Increase oil change interval due to high altitude

[littleboss]

Hi

I just bought a new Deere skid steer and it recommends to replace the engine oil at half the normal interval when operating at high altitudes. I have never heard of this before. Have you?

 

[Bryanccfshr]

Yes I have seen this before.

 

[Chris142]

Why? Less air.Runs rich?

 

[Boomer]

Closer to the sun??

 

[ad244]

Less Water?

 

[ZeeOSix]

Originally Posted by Chris142
Why? Less air.Runs rich?


If it's computer controlled injection it should compensate for altitude.

 

[Snagglefoot]

My take is it will produce less power because less torque will be available due to a thinner atmosphere with less air density. This will make the operator want to give it more throttle to compensate. More throttle means "severe service". I believe they chose the more frequent changes as a rule of thumb. Probably they saw some service issues in Colorado. Just a guess.

 

[oghl]

Engines tend to run at higher rpm at altitude due to the thinner air density. I would imagine that would cause faster oil degradation from higher temperature, higher piston/bearing speeds, higher evaporation, etc.

So more frequent changes does make sense

 

[CR94]

Is that a diesel?

 

[littleboss]

Originally Posted by CR94
Is that a diesel?


Yes, A Deere 320G with a Yanmar turbocharged diesel. My '14 329E compact track loader has a Deere engine and it makes no mention of high altitude. So I at first thought it was due to something about the Yanmar being different than the Deere engine.

I then realized that this new machine has a DPF (no DEF fluid) and does regens while the older 329E doesn't. So I assume it has something to do with this new pollution equipment?

A turbocharged engine with direct injection should have no issues with altitude.

Thanks

 

[Dave9]

Define high altitude... I didn't think TX was all that high.

 

[DONWATERS]

Less power at altitude so more load on it.

 

[littleboss]

Deere specifies high altitude as over 5500'.

My farm in Texas is 850' AMSL. My place in Colorado where the skid steer is going is 8518' AMSL

 

[Onetor]

What about people who own vehicles in Denver? I guess over a mile high, could be a cause for shorter OCI.

 

[Snagglefoot]

The turbo will be working harder to get sufficient boost. Atmospheric pressure at sea level is about 14.7 psi. At 5,000 ft it's about 12.2 psi. At 9,000 ft it is 10.9 psi. Not sure what this turbo takes the boost pressure up to but AFAIK typical farm tractors add 6 to 8 psi of boost to the atmospheric pressure unless you're in a tractor pull competition running 200 psi of boost.

 

[Snagglefoot]

Originally Posted by Dave9
Define high altitude... I didn't think TX was all that high.


On average no, but the highest point in Texas is 8,751 ft at Guadalupe point in west Texas.

 

[dnewton3]

I'm not sure of why this is so in the manual, but a few things we can discuss ...

- can't be the rpm; I would think that is governed at a max by the ECM; don't know why the max rpm allowance would be any different as rpm "red line" is to protect the mechanical hard parts, not a combustion process. I'm going to guess the max rpm to be somewhere between 2800 and 3200 rpm? it's not like 2800 rpm at 7k feet is any different than 2800 rpm at 2k feet of altitude; rpm is rpm.
- could be air-density related; less air might make for a slightly dirtier combustion event (more soot ??? IDK - just a stab at a guess here) However if it's a turbo, that should make up for most of the loss.
- probably has something to do with the DEF and/or DPF, but I'm not an expert on these so I cannot offer any justification past a swag

This is one topic that would be very interesting to go right to the source; contact JD tech lines, etc. It will be hard; their first response is going to be "contact your local dealer".

We don't see this in OEM mainstream automaker manuals; altitude is not a "severe service" factor (albeit it seems just about anything else is .... )

 

[Snagglefoot]

Yes, the Turbo will make up for most of the loss, but it will be on full boost for longer periods of time. The oil will be subjected to higher turbo bearing temps for longer periods of time resulting in more degradation of the oil. Is it that significant? I'll bet they wore out a few turbos in Colorado.

 

[littleboss]

Originally Posted by Snagglefoot
Yes, the Turbo will make up for most of the loss, but it will be on full boost for longer periods of time. The oil will be subjected to higher turbo bearing temps for longer periods of time resulting in more degradation of the oil. Is it that significant? I'll bet they wore out a few turbos in Colorado.

I also looked at the manual on my 6105R tractor. It is a '13 model with no DPF. It makes no mention of high altitude service intervals either.

So I have two machines with no DPF and neither mention high altitude, the new machine with a DPF does. I still think it's DPF and emissions equipment related.

As long as Deere has been building and selling turbo diesel engines they didn't just now figure out that high altitude requires a different oil change schedule.

 

[edyvw]

Originally Posted by littleboss
Deere specifies high altitude as over 5500'.

My farm in Texas is 850' AMSL. My place in Colorado where the skid steer is going is 8518' AMSL


That is not high altitude in Colorado