Good quote about Reagan

[Dan4510]

When that fool Reagan said that the Soviet Union was a failed
experiment headed for the ash heap of history, I knew he was a
demagogue.
When that fool Reagan said that the Soviet Union was an evil
empire, I knew he was a dangerous kook.
When that fool Reagan said that we could end the Cold War by
escalating the arms race, I knew the odds favored nuclear
annihilation.
When the Soviet Union went broke, dissolved, and repudiated
its past, I knew it was all Gorbachev's genius, and that fool Reagan
had nothing to do with it.
Because if that fool Reagan was right all along...
...what kind of fool am I?
--Jules Feiffer

 

[Al]

Good one.

 

[Gary Allan]

When the genius Reagan sent our nation so far into debt to accomplish this adventure that would have happened sooner or later ..I cheered him on.

When that genius Reagan promoted the mass migration of the most lucritive jobs to Asian nations ..I cheered him on.

When that genius Reagan said "Don't worry about the manufacturing jobs leaving ...we'll have plenty of service oriented jobs to take their place - I cheered him on!!

Only because he made me feel good to be an American.

And when the party was over ..and Bush Sr. lost his election due to the inhereted side effects of the genius Reagan .... I said "Gosh ..it felt so good to be an American under Reagan .."

Just the flip side of the coin...

 

[labman]

Oh for the good old days when we had a president we could all respect, Jimmy Carter.

 

[1sttruck]

Reagan didn't walk around the walls of Berlin and Moscow blowing a trumpet, the walls thereby falling, although I wouldn't surprised to see such verse end up in the 'Book of Reagan', to be added in the Revised Conservative Bible after Revelations :^) Another way I've heard it described is that Reagan speeded up the collapse of the Soviet Union by a few years.

Although I haven't looked into the real impact, one remarkable incident that I do recall during the Reagan era was the TV movie "The Day After', which was released during a time of heightened rhetoric by the administration about increasing the arms race. A short while later there were peace demonstrations across the country, the sizes not seen since Vietnam. Also a short while later arms limitations were agreed upon.

****************************
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/library/report/1995/BMH.htm

Ronald Reagan And The Fall Of The Soviet Union: Plot Or Serendipity

"....While President Reagan's administration cannot take complete credit for this collapse, Gorbachev was re-assessing the Soviet system in large, prompted by those external pressures contributed by the "sixth policy." President Reagan added to the costs of Soviet foreign policies in the third world and their arms build-up at the very moment of greatest Soviet vulnerability..."

****************************
http://baltimorechronicle.com/061104GipperMyth.shtml

The Myth of the Gipper: Reagan Didn't End the Cold War

"If there's anyone to attribute the changes in the Soviet Union and Eastern Europe to, both the beneficial ones and those questionable, it is of course Mikhail Gorbachev and the activists he inspired."
****************************

 

[Dan4510]

quote:

---

Originally posted by 1sttruck:
Reagan didn't walk around the walls of Berlin and Moscow blowing a trumpet, the walls thereby falling, although I wouldn't surprised to see such verse end up in the 'Book of Reagan', to be added in the Revised Conservative Bible after Revelations :^) Another way I've heard it described is that Reagan speeded up the collapse of the Soviet Union by a few years.

Although I haven't looked into the real impact, one remarkable incident that I do recall during the Reagan era was the TV movie "The Day After', which was released during a time of heightened rhetoric by the administration about increasing the arms race. A short while later there were peace demonstrations across the country, the sizes not seen since Vietnam. Also a short while later arms limitations were agreed upon.

****************************
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/library/report/1995/BMH.htm

Ronald Reagan And The Fall Of The Soviet Union: Plot Or Serendipity

"....While President Reagan's administration cannot take complete credit for this collapse, Gorbachev was re-assessing the Soviet system in large, prompted by those external pressures contributed by the "sixth policy." President Reagan added to the costs of Soviet foreign policies in the third world and their arms build-up at the very moment of greatest Soviet vulnerability..."

****************************
http://baltimorechronicle.com/061104GipperMyth.shtml

The Myth of the Gipper: Reagan Didn't End the Cold War

"If there's anyone to attribute the changes in the Soviet Union and Eastern Europe to, both the beneficial ones and those questionable, it is of course Mikhail Gorbachev and the activists he inspired."
****************************

---

Blum sounds like a left wing zealot to me when you check out his bio. He also labels the USA as a rouge state. I would say he is a person who writes with litte or no bias...

Dan

 

[keith]

Reagan DID build up our defenses, and did challenge the USSR, while most prominent democrats said it would be a disaster. On that one issue, we know who was right and don't need Blum to reinterpret what we lived through.

Many years down the road, we will be talking about confronting global terror, mostly Islamist, and we will decide if it was right to crush it from its core, or to continue treating it "with sensitivity" and a problem for the UN to fix.

Keith.

 

[buster]

Reagan sped up the process. Communism can't compete with Capitalism so the USSR as I see it was doomed regardless.

 

[mnztr]

quote:

---

Many years down the road, we will be talking about confronting global terror, mostly Islamist, and we will decide if it was right to crush it from its core, or to continue treating it "with sensitivity" and a problem for the UN to fix.

---

If you can crush it, go ahead....what is your plan to do so???

 

[mnztr]

quote:

---

The Legacy of Clinton

---

Talk is cheap, those were great years. What is the big deal if you can't own a hand gun? How does that diminish your quality of life? (Unless you're an armed robber)

 

[Dan4510]

The Legacy of Clinton



We can't be so fixated on our desire to preserve the rights of ordinary Americans...



When we got organized as a country and we wrote a fairly radical Constitution with a radical Bill of Rights, giving a radical amount of individual freedom to Americans, it was assumed that the Americans who had that freedom would use it responsibly ... [Now] there's a lot of irresponsibility. And so a lot of people say there's too much freedom. When personal freedom's being abused, you have to move to limit it.



If the personal freedoms guaranteed by the Constitution inhibit the government's ability to govern the people, we should look to limit those guarantees.



You know the one thing that's wrong with this country? Everyone gets a chance to have their fair say.



There is no reason for anyone in this country- anyone except a police officer or military person- to buy, to own, to have, to use a handgun. The only way to control handgun use in this country is to prohibit the guns.



The purpose of government is to rein in the rights of the people.



I think the definition [of an impeachable offense] should include any criminal acts, plus a willful failure of the President to fulfill his duty to uphold and execute the laws of the United States. The third factor that I think constitutes an impeachable offense would be willful, reckless behavior in office, just totally incompetent conduct in the office and the disregard of the necessities that the office demands.



"If a President of the United States ever lied to the American people he should resign." - Bill Clinton running for US Representative in 1974



"It depends on what the meaning of the word is is. If the...if he...if is means is and never has been, that is not - that is one thing. If it means there is none, that was a completely true statement"

 

[Gary Allan]

quote:

---

The Legacy of Clinton

---

Reagan???

 

[needtoknow]

Couldn't resist posting this link on Reagan,

http://ads.newcity.com/RealMedia/ad...html/1092672969000@Top,Frame1,Frame2!Frame2?x

Good points Gary!

 

[Dan4510]

quote:

---

Originally posted by mnztr:

quote:

---

The Legacy of Clinton

---

Talk is cheap, those were great years. What is the big deal if you can't own a hand gun? How does that diminish your quality of life? (Unless you're an armed robber)

---

Your question demonstrates a profound lack of knowledge about the connection between an armed populace and the freedoms that Americans enjoy. I can suggest a reading list that will help you come up to speed on the subject. I would suggest simple, introductory texts for your purusal at this time. Once some fundamental knowledge is built I have a reading list of material that is a bit more complex that you will find informative.

That's not the question that should be asked, it should be asked, how does my having a handgun or any gun detract from the qualify of life of anyone if I do nothing wrong with it...? Actually, having guns in the hands of citizens adds quality of life.

In all states in the US that adopted a concealed carry law structure, crimes against persons have gone down.

There is a behavioral connection between the chance of getting your butt shot off and not committing a crime.

It seems the anti-gunners are afraid of citizens with guns. Seems like the anti-gunners have a problem, not the people with guns. Can you say hoplophobia?

In recent years Austrailia and England have stripped their serfs, uh, i mean citizens of gun rights and crimes of all sorts have gone up tremendously.

To the point, its the difference between being a serf or a citizen.

Dan

[ August 17, 2004, 01:24 AM: Message edited by: Dan4510 ]

 

[Al]

quote:

---

Originally posted by labman:
Oh for the good old days when we had a president we could all respect, Jimmy Carter.

---

I really can't say-we were too busy laughing at him. Amazing how he now has all of the answers and 30 years ago had none.

 

[mnztr]

quote:

---

Your question demonstrates a profound lack of knowledge about the connection between an armed populace and the freedoms that Americans enjoy. I can suggest a reading list that will help you come up to speed on the subject. I would suggest simple, introductory texts for your purusal at this time. Once some fundamental knowledge is built I have a reading list of material that is a bit more complex that you will find informative.

---

That connection has long become obsolete, many countries enjoy the same freedoms without an armed populace, and any civilian rebellion would be massacered if it were confronted by a professional military.

quote:

---

Actually, having guns in the hands of citizens adds quality of life.

---

Still waiting to hear how

quote:

---

There is a behavioral connection between the chance of getting your butt shot off and not committing a crime.

---

Yeah, the crooks tend to go in with guns blazing and be trigger happy 'cos the think it's very probable the victim is packing.

I know that Britain has had some problems with crime, but I'm not aware of any drastic changes in their gun laws. I'd love to see evidince linking the two, the rest of Western Europe has had very stringent gun laws yet there is much less crime then the USA...explain that. Also, account for all the thousands of Americans that get injured accidently by firearms each year? Pretty devestating having your son blow your daughters brains out.

 

[Dan4510]

quote:

---

Originally posted by mnztr:

quote:

---

Your question demonstrates a profound lack of knowledge about the connection between an armed populace and the freedoms that Americans enjoy. I can suggest a reading list that will help you come up to speed on the subject. I would suggest simple, introductory texts for your purusal at this time. Once some fundamental knowledge is built I have a reading list of material that is a bit more complex that you will find informative.

---

That connection has long become obsolete, many countries enjoy the same freedoms without an armed populace, and any civilian rebellion would be massacered if it were confronted by a professional military.

quote:

---

Actually, having guns in the hands of citizens adds quality of life.

---

Still waiting to hear how

quote:

---

There is a behavioral connection between the chance of getting your butt shot off and not committing a crime.

---

Yeah, the crooks tend to go in with guns blazing and be trigger happy 'cos the think it's very probable the victim is packing.

I know that Britain has had some problems with crime, but I'm not aware of any drastic changes in their gun laws. I'd love to see evidince linking the two, the rest of Western Europe has had very stringent gun laws yet there is much less crime then the USA...explain that. Also, account for all the thousands of Americans that get injured accidently by firearms each year? Pretty devestating having your son blow your daughters brains out.

---

What's the point, you have made up your mind and totally missed my offer to point you to information that would change your knee-jerk views into something other than a tired old Sarah Brady rant.

Dan

 

[1sttruck]

See below. Crime rates are increasing in England and in some cases are higher than in the US, but groups like the NRA typically neglect to also note that the homicide rate in the US was still six times higher than England's in 1996. Even the Economist noted a few years back that you were much likely to see a fight at a game or in bar in England than in the US, but the the very low rate of firearm use results in far fewer homicides and gun injuries than in the US.

In Australia some crimes in some regions are also higher, but again groups like the NRA don't like to acknowledge that the homicide rates are down, which is the primary reason that they passed the gun laws that they did.


http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/abstract/cjusew96.htm

Crime and Justice in the United States and in England and Wales, 1981-96

....Whether measured by surveys of crime victims or by police statistics, serious crime rates are not generally higher in the United States than England. (All references to England include Wales.) According to 1995 victim surveys -- which measure robbery, assault, burglary, and motor vehicle theft -- crime rates are all higher in England than the United States (figures 1-4 of the report beginning on page 1). According to latest (1996) police statistics -- which measure incidents reported to police of murder, rape, robbery, assault, burglary, and motor vehicle theft -- crime rates are higher in England for three crimes: assault, burglary, and motor vehicle theft (figures 5-10).

....Firearms are more often involved in violent crimes in the United States than in England. According to 1996 police statistics, firearms were used in 68% of U.S. murders but 7% of English murders, and 41% of U.S. robberies but 5% of English robberies.

....the U.S. murder rate as measured in police statistics was 8.7 times England's in 1981 but 5.7 times in 1996 (figure 5)

 

[Shannow]

quote:

---

Originally posted by 1sttruck:
In Australia some crimes in some regions are also higher, but again groups like the NRA don't like to acknowledge that the homicide rates are down, which is the primary reason that they passed the gun laws that they did.

---

1ststruck,
not quite true.

Firearm death rates are down, while murders are pretty level.

look at 1996, which was Port Arthur, with the single largest massacre anywhere (36 people).

When you see the "homicide" with firearms, which includes suicides, our gun laws have been a great success.

When you look at the number of homicides as a total, you see that my uncle who hanged himself in July, and workmate who gassed himself two weeks ago just chose different ways to do it.

Break and enters, where the homeowner is known to be home have skyrocketed, as the creeps know that I must have my firearms locked in a safe, with a triple point locking mechanism, the bolt and ammunition stored separately, in similarly locked containers.

 

[Shannow]

Please bear in mind that 1996 was when the new laws were enacted.