the video.
Just read it and watched the video. Just soooo bad.
Somewhat surprised that this guy would recommend Super Tech filters, since Amazon is paying him for his referrals. He's pretty clueless, though!
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