Fuel System Additives/Ping Elimination

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qdeezie

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So, my truck has developed a ping under load and I've pretty much done everything to ensure that it's nothing on the outside of the engine that I can immediately correct (timing set to 10 degrees, spark plug type, spark plug wire routing, etc.).

I did the Seafoam treatment on my truck twice and the smoke show both times would be very impressive for Halloween purposes, so this lets me know that there is carbon in the combustion chambers/piston tops that is creating the ping.

I really like Gumout Regane High Mileage and I've used it twice, but the ping is still there, so it’s time to go to something a bit more extreme on working on carbon.

I'm not going to use 93 octane gas because that is a band-aid fix and not a true fix. Also, a piston soak would fix it, but that’s not exactly something I want to do on a V8. If it was a 4cyl, I would soak it overnight and be done with it.

Can someone recommend a fuel system additive that will work on this carbon buildup? A few come to mind, but my sole focus here is ping elimination.

I've heard that a bad cat also creates ping, so I'm not ruling that out.

Here’s what immediately comes to mind to put in the tank:

-B-12 Chemtool
-MMO
-Lucas Deep Clean – Yea yea, I know, simmer down I’m just asking a question! The bottle says eliminate knocking and pinging, so that’s why I listed it here.
-Techron
-Redline SL-1
-Seafoam

Suggestions (fuel treatment or otherwise) are welcome.
 
The presence of smoke just means you burnt the seafoam. We don't know if it got carbon too.

You could try a water decarb on a hot motor. The price is right.

Are you sure it's not a cracked exhaust manifold?

I had techron cure a ping but only as long as it was in the tank. That was disappointing.
 
Originally Posted By: eljefino
The presence of smoke just means you burnt the seafoam. We don't know if it got carbon too.

You could try a water decarb on a hot motor. The price is right.

Are you sure it's not a cracked exhaust manifold?

I had techron cure a ping but only as long as it was in the tank. That was disappointing.


I'm not ruling out anything at this point, so it could very well be a cracked manifold. The truck runs relatively quiet to me, so that's why I didn't give that much of a thought. I've heard about the water decarb, but need more details on how to do that.
 
You may do some research on the crossfire issue these engines had. Their was actually a TSB out on it about 20 years ago. have you pulled the plugs?

The crossfire caused heavy plug wear and Pinging
 
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I have a 1987 f-150 with a 302 like yours and I have a slight ping when using 87 octane. I started running 89 octane and it went away.
 
Originally Posted By: eljefino
The presence of smoke just means you burnt the seafoam. We don't know if it got carbon too.

You could try a water decarb on a hot motor. The price is right.

Are you sure it's not a cracked exhaust manifold?

I had techron cure a ping but only as long as it was in the tank. That was disappointing.


That's what I'd try.
 
I replaced all gaskets on the engine with the exception of the head gaskets and rear main.

I've replace spark plugs - Running OE Motorcraft. Spark plug wires are relatively new and routed so that they don't touch each other where they cross. I bought up a bunch of wire holders to ensure this doesn't happen.

I've previously replaced the O2 sensor, but I have bought defective new parts previously. I'll hook up my scan tool to check it.

Since my tank is on E, I'll put about $10 worth of 89 in it to see what it does. I have no problem with running higher octanes, but my thought is if the engine is designed for 87, that's what I want to run........but times change, things change and 1990 fuel and 2011 fuel are totally different (as is motor oil and other fluids), so I have to take that into consideration even if I don't like it.

This ping issue is so, so annoying.....I've put a whole lot of work into this truck and it runs like a dream. When it's under load, it starts pinging. That's the only flaw with it.
 
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Originally Posted By: eljefino
The presence of smoke just means you burnt the seafoam. We don't know if it got carbon too.

You could try a water decarb on a hot motor. The price is right.

Are you sure it's not a cracked exhaust manifold?

I had techron cure a ping but only as long as it was in the tank. That was disappointing.


That's what I'd try.


Can someone give me instructions on how to water decarb?
 
Back in the days of carbs you could dribble water into the carb with the engine running and this would clear up carbon from the heads and pistons.Problem was getting a small piece of carbon stuck under a valve sometimes.
 
Originally Posted By: qdeezie
What about Amsoil power foam?


Should work just as well from what I've read.
 
Originally Posted By: qdeezie
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Originally Posted By: eljefino
The presence of smoke just means you burnt the seafoam. We don't know if it got carbon too.

You could try a water decarb on a hot motor. The price is right.

Are you sure it's not a cracked exhaust manifold?

I had techron cure a ping but only as long as it was in the tank. That was disappointing.


That's what I'd try.


Can someone give me instructions on how to water decarb?


Warm up the engine until it reaches operating temp, about 20 minutes of driving time. Get very hot water and feed it slowly into the engine while its running via a vacuum line. I meter the water through a needle for filling footballs. Don't go crazy with the water, the last thing you want to do is hydro-lock an engine. Water doesn't compress and bad things happen if you fill a cylinder with water. Rev the engine up and down to about 3000 rpms or so as you add the water, try about a pint of water. Once done go for a drive and get on the car a little, then change your oil and filter.

You can also try Amsoil power foam using it for a piston soak, and some via a vacuum line. Be careful not to go crazy via a vacuum line, change the oil when your done.
 
I had ping under a light throttle in my Dakota. It's a common problem on some of the Mopar Magnum engines. About 5 years ago I fixed it, by using a different degree thermostat and a colder spark plug.

This past spring, I did tune-up on my truck and this time went with the factory heat range spark plug. I thought the ping might come back on a stock heat range plug, but so far I still have no ping at all, under any condition.

I have been adding MMO to my gas at every fill-up for about 2 years now. I have also added it to my oil a few times, mostly during the cooler months. It doesn't really get "cold" here in Florida, but we do have a few days in January and February with the high temps around 45 or 50.

I have a theory, no I can't prove it so please don't ask for proof, but I have an idea that the constant use of MMO and an occasional dose of Red Line or Regane has cleaned the carbon from my pistons and the use MMO in my fuel on every tank has kept the pistons and cylinders clean so no carbon has re-formed, therefore I have no ping now on a stock plug. I bet I still would have no ping even if I went back to a stock thermostat too.

I have no way to prove my theory. I admit it. Some people here always demand scientific evidentiary proof whenever one of us posts that we got a good result from the use of MMO, otherwise the improvement or gains may as well not have happened at all. I have no proof other than the fact I have no ping and am using a stock heat NGK plug.

This may not help the OP. I realize that a 6 cylinder Dodge engine is very different from an 8 cylinder Ford, and it could have taken a year or a little longer for the MMO to clean my pistons and cylinders. I do not think an initial use of MMO will solve the OP's ping problem. Over time the use of MMO could help him but it seems to me from reading his post that he wants to find a cure now.

I have no way to know how long it took for MMO to help with my carbon/ping problem. I do believe MMO is the reason I have no ping now though. My truck has almost 147K on it now. It runs great, no ping at all and has a nice smooth even idle. I attribute that to my own regular and often ahead-of-schedule maintenance and the use of MMO in every tank.
 
Originally Posted By: Jimmy9190
I had ping under a light throttle in my Dakota. It's a common problem on some of the Mopar Magnum engines. About 5 years ago I fixed it, by using a different degree thermostat and a colder spark plug.

This past spring, I did tune-up on my truck and this time went with the factory heat range spark plug. I thought the ping might come back on a stock heat range plug, but so far I still have no ping at all, under any condition.

I have been adding MMO to my gas at every fill-up for about 2 years now. I have also added it to my oil a few times, mostly during the cooler months. It doesn't really get "cold" here in Florida, but we do have a few days in January and February with the high temps around 45 or 50.

I have a theory, no I can't prove it so please don't ask for proof, but I have an idea that the constant use of MMO and an occasional dose of Red Line or Regane has cleaned the carbon from my pistons and the use MMO in my fuel on every tank has kept the pistons and cylinders clean so no carbon has re-formed, therefore I have no ping now on a stock plug. I bet I still would have no ping even if I went back to a stock thermostat too.

I have no way to prove my theory. I admit it. Some people here always demand scientific evidentiary proof whenever one of us posts that we got a good result from the use of MMO, otherwise the improvement or gains may as well not have happened at all. I have no proof other than the fact I have no ping and am using a stock heat NGK plug.

This may not help the OP. I realize that a 6 cylinder Dodge engine is very different from an 8 cylinder Ford, and it could have taken a year or a little longer for the MMO to clean my pistons and cylinders. I do not think an initial use of MMO will solve the OP's ping problem. Over time the use of MMO could help him but it seems to me from reading his post that he wants to find a cure now.

I have no way to know how long it took for MMO to help with my carbon/ping problem. I do believe MMO is the reason I have no ping now though. My truck has almost 147K on it now. It runs great, no ping at all and has a nice smooth even idle. I attribute that to my own regular and often ahead-of-schedule maintenance and the use of MMO in every tank.


How much MMO do you use per gallon? Or do you just use the 16 ounce bottle?

I found it. Per MMO's website:
How much Marvel Mystery Oil® (MMO) do I put in my gasoline tank?
Marvel recommends using 4oz of MMO for every 10 gallons of gasoline.
 
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I played around with the dose, tried different amounts and found out I get the best results with 4 ounces to 10 gallons of gas. I always fill up when I get to the 1/4 tank mark on my gas gauge, and it always takes between 14.5 to 15.5 gallons, so I add 6 ounces of MMO before I pump the gas into my tank. I think more than 4 ounces to 10 gallons is not good, it can be detrimental.

For some engines and driving styles, less can be more. I would say first run a tank with a good strong PEA-based cleaner like Red Line or Regane (Regane High Mileage has an even higher PEA concentration than regular Regane) then on your first MMO dose, add the corresponding amount of MMO for the entire tank for a dose of 4 ounces per 10 gallons. For example, if you have a 20 gallon tank, add 8 ounces of MMO on the initial dose. Then on subsequent tanks, dose at 4 ounces per 10 gallons for the amount of gallons it takes to fill up and see how it goes from there. I always add the MMO to the tank before I pump the gas, so it mixes together very well. I made a mark at the 6 ounce level on an empty Regane bottle, put 6 ounces of MMO in the bottle and bring it with me to the gas station. The Regane bottle makes it super easy to add MMO to my tank, no need for funnels or other containers. The trick with MMO is to use it consistently.
 
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