Coolant leak in the passenger foot well

[Tosh]

Over $4k into a 13-14 year old Tercel? That's not an investment, that's an addiction.

I also like the aftermarket heater core idea. But why mess with the radiator?

You need a new mechanic.

 

[PandaBear]

Now now, play nice. It is a passion just like people keeping old muscle car alive at all cost. Nothing wrong with trying to get a million mile car record. It's his choice after all.


Agree with the new mechanic idea. Gouging someone $700 for a radiator job and double charge the labor and coolant flush is absurd.

 

[PandaBear]

I've heard that there is a type of coolant that you can run up to the engine operation temperature without pressurizing the system, and many with constant plastic pressure tank (i.e. Taurus, Mustang) run this coolant without a pressure cap (just a constant open cap to prevent spill) and it solves a lot of leak/semi leak problem.

This plus bar stop leak will probably solve all the problems in the world, at least for another 3 years, which he may get another 30k miles out of the car.

 

[Tosh]

That 'stop-leak' stuff is what you put in a car you're trying to get rid of, not in a keeper, as it sticks to everything.

 

[PandaBear]

Originally Posted By: Tosh
That 'stop-leak' stuff is what you put in a car you're trying to get rid of, not in a keeper, as it sticks to everything.


How about this:

1. disconnect the hoses into the heater core, including the water flow control thingy, if it is in the firewall, not in the dash.

2. Pour JB Weld into the inlet of the heater core, slightly pressureize it to force some out of the cracks. Then drain the JB weld from the outlet quickly when you push compressed air into the other end.

3. Let it dry for a few days, make sure there is at least some flow from the inlet to outlet.

4. Reconnect the radiator hose and the water flow switch thingy.



Now you have a sealed heater core with reduced heat conductivity, and maybe a bit of JB weld overflow. Cheap and easy fix?

 

[sifan]

I forgot to mention that one of the two O2 sensors also got replaced. My Tercel is so mechanically simple. Since most of the expensive parts are already replaced, I expect it to provide several years of reliable service down the road. $1700 can buy you a high mileage used car; but, you will have to start the cycle of replacing expensive parts. My Tercel has been thru that cycle. Unless you like to buy disposable old cars.

 

[IndyIan]

I have a pair of 87 skidoo's that have 1/4 the complexity of the new machines that I plan on keeping for a long time, so I can sort of understand what sifan is doing. I'm pretty sure my sleds are actually appreciating due to their simplicity but that's another story.
It's more cost effective to do all the work yourself but if you can't then you still might come out ahead.
Not many people here criticize people who buy new cars, they lose $5k+ in the first 100 yards of ownership. I guess if I was going to try to make a used car go forever, a tercel would be fairly high up on the list of cars to do it with.
Good luck,
ian

 

[PandaBear]

Originally Posted By: sifan
I forgot to mention that one of the two O2 sensors also got replaced. My Tercel is so mechanically simple. Since most of the expensive parts are already replaced, I expect it to provide several years of reliable service down the road. $1700 can buy you a high mileage used car; but, you will have to start the cycle of replacing expensive parts. My Tercel has been thru that cycle. Unless you like to buy disposable old cars.


Is the O2 part of that $1700 price? How much does he charge you for the O2? Usually only the before CAT O2 needs to be replaced and the after CAT is there to check if the CAT works. Did the car throw a code that fails the O2?

There is nothing wrong with keeping a car forever. I'm doing the same with my 2 high mileage cars (216k and 186k), just that I do my own work and am conscious about parts and labor cost, and what needs to be fixed or not. That's not for everyone though, messing with spring compressor could be a bit scary and dangerous.

 

[OVERKILL]

Dear Lord that is a lot of money. I did the heater core in my Mustang for $25.00!!!!

 

[sifan]

O2 sensor was replaced a year ago. I jsut wanted to mention that it is in the list of parts being replaced so far. I should be able to replace the radiator myself if only I have a garage. I ask the repair shop for an additional coolant flush service because someone suggested that there would be some coolant remained in the engine block even after the heater core replacement. I just thought it was a good time to have the entire cooling system replaced.

 

[PandaBear]

Originally Posted By: sifan
O2 sensor was replaced a year ago. I jsut wanted to mention that it is in the list of parts being replaced so far. I should be able to replace the radiator myself if only I have a garage. I ask the repair shop for an additional coolant flush service because someone suggested that there would be some coolant remained in the engine block even after the heater core replacement. I just thought it was a good time to have the entire cooling system replaced.


You don't need a garage to replace the radiator on a Tercel, just a parking spot with good lighting, a drain pan, some hand tools like rachet, screw drivers, pliers, not even a jack or jack stand.

A flush is only useful to clean up the gunked up coolant after a head gasket leak, or if you accidentally mixed the coolant (which you did in your case with Toyota Red and get the orange stuff in return), flush is just a few drain and refill of water till clear, then add concentrated coolant to 1/2 the total capacity according to the owner's manual. A radiator replacement included a flush to not void the radiator warranty, so the shop has to do it anyways and is already included in the price, therefore I said he double charged you.

Now if he is saying that he will use a chemical flush like the Prestone cooling system cleaner (Citric Acid), then that makes sense for the price, but is wasteful unless you have problems with cooling system.

 

[addyguy]

Originally Posted By: sifan
I forgot to mention that one of the two O2 sensors also got replaced. My Tercel is so mechanically simple. Since most of the expensive parts are already replaced, I expect it to provide several years of reliable service down the road. $1700 can buy you a high mileage used car; but, you will have to start the cycle of replacing expensive parts. My Tercel has been thru that cycle. Unless you like to buy disposable old cars.


You do realize you're completely contradicting yourself, don't you?

By spending almost $6k, you are 'replacing expensive parts'!

It would be more entertaining for you to flush money down the toilet and watch it swirl.....

 

[sifan]

Just got the call that the car is ready for pick up. It took them two days to replace the heater core because they had to perform the repair with wirings still connecting to the dash. They were surprise to find no connecters between the wirings and the dash to allow complete dash removal. It is a good thing that they still charged by the book not by hours.

 

[PandaBear]

Originally Posted By: sifan
It is a good thing that they still charged by the book not by hours.


For a $1700 job, they wouldn't dare to.

Just wondering, do they quote you by Mitchell? How much is their hourly labor?

 

[sifan]

Just picked up the car. Here is the breakdown of invoice:

Parts: Sub-Total 710.16

Heater Core 389.46
Radiator 199.95
Hose 22.00
Hose 25.00
Clamp (x 4) 6.00
Toyota Antifreeze 27.95
Gear Lube 39.80

--------------------------------------

Labor: Sub-Total 965.15

Replace heater core and light behind heater control panel
696.50
Replace radiator, and upper and lower radiator hoses
149.25
Flush cooling system, pressure test for leaks and install new antifreeze
69.65
Drain and refile trans
49.75

-------------------------------------

Shop supplies 59.95
Tax 46.21
Grand Total: 1781.47


I don't think I want to go thru the hassle of replacing the heater core myself. And I don't have the tool to pressure test the cooling sytem. The only saving for DIY is installing the radiator and hoses which is a very small portion of total bill. I would rather let the repair shop replace the entire cooling system altogether with warranty.

 

[benjamming]

What is their hourly rate?

 

[The Critic]

Originally Posted By: benjamming
What is their hourly rate?

Judging from the labor totals, I'd guess about $100/hr, which is about average these days.

 

[PandaBear]

I'd still say they triple charge the labor for the coolant drain and refill.

That's some expensive gear lube for $39, and the $390 heater core. I guess if you let the mechanic buy parts everything is retail, oh well. The plus side is $199 is fair for a radiator that radiator barn sells for $170, and the drain refill transmission is fair for $50 labor.

 

[PandaBear]

Originally Posted By: sifan

I don't think I want to go thru the hassle of replacing the heater core myself. And I don't have the tool to pressure test the cooling sytem. The only saving for DIY is installing the radiator and hoses which is a very small portion of total bill. I would rather let the repair shop replace the entire cooling system altogether with warranty.


No need to pressure test anything; you already replaced almost everything.

Well, if $220 labor sounds small to you.... what can I say.

 

[sifan]

Who knows if the new parts were defective without being pressure tested. I do not intend to find out while being stranded on the side of road. I have read many threads here that people experiencing leaky radiators installed themselves.

Well, I think the topic of bring your own parts to have a repair shop to install them for you has been discussed to death here. I expect the repair shop to make a little profit on parts.

I am looking forward another 300K miles of a reliable cooling system down the road.