Fram Ultra Bad?

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I am very skeptical of the Cheep! Cheep! Fram Ultras as well as other parts on Ebay. It seems at best it's old stock that's been shuffled around alot or something from a salvaged lot. Or at worst it's a counterfeit. How can someone sell these so cheap on ebay? Walmart has very low profit margins and they are much more expensive there and they buy them by the truckloads....something doesn't add up to me. So you know those 6 filters probably cost st least 5.00 to ship, so 3 bucks for each filter, that does not add up.... I'd like to know Walmarts cost on those, using the commonly accepted generic Walmart profit margin, those fram ultras cost them more than 3 bucks....
 
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Originally Posted by Astro14
I think you should've titled the thread "eBay deal too good to be true?", or perhaps "Fake Fram from eBay?"
That was my first impression. I've seen fake spark plugs on eBay such that I won't buy any car parts off eBay from random sellers.
 
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Originally Posted by 762fermeandyou
Thank you all for the replies. Yeah I wont use it, but sending it to Fram is a good idea.
Why not just cut it open and see what's inside ... that will tell you if these are possibly counterfeit filters or not.
 
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15,579
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In the shop
Originally Posted by 762fermeandyou
Hi all, Before X-mas I bought a 6 pack of Fram Ultra XG8A from Ebay for my 4.0 Jeep ($24.00 shipped!). Seemed like a great deal. These are the 15,000 mile filters. Just opened 1 up to fill with oil and it rattled. I can shake it and something is loose in the bottom of the can. The others don't rattle. Later I will saw it open to check it out. Installed one with Havoline oil, no leaks or noise. Wonder if anyone has had this experience. The knowledge on this site is incredible. Thanks.
Send it to me, I'll chop it open for all BITOGERS to see
 
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california
I've had an ADBV failure on an XG-8A. Valvetrain started clattering on start up @ ~9700 miles into OCI, 95%highway miles with those accumulated in a short period of time. When I removed the filter, which sits @45 degrees, it was half full and no oil dripped out from above, as has done every oil change for the last 18.5 years with this engine. I replaced it with another XG-8A bought from Summitt for about the same price as wally world when tacked onto another part to exceed the free shipping threshold. I drove from California to Florida before Xmas, and on the way back ~6 weeks later, on a very cold start (17f) in Texas after resting 8 hours, clatter clatter clatter, same as before with failed ABDV. Next cold start(34f) in NM, after an 8+ hour rest the clattering did not last as long but was there. Cold start today at home (64f) after 16 hours rest, definite clattering. I'll be pulling this filter soon, and am done with Fram Ultra's xg-8a, although I just put an XG 7317 on my sister's 2005 CRV with some PP 5w-20 and she said it was buttery smooth and quiet afterwards. I hypothesize that hours and hours on end driving, I drove it 2550 miles in 3.5 days, causes the leaf spring to fatigue, and not allow the ADBV to seat properly with enough pressure anymore. I guess then it would be in partial bypass too then. Not good if true. What good is a 99% effieiency rating @ 20 microns on the media, if it is stuck in partial bypass after a few thousand miles? I have the first failed XG-8A on the shelf in its replacement's box. I let it drain for a week+, not sure if it rattles or not. I'll check, but I guess I'm going back to M1-301's for a few bucks more. Pretty sure the m1-301s that I opened previously, had coil springs, and I like the thread end bypass, in theory, better anyway. I'll open up the failed XG-8A soon and post pics, but I'm 100% positive the ADBV failed on the first one, and 65% sure it has failed / is failing on this second one too, and I'm not happy about it, and would not install another if Fram mailed me a case of them for free.
 
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Sight unseen no one can definitively say whether topic filter is authentic or not. Can say for a fact, because of pricing many members posting here buy Ultras from ebay sellers, generally in lots of 4-6. While there are many sellers a popular one of note iirc is 'sae'. Based on subsequent posted recommendations members appear satisfied with their purchase. Also as noted/linked, there has been at minimum two other similar 'element loose' anecdotes posted this subforum, 'neither' mentioned purchase from an ebay seller. Both were/are larger Ultra applications (one identical to topic), I'd speculate because element weight more susceptible flat compression spring being compromised at some point. Most seem to posit it's likely the result of some amount shaking, bumping or worst case dropping at some point. With ebay filters being packed and shipped, that's a possibility. All that considered, I think that the more reasonable and likely explanation to the filter being something other than authentic. For those reasons I believe the thread query is appropriately titled as is. Further I'd speculate that if another brand, title could/would have far more negatively sensationalized. I base that on observation of threads of other brands. As I'm currently running an XG7317 and in the past, any thought of negative bias towards the Ultra spin on would be inaccurate.
 
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Originally Posted by Sayjac
Sight unseen no one can definitively say whether topic filter is authentic or not. Can say for a fact, because of pricing many members posting here buy Ultras from ebay sellers, generally in lots of 4-6. While there are many sellers a popular one of note iirc is 'sae'. Based on subsequent posted recommendations members appear satisfied with their purchase. Also as noted/linked, there has been at minimum two other similar 'element loose' anecdotes posted this subforum, 'neither' mentioned purchase from an ebay seller. Both were/are larger Ultra applications (one identical to topic), I'd speculate because element weight more susceptible flat compression spring being compromised at some point. Most seem to posit it's likely the result of some amount shaking, bumping or worst case dropping at some point. With ebay filters being packed and shipped, that's a possibility. All that considered, I think that the more reasonable and likely explanation to the filter being something other than authentic. For those reasons I believe the thread query is appropriately titled as is. Further I'd speculate that if another brand, title could/would have far more negatively sensationalized. I base that on observation of threads of other brands. As I'm currently running an XG7317 and in the past, any thought of negative bias towards the Ultra spin on would be inaccurate.
I agree to all and apply to any branded oil filter bought anywhere in the world...
 
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Cincinnati, OH, USA
Originally Posted by Sayjac
Sight unseen no one can definitively say whether topic filter is authentic or not. Can say for a fact, because of pricing many members posting here buy Ultras from ebay sellers, generally in lots of 4-6. While there are many sellers a popular one of note iirc is 'sae'. Based on subsequent posted recommendations members appear satisfied with their purchase. Also as noted/linked, there has been at minimum two other similar 'element loose' anecdotes posted this subforum, 'neither' mentioned purchase from an ebay seller. Both were/are larger Ultra applications (one identical to topic), I'd speculate because element weight more susceptible flat compression spring being compromised at some point. Most seem to posit it's likely the result of some amount shaking, bumping or worst case dropping at some point. With ebay filters being packed and shipped, that's a possibility. All that considered, I think that the more reasonable and likely explanation to the filter being something other than authentic. For those reasons I believe the thread query is appropriately titled as is. Further I'd speculate that if another brand, title could/would have far more negatively sensationalized. I base that on observation of threads of other brands. As I'm currently running an XG7317 and in the past, any thought of negative bias towards the Ultra spin on would be inaccurate.
The Ultras do generally have laser etched date codes on the side, which (IMO) would be hard to duplicate on a counterfeit filter. I had a conversation with Jay Buckley/motorking when he was active here & working for Fram, and he said they would cover the eBay ones, as long as the filter was actually Fram made. As I mentioned above, the 6 filters are generally crammed into a flat-rate USPS box with little to no packing material-inevitably something bad happens to 1 or 2 of them in transit, I've always gotten credit or another filter(s) from them. Not Fram's fault, although the leaf spring is more susceptible to trouble than a coil one would be.
 
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Fram needs to put a stronger spring in for the Ultra and test it for drop/vibration damage. I think they use the same spring for all their filters and the EG and TG have much lighter elements. It makes a big difference under impact or vibration on the weight of the element. I bought two Ultras XG3980 for my GM because someone here advertised Amazon had two for around $4 awhile back. The date code is now printed not etched on these. Bottom of box is glued. In any case they don't rattle but I am a little leery of them now, bigger filter with bigger element should be more susceptible to spring damage. What about during use, heavy vibration etc? Definitely won't buy more.
 
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These filters are the 15k ones. Maybe Fram did fix the spring with later 20k versions. Never will know.They, like Purolator, aren't going to say there was a problem because they would have to recall the old filters, and face many lawsuits of owners trying to get new engines out of them right or wrong. It would cost millions, and they are making filters to get money not spend money.
 

762fermeandyou

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Originally Posted by Sayjac
Sight unseen no one can definitively say whether topic filter is authentic or not. Can say for a fact, because of pricing many members posting here buy Ultras from ebay sellers, generally in lots of 4-6. While there are many sellers a popular one of note iirc is 'sae'. Based on subsequent posted recommendations members appear satisfied with their purchase. Also as noted/linked, there has been at minimum two other similar 'element loose' anecdotes posted this subforum, 'neither' mentioned purchase from an ebay seller. Both were/are larger Ultra applications (one identical to topic), I'd speculate because element weight more susceptible flat compression spring being compromised at some point. Most seem to posit it's likely the result of some amount shaking, bumping or worst case dropping at some point. With ebay filters being packed and shipped, that's a possibility. All that considered, I think that the more reasonable and likely explanation to the filter being something other than authentic. For those reasons I believe the thread query is appropriately titled as is. Further I'd speculate that if another brand, title could/would have far more negatively sensationalized. I base that on observation of threads of other brands. As I'm currently running an XG7317 and in the past, any thought of negative bias towards the Ultra spin on would be inaccurate.
Yes these came from SAE, $22.97 plus tax for the 6 pack, 5 good ones. As mentioned by Triple Se7en, they must purchase huge surplus to sell and ship product as cheap as they do, and the quality may be hit or miss.
 

762fermeandyou

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Curiousity got the better of me and i hacksawed it open and the bottom spring assembly fell out. 2 dents more noticeable from inside can on outer edges are a definite. Filter media was a pinkish color, quite thick, stiff and glued nicely into the metal end caps bent and crimped. glue was a thick and brown and neat. 2A was stamped into inlet side. I didn't see any laser or inked date codes on the filter though. Label was a clear style stick on. I don't have the capability to take a pic. Authentic or not, definitely a beefy filter, I think it hit the deck from a distance on the grippy side.
 
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^^^Flat spring falling out wouldn't by itself necessarily indicate it compromised. Base/thread end down, the spring is going to fall out unless held in place by element. But if element loose in can, that's a logical conclusion. The dents could be a contributing/indicative factor for sure. As for laser etched date code, I can tell you the last two I purchased from Pepboys on sale with shipping included a couple/few years ago, I could barely find and read the code. I had to put it under a bright light source and the take a magnifying glass just to make it out. No way I could see it without doing all that. I think newer Ultras now have a visible code using black ink.
 
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Originally Posted by Farnsworth
These filters are the 15k ones. Maybe Fram did fix the spring with later 20k versions. Never will know.They, like Purolator, aren't going to say there was a problem because they would have to recall the old filters, and face many lawsuits of owners trying to get new engines out of them right or wrong. It would cost millions, and they are making filters to get money not spend money.
So how many loose internals have been reported here in the last 10 years? ... 2 or 3 including this one. I know two have been associated with a dented done end of the filter. Besides, if filters with torn media don't cause engines to blow up and cause claims, lawsuits and recalls, then a filter with loose internals surely isn't either. Also, when was there a time someone reported a filter with tight internals when new and it was installed, but then it had loose internals after normal use and removed from the engine (without crushing/damaging the can upon removal)?
 
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Watertown, New York
This is part of the reason I am leery of Fram Ultras. They have very good filter media, but some of the construction is a let down. The leaf spring in the Fram is thinner and flimsier than many others I have seen. I just posted a Wix and a Champion Labs made Amsoil filter that both had leaf springs, but they seem much sturdier than the style Fram uses. In my unscientific hands, they appeared to be thicker metal and seemed more of a spring steel that would not loose its tension. They were sturdy enough that i don't believe they would lose tension unless there was enough impact to cause major damage to the can. The Fram style leaf springs seem to be more of a jagged/crude stamping, and a slight over extension seems to flatten them right out. I prefer the coil spring overall, but understand some applications that isnt possible.
 
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Originally Posted by ZeeOSix
Originally Posted by Farnsworth
These filters are the 15k ones. Maybe Fram did fix the spring with later 20k versions. Never will know.They, like Purolator, aren't going to say there was a problem because they would have to recall the old filters, and face many lawsuits of owners trying to get new engines out of them right or wrong. It would cost millions, and they are making filters to get money not spend money.
So how many loose internals have been reported here in the last 10 years? ... 2 or 3 including this one. I know two have been associated with a dented done end of the filter. Besides, if filters with torn media don't cause engines to blow up and cause claims, lawsuits and recalls, then a filter with loose internals surely isn't either. Also, when was there a time someone reported a filter with tight internals when new and it was installed, but then it had loose internals after normal use and removed from the engine (without crushing/damaging the can upon removal)?
Once a company admits the problem the law firms and others looking for money will be on it. No admit it's all on you the little guy who isn't going to do anything. Done criticizing everything I write on here? Try to not cherry pick my words from context too. Two or three rattlers? There are more than that reported. I searched and found a other threads.
 
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I got a 6 pack also. These are old stock probobley 2-3+ years old that vendors get and resell. They do look like the original ultras.
 
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Originally Posted by Farnsworth
Originally Posted by ZeeOSix
Originally Posted by Farnsworth
These filters are the 15k ones. Maybe Fram did fix the spring with later 20k versions. Never will know.They, like Purolator, aren't going to say there was a problem because they would have to recall the old filters, and face many lawsuits of owners trying to get new engines out of them right or wrong. It would cost millions, and they are making filters to get money not spend money.
So how many loose internals have been reported here in the last 10 years? ... 2 or 3 including this one. I know two have been associated with a dented done end of the filter. Besides, if filters with torn media don't cause engines to blow up and cause claims, lawsuits and recalls, then a filter with loose internals surely isn't either. Also, when was there a time someone reported a filter with tight internals when new and it was installed, but then it had loose internals after normal use and removed from the engine (without crushing/damaging the can upon removal)?
Once a company admits the problem the law firms and others looking for money will be on it. No admit it's all on you the little guy who isn't going to do anything. Done criticizing everything I write on here? Try to not cherry pick my words from context too. Two or three rattlers? There are more than that reported. I searched and found a other threads.
I'm not taking anything out of context, simply replying to the comment in red. A filter with loose internals isn't going to blow-up engines like you think, lol. A filter that has torn media is more likely to damage an engine vs a filter with loose internals. Post up all the reported loose internals threads in the last 10 years. You claim there's way more, prove it - especially ones that showed no dent damage on the done end of the can. Also see if you can find any threads where a filter didn't rattle when new, but only rattled after normal use after removal without damaging the can. If you can't, then it's just blowing smoke that the leaf spring design is inadequate.
 
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