Yes, same one.
Ford 10R80 - TSB - Help
- Thread starter Toro50cutter
- Start date
Thanks everyone. I will probably call and set an appointment in the near future. It’s incredibly frustrating but if Ford extends the warranty to 100,000… I could care less. By the time I get near that, I’m sure something would’ve gone bad and had some work done under warranty.
I miss the 6-speed. It never had anywhere close to these issues.
I miss the 6-speed. It never had anywhere close to these issues.
For sure. But the 10-speed does allow these powertrains to do some (what 10-20 years ago would be considered) amazing things.
They'll get it all sorted about the time that they outlaw ICE's.
This is true. Even with issues-I can't believe what a towing beast my 2020 F150 (3.5w/max towing) is when pulling my travel trailer up an 8,000 foot mountain pass.
Book mark this thread or start a new one and let us know!
What does the black box mean?
Reman transmission
Reman assembly. Sometimes new, depends on what is offered for that particular application.
Watching the few videos out there on YouTube now, there seem to be 3 modes of failure associated with the CDF drum.
- wandering bushing slides or twists out of place, which closes off fluid pathways and/or sends a ~2” o-ring out of place.
- rotational bushing wear resulting in play in the assembly
- oil seal(s) can distort and come off of the inner assembly
Being that a fluid fix seems to have kept mine from getting worse, I’m wondering if the thin ULV working at high temps when under heavy loads is contributing to the bushing migration since the physical wear visible in one of the videos was pretty pronounced. This would be a solid call for finding a fluid with higher film strength or severe anti-wear additives. If the rotating assembly doesn’t scrape, maybe the pressed-in parts won’t shift and wander. I might consider doing another drain/fill this year - I’ll have an additional 40k on the fluid in mine since I did the first swap. Seems like it’s warranted. And while the Amsoil LV was too thick when I tried to swap in 6 quarts, the swap to back some of that out would have still left a partially thicker mix of oem ULV and amsoil LV, so if I drain/fill again, I’d be ok with a slight bit of amsoil LV in with the oem-spec ULV, say 2 quarts of LV with 4 quarts of ULV.
Again, I’m not seeing these problems show up from GM/Chevy owners. For that matter, I could attempt to use whatever the GM fluid is and see if it makes a difference.
GMs programming on this unit is very nice - it seems like ford tries to maintain more engine output mid-shift for more of a consistent, smooth, lux feel. GM on the other hand, defuels the engine notably until the shift completes, allowing it to hit the next gear before bringing power back in. It’s pretty quick and I didn’t find it obtrusive, though it’s a bit like comparing a softer camry to a notchy accord, back when they all had gears.
I’m thinking I’ll probably do the splash/fill this summer. I would not expect my dealer to “do the right thing,” unless the lawsuit paves a clear path to repairs if you’ve got it documented.
- wandering bushing slides or twists out of place, which closes off fluid pathways and/or sends a ~2” o-ring out of place.
- rotational bushing wear resulting in play in the assembly
- oil seal(s) can distort and come off of the inner assembly
Being that a fluid fix seems to have kept mine from getting worse, I’m wondering if the thin ULV working at high temps when under heavy loads is contributing to the bushing migration since the physical wear visible in one of the videos was pretty pronounced. This would be a solid call for finding a fluid with higher film strength or severe anti-wear additives. If the rotating assembly doesn’t scrape, maybe the pressed-in parts won’t shift and wander. I might consider doing another drain/fill this year - I’ll have an additional 40k on the fluid in mine since I did the first swap. Seems like it’s warranted. And while the Amsoil LV was too thick when I tried to swap in 6 quarts, the swap to back some of that out would have still left a partially thicker mix of oem ULV and amsoil LV, so if I drain/fill again, I’d be ok with a slight bit of amsoil LV in with the oem-spec ULV, say 2 quarts of LV with 4 quarts of ULV.
Again, I’m not seeing these problems show up from GM/Chevy owners. For that matter, I could attempt to use whatever the GM fluid is and see if it makes a difference.
GMs programming on this unit is very nice - it seems like ford tries to maintain more engine output mid-shift for more of a consistent, smooth, lux feel. GM on the other hand, defuels the engine notably until the shift completes, allowing it to hit the next gear before bringing power back in. It’s pretty quick and I didn’t find it obtrusive, though it’s a bit like comparing a softer camry to a notchy accord, back when they all had gears.
I’m thinking I’ll probably do the splash/fill this summer. I would not expect my dealer to “do the right thing,” unless the lawsuit paves a clear path to repairs if you’ve got it documented.
BrendanC
$100 site donor 2024
GM has done this extensively since the 6L series it feels weird getting used to it, but it seems to keep transmissions alive. now if they could design a TC that doesn’t suck.
4WD
$50 site donor 2024
10 speed in our Tahoe is smoother than the 8 speed in the Jeep
For some reason the specs are a bit higher than Ford too …
For some reason the specs are a bit higher than Ford too …
I thought they actually yanked a ton of timing and less so fuel?
I’m wondering if this tidbit is why HPL recommends to customers and uses the Green CC atf in their own 10R80s, even though they make the Teal which is the “correct” ultra-low viscosity according to Mercon ULV specs. The Green is definitely an LV fluid, but will have a higher film strength than the ULV.
I’m hoping for some decent weather this week so I can put my PPE deep pan on and swap all the fluid with Green CC.
BrendanC
$100 site donor 2024
So… my very first attempt was doing a drain-fill with amsoil signature series LV, a very good fluid. As noted, I was able to get more than the normal fluid amount out by idling it for 15-20 seconds or so allowing it to pump some air in and foam up the fluid, which drained an additional 1-2 quarts. (Transmission is under no load, and it’s plenty wet with fluid at this point).
The shift quality was diminished with the thicker fluid and the adaptives didnt figure it out or weren’t able to adjust to it. Doing another drain fill (traditional, no extra idling) it drives better on ULV (again, here is where I added 1-2 oz of LG red). I would not do a full change to an LV. If I do the approximate math, 1/4 of my current mix is LV, and the rest ULV - and it’s driving very well.
the feel was “blocky” enough with half LV fluid that I’d probably start moving to buy something else if that was the only solution.
Right, you said that before and I trust your experience, but there’s got to be some other variables going on. Just wondering, when (if ever) was your trans software updated? I took mine in May ‘22 for the occasional clunky downshift and of course the dealer claimed they couldn’t duplicate my issue, and would not do the update, even though I would have paid for it.
(Side note, it’s also the dealer that drained my 800-mile old Ravenol DXG and did an oil change I didn’t ask for; when I complained the service manager said he would “comp” the oil change since it was their fault. I later realized that JA had simply charged it to the points on my RewardsPass account. Karma did her job though; about 4 months later that dealer lost their Ford franchise, and went out of business last month.)
Back to the story… I’ll have to call Dave and see if their 10R80s are on the latest software, or if any of them have had the CDF drum replaced at any point. I’m wondering if your negative issues can be isolated to a single variable: is it that the fluid is “too thick”; is it a limitation of a certain software version (or age of software); could it be tied to a given CDF drum revision; or is it because there’s already some wear or misalignment in your CDF sleeve that is “helped” by the thinner fluid flowing thru the partially-misaligned sleeve? And I’m speaking in general 10R80 terms, not just yours. Like, if someone had a brand new 10R80 with the newest drum revision and newest software, would the thicker fluid be able to be adapted to?
The biggest problem IMO is that Ford still hasn’t figured this out, it’s such an expensive issue to fix if not under warranty, and it’s not really easy to verify if any of these intermediate steps actually “fixes” the issue. We’re all kinda just waiting for a failure to occur.
Our one work truck is a 2018 and while I never got to drive it, the crew said described all the stuff you mentioned above....and eventually at 55k miles it got too unsafe to drive because it would be in neutral trying to leave stop lights. It was at the dealership for about 3 months and they tried to rebuild it apparently and it didn't work, so then they waited a while for a new one. They are currently driving it but they said "it's a lot better but still clunks a lot".
My 2005 4.8 4L60E even does this. It's annoying but whatever it takes to keep it from dying I guess.
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