Cavaliers are great cars if you want low cost motoring. I like how they drive, they have decent room inside, the seats and ride are comfy. Decent power - not going to win any races but enough for everyday driving. Purchase price is low, they rarely break but when they do parts are plentiful and cheap, plus repairs are simple. They were always tops on my list when picking up a beater.
Cost of owning a clunker?
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Rust and pot holes tend to eat vehicles alive here. Most clunkers have more body and suspension problems than engine problems.
While I understand some people want to get from A to B as cheaply as possible, I happily spend the money to have my wife and kids in a safe, reliable, up to date vehicle.
Originally Posted By: hpb
While I understand some people want to get from A to B as cheaply as possible, I happily spend the money to have my wife and kids in a safe, reliable, up to date vehicle.
Buy something that's had the same chassis and/ or powertrain "forever" for better luck, though I guess you get crash test improvements with newer body designs.
I've got a 2001 saturn SL for a clunker now-- the 10th year of its body and engine, and most bugs worked out. Parts have gone from dealer-only to, well, aftermarket only.
But they're plentiful, cheap, and problems are predictable and able to be fixed right the first time, an aggravation that sometimes flares up on brand new untested stuff.
While I understand some people want to get from A to B as cheaply as possible, I happily spend the money to have my wife and kids in a safe, reliable, up to date vehicle.
Buy something that's had the same chassis and/ or powertrain "forever" for better luck, though I guess you get crash test improvements with newer body designs.
I've got a 2001 saturn SL for a clunker now-- the 10th year of its body and engine, and most bugs worked out. Parts have gone from dealer-only to, well, aftermarket only.
Originally Posted By: jeepman3071
Rust and pot holes tend to eat vehicles alive here. Most clunkers have more body and suspension problems than engine problems.
You guys need to come down here to buy a decent used car. I grew up in northern W.Va. and a lot of cars were almost junkyard ready by 5 years old. Down here, my cars have no rust whatsoever. I almost forgot (but not quite) how big of a PITA working on a rust bucket is.
Rust and pot holes tend to eat vehicles alive here. Most clunkers have more body and suspension problems than engine problems.
You guys need to come down here to buy a decent used car. I grew up in northern W.Va. and a lot of cars were almost junkyard ready by 5 years old. Down here, my cars have no rust whatsoever. I almost forgot (but not quite) how big of a PITA working on a rust bucket is.
The only vehicle I bought new recently has been my truck. There is a lot of depreciation in the first 3 years, depending on the model. I recently bought my Mustang GT Premium w/track pack for 15K with 43,000 miles. I know the previous owner, so I know it wasn't abused. It just needed a trip to the body shop to take out 4 ding/dents and I had the wheels painted gloss black. This car was 35K new. I don't see any reason why this car couldn't make it 200+K miles with few issues. OP I had several Cavaliers over the years, and they all were very reliable and got good mileage to boot. I've seen some with ridiculous miles (over 300K).
Originally Posted By: DeafBrad
Originally Posted By: Oldmoparguy1
I've used $600/year as a rule of thumb. For that, I'll drive it till it's not repairable or safe to drive. In todays money, it's more like $1000/year. I've sent several cars/trucks to the JY using that cost basis.
I am assuming you are referring to purchase price... ie- $3000 purchase price = drive for 5 years. Or do you mean $600/yr for repairs. Over that, time to junk it.
$600/year is all up costs, tax, license, insurance, tires, repairs. Everything except gas and oil. I have bought cars that were given up for dead intending to use it for parts, then found it to be in better condition then the one I was trying to fix. I have 3 cars/minivans sitting out in back that need to be retitled,all good vehicles that may end up in the JY because time and I have moved on. (that includes 3 good engines with transmissions sitting in storage.) Over all, I'm way ahead $$ wise as well as experience wise. I know a whole lot about Chrysler products from the 70's, 80's and 90's. The thing is, I'm getting older, the newer cars are much better built and there is very little need to be the all purpose fixer that I have become.
YMMV
Originally Posted By: Oldmoparguy1
I've used $600/year as a rule of thumb. For that, I'll drive it till it's not repairable or safe to drive. In todays money, it's more like $1000/year. I've sent several cars/trucks to the JY using that cost basis.
I am assuming you are referring to purchase price... ie- $3000 purchase price = drive for 5 years. Or do you mean $600/yr for repairs. Over that, time to junk it.
$600/year is all up costs, tax, license, insurance, tires, repairs. Everything except gas and oil. I have bought cars that were given up for dead intending to use it for parts, then found it to be in better condition then the one I was trying to fix. I have 3 cars/minivans sitting out in back that need to be retitled,all good vehicles that may end up in the JY because time and I have moved on. (that includes 3 good engines with transmissions sitting in storage.) Over all, I'm way ahead $$ wise as well as experience wise. I know a whole lot about Chrysler products from the 70's, 80's and 90's. The thing is, I'm getting older, the newer cars are much better built and there is very little need to be the all purpose fixer that I have become.
YMMV
Many years ago, I attempted to subscribe to the theory of low COO on an older car, and while it was indeed cheaper financially, it cost a lot in aggravation when one thing after another started going wrong. Water pump, dash lights, speedo cable, clutch, brake cylinders, wheel bearings, tie rods, master cylinder, alternator, valve lifters, ...this is just what I can remember having to replace. I found myself sitting aside the road, or sitting in repair shop waiting rooms far too often and it became clear that the cost of a new car was worth it. Dirt cheap to pay for and insure, but a pain to live with. I can't imagine trying to maintain a newer car past its prime when major computer components start going bad. $$$$
One invaluable option for a beater car is AAA. My wife had a 1987 Mazda pickup when we were first married. One year I came home on the rollback three times 
Having someone to call 24/7 when you are stuck beside the road is great for any car, but, especially for a beater.
Having someone to call 24/7 when you are stuck beside the road is great for any car, but, especially for a beater.Originally Posted By: WylieCoyote
Many years ago, I attempted to subscribe to the theory of low COO on an older car, and while it was indeed cheaper financially, it cost a lot in aggravation when one thing after another started going wrong. Water pump, dash lights, speedo cable, clutch, brake cylinders, wheel bearings, tie rods, master cylinder, alternator, valve lifters, ...this is just what I can remember having to replace. I found myself sitting aside the road, or sitting in repair shop waiting rooms far too often and it became clear that the cost of a new car was worth it. Dirt cheap to pay for and insure, but a pain to live with. I can't imagine trying to maintain a newer car past its prime when major computer components start going bad. $$$$
What you say is very true. But all cars are not equal; some cars are much better than others. I usually use Consumer Reports to find out the average reliability of a vehicle before I buy. For the most it isn't just luck when you get a trouble free vehicle. Some manufacturers use very high quality parts, and the results are going 200k-300k miles with the original starter, alternator, water pump, and etc.
The car in my signature (Echo) is exceptionally reliable, and even at it's miles I trust it. I believe that other Echo owners have the same experience. So far, I have had a dirty maf sensor, and one of the coils go bad. The maf sensor just needed a cleaning, and I got a replacement coil from Ebay for less than $20. The car has a bad relay for the AC, but I have never bothered to replace it. I expect it will be good for another 100k or more.
Many years ago, I attempted to subscribe to the theory of low COO on an older car, and while it was indeed cheaper financially, it cost a lot in aggravation when one thing after another started going wrong. Water pump, dash lights, speedo cable, clutch, brake cylinders, wheel bearings, tie rods, master cylinder, alternator, valve lifters, ...this is just what I can remember having to replace. I found myself sitting aside the road, or sitting in repair shop waiting rooms far too often and it became clear that the cost of a new car was worth it. Dirt cheap to pay for and insure, but a pain to live with. I can't imagine trying to maintain a newer car past its prime when major computer components start going bad. $$$$
What you say is very true. But all cars are not equal; some cars are much better than others. I usually use Consumer Reports to find out the average reliability of a vehicle before I buy. For the most it isn't just luck when you get a trouble free vehicle. Some manufacturers use very high quality parts, and the results are going 200k-300k miles with the original starter, alternator, water pump, and etc.
The car in my signature (Echo) is exceptionally reliable, and even at it's miles I trust it. I believe that other Echo owners have the same experience. So far, I have had a dirty maf sensor, and one of the coils go bad. The maf sensor just needed a cleaning, and I got a replacement coil from Ebay for less than $20. The car has a bad relay for the AC, but I have never bothered to replace it. I expect it will be good for another 100k or more.
Cost/mile is probably a more useful metric. Looks like you are at $0.042/mile not counting fuel or maintenence. Looks like this is simply purchase and repairs.
My 2003 Protege5 is running at about $0.115/mile, but that includes purchase, maintenance, repairs and fuel. I've averaged just under 22k miles/year and have owned this car for 63 months or so.
My 2003 Protege5 is running at about $0.115/mile, but that includes purchase, maintenance, repairs and fuel. I've averaged just under 22k miles/year and have owned this car for 63 months or so.
Originally Posted By: Kawiguy454
Face it ...New cars are more for ego and image than purely transportation. TCO has little to do with it. I guess I could buy that it is a reward someone gives themselves for working hard and being successful.
TCO is more relevant in a commercial setting where downtime is lost wage productivity.
On the cost, I identify strand-able items (like the heater core hose on my '08 Caravan that just let go last week), versus identifiable failure modes (bearings, struts, etc.) If the transmission ever failed on my Caravan, away to the auction it would go if I couldn't find a cost-effective replacement... Then again, I purchased it so cheap because the body wasn't immaculate, I could afford to replace the tranny a few times over...
Face it ...New cars are more for ego and image than purely transportation. TCO has little to do with it. I guess I could buy that it is a reward someone gives themselves for working hard and being successful.
TCO is more relevant in a commercial setting where downtime is lost wage productivity.
On the cost, I identify strand-able items (like the heater core hose on my '08 Caravan that just let go last week), versus identifiable failure modes (bearings, struts, etc.) If the transmission ever failed on my Caravan, away to the auction it would go if I couldn't find a cost-effective replacement... Then again, I purchased it so cheap because the body wasn't immaculate, I could afford to replace the tranny a few times over...
last 2 yrs- 2015 and 2016 my civic has costed me about 84 per month for repairs . Tranny, clutch and motor are ok, its everything else like some front end parts , exhaust, cruise control module belts , water pump, front brakes.
Originally Posted By: dishdude
Cavaliers are great cars if you want low cost motoring. I like how they drive, they have decent room inside, the seats and ride are comfy. Decent power - not going to win any races but enough for everyday driving. Purchase price is low, they rarely break but when they do parts are plentiful and cheap, plus repairs are simple. They were always tops on my list when picking up a beater.
I agree and is why I and my fiancee both drive older Cavaliers. Mine is a 92 RS with an automatic and hers is a 94 with an automatic. Both have the 2.2L 4 cylinders.
I bought mine 10 years ago with 76,000 original miles but it was wrecked in the front end. I bought it for $500, paid $500 for used front end sheetmetal and to get the uni-body repaired and have been driving it since. I have done regular maintenance and wear item repairs but for the most part has been very reliable and cheap to fix. Car now has almost 216,000 miles on it. I plan to drive it until it drops.
I do have my 2014 Mustang GT as a newer car for long trips. I've had it for almost three years with only 21,000 miles.
Wayne
Cavaliers are great cars if you want low cost motoring. I like how they drive, they have decent room inside, the seats and ride are comfy. Decent power - not going to win any races but enough for everyday driving. Purchase price is low, they rarely break but when they do parts are plentiful and cheap, plus repairs are simple. They were always tops on my list when picking up a beater.
I agree and is why I and my fiancee both drive older Cavaliers. Mine is a 92 RS with an automatic and hers is a 94 with an automatic. Both have the 2.2L 4 cylinders.
I bought mine 10 years ago with 76,000 original miles but it was wrecked in the front end. I bought it for $500, paid $500 for used front end sheetmetal and to get the uni-body repaired and have been driving it since. I have done regular maintenance and wear item repairs but for the most part has been very reliable and cheap to fix. Car now has almost 216,000 miles on it. I plan to drive it until it drops.
I do have my 2014 Mustang GT as a newer car for long trips. I've had it for almost three years with only 21,000 miles.
Wayne
Originally Posted By: andrewp1998
last 2 yrs- 2015 and 2016 my civic has costed me about 84 per month for repairs . Tranny, clutch and motor are ok, its everything else like some front end parts , exhaust, cruise control module belts , water pump, front brakes.
Yikes over 2000 dollars in repairs on a car that isn't worth that much to begin with. I love old Civics but am glad I dumped my 05 with 300k on it as it was headed in that direction. I hope it's replacement, two years older but half the mileage is a better investment. I risked 1500 dollars on that proposition, so we'll see. It's really nice to have a reliable beater.
last 2 yrs- 2015 and 2016 my civic has costed me about 84 per month for repairs . Tranny, clutch and motor are ok, its everything else like some front end parts , exhaust, cruise control module belts , water pump, front brakes.
Yikes over 2000 dollars in repairs on a car that isn't worth that much to begin with. I love old Civics but am glad I dumped my 05 with 300k on it as it was headed in that direction. I hope it's replacement, two years older but half the mileage is a better investment. I risked 1500 dollars on that proposition, so we'll see. It's really nice to have a reliable beater.
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