Holy Smokes.....Iron levels with GC

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no molly?

33ppm over 7000 is nothing to worry about. add 4.1% to the miles.
 
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His lead went up too. It shows 2 runs on GC and the 1st has lower Iron and Lead. Something is going wrong with that engine but I don't think it's caused by the oil.

Imo something iron is coming apart and went through the bearings.
 
UOAs do not provide much accurate info on how well an oil performs on protecting against wear.
 
I think part of the problem with one of the UOAs was the low miles on the engine. These are tough engines. I have one customer with the 4.0 Taco that after break-in has been running 10K intervals with very good UOAs. I'll not mention the oil he runs but I will say these motors are not as "hard" on oil as some would say they are. They run better UOAs(in my opinion) with 20wt oils. Moly dosed oils have done well in the UOAs of the 4.0 engines I have seen. Pick one and give it a try.
 
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UOAs do not provide much accurate info on how well an oil performs on protecting against wear.


Even if they did, choosing 1 bad one out of a sea of great ones in order to make an evaluation is just bad reasoning.
 
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UOA is for determining the proper OCI, oil contaminates and if a mechanical issue exists in the engine. A UOA can not tell you if one oil lubricates better in your engine than another. You need to run the oil test sequence like the A3/B4 or car mfg.'s oil test sequence to determine the oils actual lubricating properties.

What a UOA can and can not tell you
 
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Originally Posted By: Jorge
UOA is for determining the proper OCI, oil contaminates and if a mechanical issue exists in the engine. A UOA can not tell you if one oil lubricates better in your engine than another. You need to run the oil test sequence like the A3/B4 or car mfg.'s oil test sequence to determine the oils actual lubricating properties.

What a UOA can and can not tell you


Being rather dumb or perhaps still ignorant about correct interpretation of UOAs, I'm still puzzled by this explanation (I read Doug's write-up, and I'll admit it doesn't make a lot of sense to me).

I'm almost certainly missing something here, so I'd appreciate it if Doug or some knowledgeable person could help me understand this.

My thinking is that a series of, say 4 UOAs of a specific oil in a specific engine over distance, let's say a UOA done every 2500 miles until 10K mile....may indicate that the oil is all used-up at between 7500 miles and 10000 miles, because the FE or aluminum levels started climbing rapidly, and perhaps low TBN, etc, etc.

Another, different oil, when run the same series of UAOs on the same motor under the same general conditions, may indicate no sudden climb in metals between 7500 miles and 10000 miles and may still have sufficient additive and low TAN, etc, etc.

Why would/could one not then deduce that oil B may be a better oil than oil A for that engine, under those conditions?

In my view, if the series of UOAs for each oil indicates a progressive decline over the distance, and provided the UOA results are not out of bounds between consecutive UOA test of that same oil, once could assume the UAO results are valid...and the natural conclusion reached.

Is this assumption totally invalid? If so...why? I have a TINY grasp of probabilities and margin for error, etc...but repeatable results always makes me feel that the test should be reasonably valid.

Thoughts?
 
I disagree when I see super-consistent UOAs w/ the exact results time after time.

That is one condition for proving a scientific principle, repeatability.


It weird too, to see an oil completely bomb in a UOA when it speced for an application, like Mobil 1 5w30 in my buddy's 'vette. A little UOA research showed that 15w40 quenched wear in the same application.

I say those two phenomenon suggest "readability" of UOAs.

I'd have to put forward all the lab work done in the UOA industry as meaningful.
 
AJ some light reading:

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/cms/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=69:used-oil-analysis-uoas-and-the-results&catid=40:articles-of-the-month&Itemid=71
 
Originally Posted By: BigJohn
Have you guys seen this one?

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubb...;gonew=1#UNREAD

I also believe there is another 4-Runner UOA that pukes out Fe as well.

Why?????

I have a 4-runner and a VW Passat.....and was considering a run of GC with my T4R. Not any more.......


I'm no UOA wizard as so many here claim to be, but the iron in the UOA you showed is not anything like "puking out iron". Several PPM like this example is nothing. GC is a fine oil.
 
Originally Posted By: The Critic
UOAs do not provide much accurate info on how well an oil performs on protecting against wear.


+1. I agree fully.
 
I hardly call that a technical essay.

and...

"In my case correctly interpreted UOAs have saved the odd engine from major problems and have proven that certain viscosities work better than others in some specific engine families. UOAs certainly optimized the service life of the lubricants in a cost effective way for many of my customers"

Like I said, when an engine throws out the same wear number down to single ppm for 4 or 5 consecutive UOAs, yeah, I tend to think they are "accurate".
 
Originally Posted By: Audi Junkie
Like I said, when an engine throws out the same wear number down to single ppm for 4 or 5 consecutive UOAs, yeah, I tend to think they are "accurate".


...or maybe they are just equally blind.
 
Whatever that is.
smirk2.gif




http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/accurate


ac·cu·rate (āk'yər-ĭt)
adj.

1.

Conforming exactly to fact; errorless.
2.

Deviating only slightly or within acceptable limits from a standard.
3.

Capable of providing a correct reading or measurement: an accurate scale.
4.

Acting or performing with care and precision; meticulous: an accurate proofreader.
 
smirk2.gif
indeed...

blind (blnd)
adj. blind·er, blind·est
1.
b. Having a maximal visual acuity of the better eye, after correction by refractive lenses, of one-tenth normal vision or less (20/200 or less on the Snellen test).

7.
a. Difficult to comprehend or see; illegible.
c. Hidden from sight: a blind seam.

adv.
1
a. Without seeing; blindly.

Now to put it in context for you, since the multitude of posts already made on the subject haven't seem to gotten through to you.

Size_Wear.jpg


Size_ppm.jpg
 
Uhh, it's "accurate", even if you have a correction factor.

Originally Posted By: Ben99GT
haven't seem to gotten through to you


No need to worry if it's "gotten through to me", that's really not your department.
 
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