How much a 2nd job takes out of you

[Astro14]

OZ has set itself up to be China's Quarry...but there is still a large component of tourism...let's just hope that it's more than just Chinese tourists!

In all honesty, the strong Aussie dollar has hurt manufacturing and exports, while the strong prices for commodities have bolstered your economy. It's been a 20 year run of strong economic growth in Australia...and all cycles have a way of coming to an end...

 

[rjundi]

I have never worked two job consequentially.

However I have worked full time as Civil Engineering producing as much if not more than others and in the same 8hr day taken online course(did Computer Science undergrad core requirements).

I also would work set 40hr weeks for one one IT company and figure out how to job in 25-32hrs and then work extra for other clients remotely.

 

[Shannow]

Originally Posted By: Astro14
OZ has set itself up to be China's Quarry...but there is still a large component of tourism...let's just hope that it's more than just Chinese tourists!

In all honesty, the strong Aussie dollar has hurt manufacturing and exports, while the strong prices for commodities have bolstered your economy. It's been a 20 year run of strong economic growth in Australia...and all cycles have a way of coming to an end...


http://www.ustr.gov/countries-regions/southeast-asia-pacific/australia

Like I said, the US "free trade" likes our resources and jobs, not our products.

 

[Mykl]

Originally Posted By: IndyIan
Except not everybody profits... Income distribution inequality is increasing here, $20+/hr manufacturing jobs are flushing to China/India at a huge rate, where some poor sap makes a tiny fraction of that, the company obtains our intellectual property, and we buy the product back at a minor savings... Why politicians are acting in the best interests of huge corporations and not the average man is a mystery to me. I guess we just allow them to do it, so they do.


So would you say that you seek out American made products even if it means paying considerably more for that product? If you could buy five Chinese widgets for every single American widget why wouldn't you go Chinese? Your purchasing power just went up.... and you're unhappy about that?

Again I'd like to drive home the point that it works both ways. In the auto industry alone Toyota, Honda, Subaru, Volkswagen, BMW, Mercedes Benz, Hyundai, Kia, and Nissan have all spent billions of dollars in America and created thousands of jobs for Americans.... and you're unhappy about that?

Did you know that five of the ten most American made cars (by parts content and assembly location) are built by Honda or Toyota?

*edit* - nevermind, you're Canadian, you have no reason to be happy about any of that (for your southern neighbors)

 

[IndyIan]

Originally Posted By: Mykl
Originally Posted By: IndyIan
Except not everybody profits... Income distribution inequality is increasing here, $20+/hr manufacturing jobs are flushing to China/India at a huge rate, where some poor sap makes a tiny fraction of that, the company obtains our intellectual property, and we buy the product back at a minor savings... Why politicians are acting in the best interests of huge corporations and not the average man is a mystery to me. I guess we just allow them to do it, so they do.


So would you say that you seek out American made products even if it means paying considerably more for that product? If you could buy five Chinese widgets for every single American widget why wouldn't you go Chinese? Your purchasing power just went up.... and you're unhappy about that?

Again I'd like to drive home the point that it works both ways. In the auto industry alone Toyota, Honda, Subaru, Volkswagen, BMW, Mercedes Benz, Hyundai, Kia, and Nissan have all spent billions of dollars in America and created thousands of jobs for Americans.... and you're unhappy about that?

Did you know that five of the ten most American made cars (by parts content and assembly location) are built by Honda or Toyota?

*edit* - nevermind, you're Canadian, you have no reason to be happy about any of that (for your southern neighbors)

I still try to buy from responsible countries when I can, even if its at a reasonable premium. Usually the cheap version of the widget, is only a bit cheaper and isn't a savings anyways when you take into account its lifecycle.
I don't have a problem with free trade with comparable countries like Korea, Japan, Germany and I suspect their investment in the US is driven by increasing profits by avoiding import tarrifs and taking advantage of lower wages. Nothing wrong with that.
I just think if you do the math, the all the jobs lost to China/India/Bangladesh/etc in 100 other manufacturing sectors, out weighs the benefits of the current trade policies for the average person.

 

[Win]

Originally Posted By: Shannow
Originally Posted By: Astro14
OZ has set itself up to be China's Quarry...but there is still a large component of tourism...let's just hope that it's more than just Chinese tourists!

In all honesty, the strong Aussie dollar has hurt manufacturing and exports, while the strong prices for commodities have bolstered your economy. It's been a 20 year run of strong economic growth in Australia...and all cycles have a way of coming to an end...


http://www.ustr.gov/countries-regions/southeast-asia-pacific/australia

Like I said, the US "free trade" likes our resources and jobs, not our products.


Export some more Holdens to us.

Or a Falcon. I'd love to have a Falcon before they quit making them.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: Mykl


So would you say that you seek out American made products even if it means paying considerably more for that product? If you could buy five Chinese widgets for every single American widget why wouldn't you go Chinese? Your purchasing power just went up.... and you're unhappy about that?


I seek out and purchase first-world produced products whenever possible. That means the best product gets my money be it American, Canadian, German, Japanese, French, English, Australian....etc.

I don't support the idea of supporting 3rd-world slave labour or countries with zero respect for copyright and labour laws. Which is EXACTLY what you are supporting when you show it is OK to buy Chinese goods just because they are less expensive/cheap.

Quote:
Again I'd like to drive home the point that it works both ways. In the auto industry alone Toyota, Honda, Subaru, Volkswagen, BMW, Mercedes Benz, Hyundai, Kia, and Nissan have all spent billions of dollars in America and created thousands of jobs for Americans.... and you're unhappy about that?


Those are all companies headquartered in first-world nations with similar costs and standards of living to our own. What is unfair about any of that? You are lumping outsourcing to China, Bangladesh...etc in with large first-world-based organizations building assembly/manufacturing facilities in nations that are consumers of their products. Those two things have nothing in common!

Quote:
Did you know that five of the ten most American made cars (by parts content and assembly location) are built by Honda or Toyota?


Did YOU know that the cost of living in Japan is similar to Canada/USA and that they aren't a third world nation?

Quote:

*edit* - nevermind, you're Canadian, you have no reason to be happy about any of that (for your southern neighbors)


Nice. Well done. Can't come up with a legitimate way of justifying your original argument or making it stand on its own so instead you try and blend it in with fair competition from other nations and serve it with a nice side of slap in the face directed at your neighbours to the north. Bravo.

 

[OVERKILL]

Mykl:

Just to make this as clear as possible:

When Toyota/BMW/Honda/Audi....etc builds a factory in the USA it is NOT to exploit "cheap American labour". It is to assemble vehicles for a market in which there is a large consumer base for their product(s) and to get rid of some of the shipping costs. They aren't closing down a factory in Germany or Japan and sending those jobs overseas.

When BELL sets up a call centre in India it isn't because India is a large consumer of BELL's phone/Internet/Cellular service, it is because labour in India is dirt cheap. And when they setup that call centre there, they CLOSE the call centre in Canada. In fact the slap in the face is that the people at the facility being outsourced usually have to train their replacements!!!

When Sears out-sourced their Craftsman tool line to China, do you think the people who manufactured the tools kept their jobs? Of course they didn't. Do you think the people in China manufacturing the tools are large consumers of the Sears Craftsman brand? No, of course they aren't. Sears didn't move manufacturing to China to serve the Chinese market, they moved it to China to save money. And in doing so put thousands of Americans out of work.

One cannot, with any inkling of sanity, contrast the competition between first-world marques, who all vi for business in each others markets and employ citizens of each nation as part of that competition, to a company operating in one of those nations whose goal it is to bolster their bottom-line so they shutter a facility and send those manufacturing jobs overseas. They are not even in the same ballpark. The first encourages competition, development and works out BETTER for the consumer! The 2nd puts your fellow Americans out of work, increases unemployment, dependence on welfare and hand-outs as well as crime. But hey, at least it means the company made more money right?

 

[Mykl]

Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Nice. Well done. Can't come up with a legitimate way of justifying your original argument or making it stand on its own so instead you try and blend it in with fair competition from other nations and serve it with a nice side of slap in the face directed at your neighbours to the north. Bravo.


You lost me at this. I thought we were having a reasonable conversation.

Have a nice day.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: Mykl
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Nice. Well done. Can't come up with a legitimate way of justifying your original argument or making it stand on its own so instead you try and blend it in with fair competition from other nations and serve it with a nice side of slap in the face directed at your neighbours to the north. Bravo.


You lost me at this. I thought we were having a reasonable conversation.

Have a nice day.

So saying that we (Canadians) have no reason to be happy for our neighbours to the south is part of a reasonable conversation?

Interesting. I believe we have two very different ideas as to what constitutes reasonable in this style of discourse.

 

[Mykl]

Originally Posted By: OVERKILL

So saying that we (Canadians) have no reason to be happy for our neighbours to the south is part of a reasonable conversation?

Interesting. I believe we have two very different ideas as to what constitutes reasonable in this style of discourse.


Why do you continue to press when I've shown that I do not care to move forward with our conversation? I am not conceding anything, I simply don't like your attitude. If you'd like to exchange ideas I'd be happy to, but I'm not here to win or lose a debate.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: Mykl
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL

So saying that we (Canadians) have no reason to be happy for our neighbours to the south is part of a reasonable conversation?

Interesting. I believe we have two very different ideas as to what constitutes reasonable in this style of discourse.


Why do you continue to press when I've shown that I do not care to move forward with our conversation? I am not conceding anything, I simply don't like your attitude. If you'd like to exchange ideas I'd be happy to, but I'm not here to win or lose a debate.


Continue to press? Sir, I believe your attempt to back-pedal and play taking the high road is betrayed by the post you already made at Ian stating that we, your neighbours to the north, care not with respect to what is best for you. I, and I'm sure any other Canadian reading it, took that as a slap in the face.

The fact that you are oblivious to this and appear to feel that it is I, who, offended by your remark and replied as such, is who took this discussion to the realm of unreasonable is nothing short of ridiculous.

We haven't even started to debate, so there is nothing to win or lose. You lumped some rather disparate things together and tried to pass them off as a homogenous concept and ended with a statement that was anything but polite. When I took exception to that all of a sudden it was "hands off, the Canadian is playing nasty". Please.

I don't know if this is just a pathetic attempt at getting out of a discussion you now feel you don't wish to engage in or if you legitimately cannot grasp how your statement was offensive. In either case I don't really care, if you've truly chosen to opt out of this discussion, then don't reply to me. Telling me you are done and then continuing to reply just proves that you want to keep talking. Even if you say otherwise.

 

[SatinSilver]

Originally Posted By: Mykl
Why do you continue to press when I've shown that I do not care to move forward with our conversation? I am not conceding anything, I simply don't like your attitude. If you'd like to exchange ideas I'd be happy to, but I'm not here to win or lose a debate.


Just don't respond back if you don't want to converse with him. Instead of telling him to have a nice day when you don't mean it. Which is kind of passive-aggressive behavior. Or "behaviour" for our Northern friends.

 

[Win]

Well, anyway, kudos to you, OP, for wanting to work two jobs.

Some people like carrying on multiple endeavors and jobs, and clearly some people like more leisure time.

A strong work ethic used to be considered a virtue. I've never really heard anything flattering about a strong leisure ethic.

 

[Mykl]

Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Continue to press? Sir, I believe your attempt to back-pedal and play taking the high road is betrayed by the post you already made at Ian stating that we, your neighbours to the north, care not with respect to what is best for you. I, and I'm sure any other Canadian reading it, took that as a slap in the face.

The fact that you are oblivious to this and appear to feel that it is I, who, offended by your remark and replied as such, is who took this discussion to the realm of unreasonable is nothing short of ridiculous.

We haven't even started to debate, so there is nothing to win or lose. You lumped some rather disparate things together and tried to pass them off as a homogenous concept and ended with a statement that was anything but polite. When I took exception to that all of a sudden it was "hands off, the Canadian is playing nasty". Please.

I don't know if this is just a pathetic attempt at getting out of a discussion you now feel you don't wish to engage in or if you legitimately cannot grasp how your statement was offensive. In either case I don't really care, if you've truly chosen to opt out of this discussion, then don't reply to me. Telling me you are done and then continuing to reply just proves that you want to keep talking. Even if you say otherwise.


...and you just keep pressing....

There's been a miscommunication here, because I have said nothing with the intent to offend. If my words have offended you, I am sorry, as again... not my intent.

You can keep typing up wordy posts if you want but I'm done with this.

 

[Mykl]

Originally Posted By: satinsilver
Just don't respond back if you don't want to converse with him. Instead of telling him to have a nice day when you don't mean it. Which is kind of passive-aggressive behavior. Or behaviour for our Northern friends.


You're right, that is what I should have done. I tend to lean towards the opposite of passive aggressive behavior, that was just my best shot at saying "I'm done."

What I saw this turn into was somebody getting upset, and I wanted to separate from it as gracefully as possible because nothing good comes from anything at that point. Nobody learns everything and people end up even more upset.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: Mykl


...and you just keep pressing....


Pressing? On the contrary. I'm explaining why I think your reply to me stating you were "done" was absurd. I'm not pressing anything, simply explaining.

Quote:
There's been a miscommunication here, because I have said nothing with the intent to offend. If my words have offended you, I am sorry, as again... not my intent.


I clearly identified the part of your post I took as offensive. It would have been very easy for you to simply state that how that came across was not what you had intended. But you didn't do that. And now we've had a number of back-and-forth "I'm not replying to you" whilst continuing to reply to me posts.

Quote:
You can keep typing up wordy posts if you want but I'm done with this.


Wordy? I guess that depends on your perspective. I've written some posts many would call novels on here, in comparison these posts are quite short.

 

[Mykl]

Whatever man.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: Mykl
Whatever man.


Still replying, LOL!!

 

[Trajan]

Originally Posted By: Mykl


So would you say that you seek out American made products even if it means paying considerably more for that product? If you could buy five Chinese widgets for every single American widget why wouldn't you go Chinese? Your purchasing power just went up.... and you're unhappy about that?



If the American widget lasts as long as the five Chinese widgets, yes I would.

I'm going to let you in on a little secret. I used to work for a company that makes dialysis trays. They started using catheters made in China.

Which was fine, except for one little problem. None of them met the specs. They *all* failed.

So did they reject them? No, of course not. They rewrote the specs so the catheters would pass.

So do you really want those things inserted into you?