Former Allison Transmission Fluids Engineer

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Originally Posted By: Peted


This got me thinking..

I am at 50K miles and have not had my 6L80 serviced in my GMC.

Would I be able to use TranSynd instead of Dex VI ? Would this be a better option?

Thank you Mr. TranSynd for joining the forum. Your wisdom will be much appreciated.


I did not mean to start "Can TranSynd be used in everything"....I look at TranSynd as the Best fluid for an Allison & A Really good full synthetic Dexron III for older GM 3 & 4 speeds.
 
Originally Posted By: Peted
clinebarger said:
Welcome Tom!!!!

I already run TranSynd in my Allison & 4L60E with great results.
I do have one question, I have read on this site that Transynd does not meet Dexron IIIH spec's....Is this true?


This got me thinking..

I am at 50K miles and have not had my 6L80 serviced in my GMC. Would I be able to use TranSynd instead of Dex VI ? Would this be a better option?

Peted,
Yes. TranSynd is perfect for your GM 6L80 transmission and, in the long run, it will have better viscosity performance. DEXRON-VI viscosity is blended at around 6.2 cSt (centi-Stokes)as measured at 100C (212F) while TranSynd is blended at around 7.5 cSt at 100C (212F). DEXRON-VI will allow some amount of thinning over time; while TranSynd will remain more stable. TranSynd has better low temperature performance and slightly improved oxidation performance. So, you should get longer life from the TranSynd. I recommend fluid analysis once a year to ensure against any contamination that may happen. Though contamination is rare, it can be devastating to clutches if you get an internal cooling circuit leak.

PS: You could test your current fluid before doing anything to determine the current condition of the fluid and transmission.
Click to expand...
 
Originally Posted By: dnewton3
Mr Transynd,

Since you are no longer employed at Allison, are you bound by any confidentiality agreements?

I'd like to know just how many lube makers are OEM licensed for the TES-295. I realize many market them, but how many actually MAKE the fluids. After doing much research and hitting many dead ends, I could only verify just a few (Castrol/BP and Cognis/BASF). Are, or were, there others?

I presume you're in the Indy area; any chance you'd like to get together some day and talk shop?


Dnewton3,

This list of approved fluids is available on the Allison website. But, I think you're asking who (which oil company) makes each of the listed products. I do know the answer; but, unfortunately, I cannot divulge this type of information since I still act as a consultant to the oil and additive companies. I can assure you that there are multiple oil and additive companies involved in the various products (formulations). I just can't tell you which is which.

I would like to chat. So, send me an email at [email protected]. We can try to get together for coffee.
 
Originally Posted By: Peted
Originally Posted By: clinebarger
Welcome Tom!!!!

I already run TranSynd in my Allison & 4L60E with great results.
I do have one question, I have read on this site that Transynd does not meet Dexron IIIH spec's....Is this true?


This got me thinking..

I am at 50K miles and have not had my 6L80 serviced in my GMC.

Would I be able to use TranSynd instead of Dex VI ? Would this be a better option?

Thank you Mr. TranSynd for joining the forum. Your wisdom will be much appreciated.


Peted,

Please allow me to back off from my first answer to you. Let's hold off for a few more days on changing over to TranSynd in your 6L80 GM transmission. I got some input from a friend at GM and, though I believe it's not a problem, I'm waiting for some additional data from a frictional properties comparison using 6L80 clutch materials and TranSynd at the appropriate shift energy levels. Again, though my inkling is that there's no issues, let's wait for this final data to know for sure. I do want to be sure that the GM 6L80 is OK with TranSynd. Friction would be the only issue. Everything else (all other fluid properties), in my opinion, would not be at issue.

PS: In preparation, you could go ahead and get a test kit and pull a sample so we could evaluate the current condition of your DEXRON-VI. Let me know what you'd like to do.
 
Last edited:
Quote:
DEXRON-VI viscosity is blended at around 6.2 cSt (centi-Stokes)as measured at 100C (212F) while TranSynd is blended at around 7.5 cSt at 100C (212F). DEXRON-VI will allow some amount of thinning over time; while TranSynd will remain more stable. TranSynd has better low temperature performance and slightly improved oxidation performance.


I am going to have to take those delta-shear, viscosity, and oxidation claims with a grain of salt until I see some comparative testing results.
 
I just want to say that this thread with MR TRANSYND and
MolaKule takes most of us long time members back to the good old days when BITOG just started. Some superior discussion and data here. THANKS GUYS!

I wish we could have more threads just like this one.
 
Originally Posted By: MolaKule
Quote:
DEXRON-VI viscosity is blended at around 6.2 cSt (centi-Stokes)as measured at 100C (212F) while TranSynd is blended at around 7.5 cSt at 100C (212F). DEXRON-VI will allow some amount of thinning over time; while TranSynd will remain more stable. TranSynd has better low temperature performance and slightly improved oxidation performance.


I am going to have to take those delta-shear, viscosity, and oxidation claims with a grain of salt until I see some comparative testing results.


Ditto.

I fully agree that licensed TES-295 fluids are excellent products, but so are many of the clones, as well as "other" products such as DEX VI.

Until one tests them in the application as intended, you'll never know which is "best" (I hate that word at times ...) for the individual. Lab testing is great for comparitive purposes, but it also does not tell the entire story.

I want data!
grin.gif
 
Originally Posted By: antiqueshell
I just want to say that this thread with MR TRANSYND and
MolaKule takes most of us long time members back to the good old days when BITOG just started.


But you became a member in 2012?????
 
Welcome. You will be a great source of information for us with your experience.

What is your opinion of Valvoline Maxlife ATF? A favorite here; some stay away because it is not licensed even though it meets or exceeds.

Are all Dex VI ATFs the same? My opinion is no one ever regretted buying a brand name, but others say buy the cheapest, usually Supertech VI, because it is licensed.

What do you drive and how often do you change the trans fluid?

Thanks.
 
Originally Posted By: PhillyJoe
Welcome. You will be a great source of information for us with your experience. What is your opinion of Valvoline Maxlife ATF? A favorite here; some stay away because it is not licensed even though it meets or exceeds. Are all Dex VI ATFs the same? My opinion is no one ever regretted buying a brand name, but others say buy the cheapest, usually Supertech VI, because it is licensed.

Thanks.

PhillyJoe,

I'm really here to answer questions about TranSynd and TES-295 fluids based on experience. I can also offer some input on older DEXRON-III products since I was part of the DEXRON-III GM ATF Committee. I have no data on Valvoline MaxLife ATF. Typically, you need to use caution when something says "Meets or Exceeds". A license or approval number is a better indicator of whether or not the fluid passed the OEM specification. For instance, all valid TES-295 approved products carry an Allison approval number and all valid DEXRON-VI fluids carry a GM license number.
 
Originally Posted By: TrevorS
Originally Posted By: antiqueshell
I just want to say that this thread with MR TRANSYND and
MolaKule takes most of us long time members back to the good old days when BITOG just started.


But you became a member in 2012?????


TrevorS,
Frankly, I can't remember if I signed up for BITOG in 2012 or not. But, I've just now become active after speaking to the forum manager (Wayne).
 
Originally Posted By: TrevorS

But you became a member in 2012?????


I was here way back in 2002 and then simply forgot about the site after about 2005.
Forgot my old SN and password.

Lurked again from 2010 on, and then signed up again in 2012. LOL
50.gif
 
Originally Posted By: MR_TRANSYND
Originally Posted By: TrevorS
Originally Posted By: antiqueshell
I just want to say that this thread with MR TRANSYND and
MolaKule takes most of us long time members back to the good old days when BITOG just started.


But you became a member in 2012?????


TrevorS,
Frankly, I can't remember if I signed up for BITOG in 2012 or not. But, I've just now become active after speaking to the forum manager (Wayne).


Hi Tom

Thanks for the clarification but my question was for antiqueshell!

Best
 
Originally Posted By: antiqueshell
Originally Posted By: TrevorS

But you became a member in 2012?????


I was here way back in 2002 and then simply forgot about the site after about 2005.
Forgot my old SN and password.

Lurked again from 2010 on, and then signed up again in 2012. LOL
50.gif



So this was not the place to be from 2005 to 2012 then!

11.gif
 
Welcome Mr-Transynd. For quite some time on BITOG, there's been discussions about CAFE driving the product lines in the automotive lubrication world at the expense of equipment protection. Did you notice any of this going on in the ATF world?
 
Originally Posted By: INDYMAC
Welcome Mr-Transynd. For quite some time on BITOG, there's been discussions about CAFE driving the product lines in the automotive lubrication world at the expense of equipment protection. Did you notice any of this going on in the ATF world?


INDYMAC,
No doubt there's been an overall push, at the car companies, over the last several years to meet CAFE requirements. And, some effort went toward reducing viscous drag (lower viscosity). For instance, GM dropped ATF initial viscosity from approximately 7.5 cSt at 100C to approximately 6.2 cSt at 100C when they moved from the DEXRON-III specification to the DEXRON-VI specification. However, this did not mean that transmission performance or durability was in any way reduced or sacrificed. DEXRON-III fluids started off at higher viscosity to allow for shearing of the Viscosity Index Improver (VII) additives. DEXRON-VI fluids are formulated with lower initial viscosity but remain more stable over time. In essence, the VIIs are more shear stable. GM Transmission Engineering would not jeopardize their products to try to meet one area of customer satisfaction (fuel economy) by lowering another area of customer satisfaction (transmission durability and reliability). That just would not make sense. Instead, they did a ton of lab and road testing to ensure that the thinner fluid did not effect transmission performance and durability. It's just a case of finding the minimum effective viscosity. It's a trade off of fluid film thicknes vs. viscous drag.

Here's a link to a technical paper on oils that I wrote. You may find this interesting. It covers several things including VII shear: http://www.jglubricantservices.com/docs/Technical Information Sheet.pdf

Hope this helps !!
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: Peted
Originally Posted By: clinebarger
Welcome Tom!!!!

I already run TranSynd in my Allison & 4L60E with great results.
I do have one question, I have read on this site that Transynd does not meet Dexron IIIH spec's....Is this true?


This got me thinking..

I am at 50K miles and have not had my 6L80 serviced in my GMC.

Would I be able to use TranSynd instead of Dex VI ? Would this be a better option?

Thank you Mr. TranSynd for joining the forum. Your wisdom will be much appreciated.


Peted,

I've completed the frictional properties testing as promised and can now say for sure that TranSynd is technically equivalent to DEXRON-VI for use in the 6L80 transmission. So, go ahead and use it without reservation.

Hope this helps !!
 
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