I find that one diagnostic procedure is to unplug the MAF, and then run the engine. If the engine runs better while using programming reserved for emergencies, then you know for sure that your MAF is no longer accurate.
Higher RPM (4000+) detonation?
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Plug in an OBD2 scanner. If the CEL light flashed, there should be a "pending" code logged which you can retrieve.
Originally Posted By: another Todd
Plug in an OBD2 scanner. If the CEL light flashed, there should be a "pending" code logged which you can retrieve.
Yea, I think my Innova 3100 can get pending codes, but I haven't used the thing in a while and when I got it out tonight the batteries were dead. Will see if it can pull anything tomorrow.
It is definitely not the MAF, and definitely not the plugs, I am suspecting the coil at this point.
Thoroughly cleaned the original MAF as I could see dirt on the wires. I got it spotlessly clean with MAF spray. I went ahead and put Motorcraft plugs in since they are easy on this truck. The Denso plugs actually looked okay. Gap had widened a bit, but not enough to cause this. All 6 looked like the engine had been running a little lean. I took it for a highway run, and while it was smoother with the new plugs, I got the detonation again. Went back home, put the original MAF in, and took it for another test drive. Again, it was even smoother, truly running like it did a decade ago below 4300 RPM or so, but above that, instant detonation and a moment later flashing CEL.
Note: the truck never flashed the CEL before this week. The first time was on Wednesday. Second time today. Detonation has only been going on for a month, maybe two at the most.
After it first flashed the CEL on Wednesday, I ran the Cataclean through it. Got the EXACT same symptoms with the original MAF and new Motorcraft spark plugs today. Something is going amiss with the ignition around 4300 RPM+, and it's affecting all cylinders judging from how the plugs looked. At this point I am really suspecting the coil (it is original), though maybe the cam position sensor is acting up? I'll see if the code reader can point me in some direction tomorrow.
Another reason I kind of suspect the coil...I washed the engine roughly around the time this started occurring because it was covered in dirt and mud. I didn't cover the coil. I have done this many times before, but the coil is 11 years old and maybe water got in somewhere it shouldn't have.
As for coils, what are good aftermarket brands, or should I stick to OE (if that's what's wrong)? Can get Denso, Delphi, and many others as well. Is the Accel Super EDIS coil a waste of money?
Plug in an OBD2 scanner. If the CEL light flashed, there should be a "pending" code logged which you can retrieve.
Yea, I think my Innova 3100 can get pending codes, but I haven't used the thing in a while and when I got it out tonight the batteries were dead. Will see if it can pull anything tomorrow.
It is definitely not the MAF, and definitely not the plugs, I am suspecting the coil at this point.
Thoroughly cleaned the original MAF as I could see dirt on the wires. I got it spotlessly clean with MAF spray. I went ahead and put Motorcraft plugs in since they are easy on this truck. The Denso plugs actually looked okay. Gap had widened a bit, but not enough to cause this. All 6 looked like the engine had been running a little lean. I took it for a highway run, and while it was smoother with the new plugs, I got the detonation again. Went back home, put the original MAF in, and took it for another test drive. Again, it was even smoother, truly running like it did a decade ago below 4300 RPM or so, but above that, instant detonation and a moment later flashing CEL.
Note: the truck never flashed the CEL before this week. The first time was on Wednesday. Second time today. Detonation has only been going on for a month, maybe two at the most.
After it first flashed the CEL on Wednesday, I ran the Cataclean through it. Got the EXACT same symptoms with the original MAF and new Motorcraft spark plugs today. Something is going amiss with the ignition around 4300 RPM+, and it's affecting all cylinders judging from how the plugs looked. At this point I am really suspecting the coil (it is original), though maybe the cam position sensor is acting up? I'll see if the code reader can point me in some direction tomorrow.
Another reason I kind of suspect the coil...I washed the engine roughly around the time this started occurring because it was covered in dirt and mud. I didn't cover the coil. I have done this many times before, but the coil is 11 years old and maybe water got in somewhere it shouldn't have.
As for coils, what are good aftermarket brands, or should I stick to OE (if that's what's wrong)? Can get Denso, Delphi, and many others as well. Is the Accel Super EDIS coil a waste of money?
These engines are very picky about plugs. Suggestions should be only autolite double platinum or oem from my experience. Mine didn't like any bosch plug no matter if it was platinum or iridium.
Try using the old coil wire just to see if it improves, a coil wire breaking down will effect all cylinders.
You need scan tool data or its could become a parts changing fiasco.
If the coil is bad go with OEM, Standard red box or BWD (same as Standard red) from AA and use a coupon or another top brand, don't bother with high performance coils they bring nothing in stock applications.
You need scan tool data or its could become a parts changing fiasco.
If the coil is bad go with OEM, Standard red box or BWD (same as Standard red) from AA and use a coupon or another top brand, don't bother with high performance coils they bring nothing in stock applications.
Originally Posted By: Trav
Try using the old coil wire just to see if it improves, a coil wire breaking down will effect all cylinders.
You need scan tool data or its could become a parts changing fiasco.
If the coil is bad go with OEM, Standard red box or BWD (same as Standard red) from AA and use a coupon or another top brand, don't bother with high performance coils they bring nothing in stock applications.
Coil wire on a Vulcan? It should be a coil pack with 3 coils, each firing 2 cylinders.
Try using the old coil wire just to see if it improves, a coil wire breaking down will effect all cylinders.
You need scan tool data or its could become a parts changing fiasco.
If the coil is bad go with OEM, Standard red box or BWD (same as Standard red) from AA and use a coupon or another top brand, don't bother with high performance coils they bring nothing in stock applications.
Coil wire on a Vulcan? It should be a coil pack with 3 coils, each firing 2 cylinders.
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The coil breaking up would cause misfires, NOT detonation IMHO. What does this engine use for timing a cam sensor or crank sensor (not super familiar with the Vulcan) ?
You really should hook it up to a scan tool.
You really should hook it up to a scan tool.
Originally Posted By: The_Eric
Originally Posted By: Trav
Try using the old coil wire just to see if it improves, a coil wire breaking down will effect all cylinders.
You need scan tool data or its could become a parts changing fiasco.
If the coil is bad go with OEM, Standard red box or BWD (same as Standard red) from AA and use a coupon or another top brand, don't bother with high performance coils they bring nothing in stock applications.
Coil wire on a Vulcan? It should be a coil pack with 3 coils, each firing 2 cylinders.
No idea i haven't worked on a Ford in many years (except my own Expedition).
If thats the case there is no point in changing the coil wire is there.
Originally Posted By: Trav
Try using the old coil wire just to see if it improves, a coil wire breaking down will effect all cylinders.
You need scan tool data or its could become a parts changing fiasco.
If the coil is bad go with OEM, Standard red box or BWD (same as Standard red) from AA and use a coupon or another top brand, don't bother with high performance coils they bring nothing in stock applications.
Coil wire on a Vulcan? It should be a coil pack with 3 coils, each firing 2 cylinders.
No idea i haven't worked on a Ford in many years (except my own Expedition).
If thats the case there is no point in changing the coil wire is there.
This is EDIS, no coil, no distributor. Just a coil pack.
Instead of a distributor, there is a "cam synchronizer" (also goes by crank angle sensor and various other names Ford gave it to confuse people). The cam position sensor sits on top of that and I suppose tells the coil what to do.
Unfortunately my Innova 3100 is totally dead. Wasn't batteries. The code reader at the parts store I work at won't pull pending codes. The one at the shop I work at will, so I will check it out Monday.
I wouldn't think a coil would make detonation either, but it would explain a misfire if that is what is causing the CEL to flash. Does seem electronic in nature though, not like carboned up heads.
Fuel type is not the issue, does the EXACT same thing on 87, 89, 93, E85, Cataclean, everything else I put in the tank.
Instead of a distributor, there is a "cam synchronizer" (also goes by crank angle sensor and various other names Ford gave it to confuse people). The cam position sensor sits on top of that and I suppose tells the coil what to do.
Unfortunately my Innova 3100 is totally dead. Wasn't batteries. The code reader at the parts store I work at won't pull pending codes. The one at the shop I work at will, so I will check it out Monday.
I wouldn't think a coil would make detonation either, but it would explain a misfire if that is what is causing the CEL to flash. Does seem electronic in nature though, not like carboned up heads.
Fuel type is not the issue, does the EXACT same thing on 87, 89, 93, E85, Cataclean, everything else I put in the tank.
Looking at a cam position sensor for it, it looks like something that either works or it doesn't. Looks like it's just a magnet. I havent taken the one that's on there off to look at condition, but seems like if it was bad the truck just wouldn't even start or would run bad all the time. Can cam position sensors fail gradually with only intermittent symptoms?
I am thinking now it may be the cam synchronizer developing some play that is only noticeable at higher RPM. It's a known weak point on these engines. The original one started chirping/squealing around 60K miles. The replacement one (Motorcraft) still doesn't make noise, but maybe there is play in it.
Four code readers on this truck in two days and not a [censored] one will give me a pending code, including a Mac Tools ET97 and an Actron CP9580 which is a $200+ reader. What inexpensive code readers do pending codes? I thought we had a nicer one at work, but I guess we were borrowing it.
For now I'm thinking the cam synchro is my primary suspect part. 3.0s go through cam syncros quicker than they do spark plugs, and this one has 80K+ miles on it. A slight wobble at high RPM would throw the ignition off. I am betting pretty soon I might start hearing the telltale chirping as it starts to smack the CPS. I WISH it was the coil because that would be nice and easy. The cam syncro is kind of a pain in the [censored] on this truck because it's up against the firewall. I have a gut feeling that's what's doing it, and it would make sense with the symptoms. I'm going to start shopping for new ones, since it will need one at some point in the next 20K miles regardless of whether it fixes the detonation or not.
Looking on Rock Auto, Standard Motor Products sells one for $50. I am curious about this one because in the pictures it looks like a higher quality part than the $30 Dorman (which is known to fail in as little as 10K miles). If the Standard Motor Product ones are comparable to the Motorcrafts in quality, I'd rather get that. I hate spending $100+ ($160 dealer price) on another Motorcraft one knowing it's probably going to be toast within 100K miles.
The cam synchronizer is the dumbest thing Ford ever did with the Vulcan. Something that runs the oil pump should ideally be a lifetime part, not something that needs replacing every 60K-100K miles. If an aftermarket company could develop a heavy duty one that would never need replacing again, I'd probably pay $300 for it.
For now I'm thinking the cam synchro is my primary suspect part. 3.0s go through cam syncros quicker than they do spark plugs, and this one has 80K+ miles on it. A slight wobble at high RPM would throw the ignition off. I am betting pretty soon I might start hearing the telltale chirping as it starts to smack the CPS. I WISH it was the coil because that would be nice and easy. The cam syncro is kind of a pain in the [censored] on this truck because it's up against the firewall. I have a gut feeling that's what's doing it, and it would make sense with the symptoms. I'm going to start shopping for new ones, since it will need one at some point in the next 20K miles regardless of whether it fixes the detonation or not.
Looking on Rock Auto, Standard Motor Products sells one for $50. I am curious about this one because in the pictures it looks like a higher quality part than the $30 Dorman (which is known to fail in as little as 10K miles). If the Standard Motor Product ones are comparable to the Motorcrafts in quality, I'd rather get that. I hate spending $100+ ($160 dealer price) on another Motorcraft one knowing it's probably going to be toast within 100K miles.
The cam synchronizer is the dumbest thing Ford ever did with the Vulcan. Something that runs the oil pump should ideally be a lifetime part, not something that needs replacing every 60K-100K miles. If an aftermarket company could develop a heavy duty one that would never need replacing again, I'd probably pay $300 for it.
It did end up being the coil! I found hairline cracks in multiple spots on the casing, and one was large enough to catch a fingernail. I put on a BWD coil pack that is made in the US and that seems to have cleared it up. No more flashing CEL, winds right up to 5500 RPM.
Pics of the old coil...
Good catch on that coil. I was either leaning (no pun intended) towards the plugs or maf, but luckily the coil was an easy fix.
1qt at 4000 miles isn't bad at all.
1qt at 4000 miles isn't bad at all.
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Originally Posted By: 01rangerxl
It did end up being the coil! I found hairline cracks in multiple spots on the casing, and one was large enough to catch a fingernail. I put on a BWD coil pack that is made in the US and that seems to have cleared it up. No more flashing CEL, winds right up to 5500 RPM.
So it would have been missing (HARD) then, not detonation
That's good to hear, as detonation can be pretty bloody hard on things!
It did end up being the coil! I found hairline cracks in multiple spots on the casing, and one was large enough to catch a fingernail. I put on a BWD coil pack that is made in the US and that seems to have cleared it up. No more flashing CEL, winds right up to 5500 RPM.
So it would have been missing (HARD) then, not detonation
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
So it would have been missing (HARD) then, not detonation
That's good to hear, as detonation can be pretty bloody hard on things!
+1
So it would have been missing (HARD) then, not detonation
+1
Unless it jumped to another wire/tower... then that could detonate pretty bad.
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Originally Posted By: 1kickbuttranger
Unless it jumped to another wire/tower... then that could detonate pretty bad.
True. But you would expect that to happen at all RPM, not just high RPM
Unless it jumped to another wire/tower... then that could detonate pretty bad.
True. But you would expect that to happen at all RPM, not just high RPM
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