Convince a Hemi owner that...

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Originally Posted By: LargeCarManX2
Originally Posted By: tig1
Here is the link for M1 0-20 and Chryslers spec is included.

http://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/MotorOil/Oils/Mobil_1_0W-20.aspx


It does meet the spec, but Mobil dances around the MSD 5w20 vs. 0w20 issue by saying follow the OEM rec? Caterham where are ya?


If his Hemi calls for Chryslers MS-6395 spec then M1 0-20 is fine. Not sure what you mean by dances around the MSD 5-20 vs. 0-20 issue.
 
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Originally Posted By: Nick R
So I use 5W-20 in my focus, and I drive hard. So when I have 200k miles on it and it still runs perfectly, what will you give me?
wink.gif



when u say u drive hard, u mean red line it every time ? full throat ? its still just a focus ^^
 
Actually yes. I regularly hit 4k, and redline at least once, twice a day (usually on our extremely short dual-merge lanes we have up here). But it sees WOT a lot, because it's fun.
 
Originally Posted By: LargeCarManX2
This Hemi owner is stuck on the point that the OEM wants a 5w20 and I am looking for tech talk to help convince him otherwise?


Do yourself a favor, if you want to use 0W20 don't call Chrysler and ask them. I did with my Jeep and they told me only to use 5W20, nothing else PERIOD! Their tech people are clueless, at least the people I spoke with. 0W20 will be fine, I'm using it in the 08 Jeep.
 
One thing that is clear from this thread, is that those recommending Xw30 don't know about the MDS system on the Hemi. Don't use Xw30 if you have that system on your truck.
 
It's a viscosity thing. Oil is used by Chrysler to do the 'work' in the MDS system.

And as a long term Hemi owner since August 05, it has been repeatedly proven that MDS is not disabled or damaged by heavier oils. Just changes the characteristics a bit.

One thing I can assure you, the new gen Hemi is not some precision import. It's a classic old school American V8 with big clearances and all. My engine factory spec's 0W-40 and 15W-50 (via TSB) and is virtually identical without MDS!
 
Lots of other engines use oil as hydraulic fluid in cam phase variators or discrete/continuous variable valve duration and/or lift systems and they don't develop issues with a different grade of oil than specced, if appropriate.
 
Originally Posted By: maersk
What has cylinder deactivation have to do with anything oil related?


When MDS activates special solenoids located under the intake open and allow oil to flow through special oil galleries to some of the lifters. That high pressure flow of oil is used to depress the pins that allow the lifters in the deactivated cylinders to compress on themselves. Vital part of how MDS works. It will not function properly or at all with heavier weight oils.
 
Originally Posted By: LargeCarManX2
Convince a Hemi owner that... A 0w20 can be used in place of a 5w20.
Thanks,
LCM


Is this a 2005 HEMI Ram or a 2006+ HEMI Ram? Is this a 1500 or a 2500/3500 HD? No MDS in anything but the 1500's.

If it is a 2005 the 20 weight was strictly for CAFE reasons. You can run a 30 weight if you want or that 0W-20 and be just fine.

If it is a 2006+ HEMI Ram 1500 than you need a 20 weight oil for MDS to operate properly. 0W-20 and 5W-20 will both be 20 weights at operating temp. 0W will do nothing to help or harm you vs a similar 5W-20 but give you better cold start flow in extreme cold temps.

If you are under warranty and are concerned then just stay with the 5W-20. Run a good synthetic variety and you will have excellent cold start flow and protection to boot. Unless you routinely see sub zero temps 0W-20, IMO, will give you nothing over a similar 5W-20 synthetic.
 
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Where are the people who claim to just run a xw30 and it doesn't matter about MDS because "30's shear to 20's anyway" in this thread?

wink.gif
 
0W-20 would be fine if it meets the chrysler MS-6395 spec., I wouldn't recommend a 30wt. I have an 05 Jeep Grand Cherokee Hemi with MDS, I have run conventional 5w-20 oil in it since new. The hemi still runs great at almost 85,000 miles, and I never had the dreaded "hemi-tick". For all the issues Chrysler has with reliability (think transmissions), the Hemi seems to be the one thing they really got right, use any 20wt oil that meets spec with confidence.
 
Originally Posted By: NHHEMI
Vital part of how MDS works. It will not function properly or at all with heavier weight oils.


This is completely false. MDS operation is merely changed, NOT disabled by heavier oils.
 
Just stating what I have been told by Chrysler tech's and that is any weight but a 20 weight will cause improper operation of the system or even cause it to not work at all. If I am wrong ok whatever. If you have MDS use what the mfg calls for which is 20 weight and then no worries.
 
Originally Posted By: tig1
If his Hemi calls for Chryslers MS-6395 spec then M1 0-20 is fine. Not sure what you mean by dances around the MSD 5-20 vs. 0-20 issue.


I doubt it, if we want to split hairs. The owner's manual calls for 5W-20. Period. There are no allowances for any other viscosity grades, according to the owner's manual:

Quote:
Use API Certified SAE 5W-20 Engine Oil, meeting the requirements of Chrysler Material Standard MS-6395.


There's not even a graph showing alternate grades for severe temperatures. Again, from the owner's manual:

Quote:
Lubricants which do not have both the engine oil certification mark and the correct SAE viscosity grade number
should not be used.


I'm in complete agreement with those recommending 0W-20 here. But Chrysler is extremely clear on oil grade, so while under warranty, I'd use what they say.
 
Originally Posted By: Hokiefyd
Originally Posted By: tig1
If his Hemi calls for Chryslers MS-6395 spec then M1 0-20 is fine. Not sure what you mean by dances around the MSD 5-20 vs. 0-20 issue.


I doubt it, if we want to split hairs. The owner's manual calls for 5W-20. Period. There are no allowances for any other viscosity grades, according to the owner's manual:

Quote:
Use API Certified SAE 5W-20 Engine Oil, meeting the requirements of Chrysler Material Standard MS-6395.


There's not even a graph showing alternate grades for severe temperatures. Again, from the owner's manual:

Quote:
Lubricants which do not have both the engine oil certification mark and the correct SAE viscosity grade number
should not be used.


I'm in complete agreement with those recommending 0W-20 here. But Chrysler is extremely clear on oil grade, so while under warranty, I'd use what they say.


According to the PDS for M1 0-20 it does meet the requirement for Chrysler MS-6395. Here is the link.

http://www.mobil.com/USA-English/Lubes/PDS/GLXXENPVLMOMobil_1_0W-20_Advanced_Fuel_Economy.aspx
 
Yes, the oil lists Chrysler's material specification. It's still not applicable to the vehicle in question because it's not the correct viscosity grade. It also meets GM4718M, but that doesn't mean that it's necessarily applicable to any GM calling for that specification. Do not the material spec and viscosity grade, together, define the "correct" oil to be used?

To me, Chrysler's pretty clear when they say (emphasis mine):

Quote:
Lubricants which do not have BOTH the engine oil certification mark AND the correct SAE viscosity grade number should not be used.
 
Originally Posted By: NHHEMI
Originally Posted By: maersk
What has cylinder deactivation have to do with anything oil related?


When MDS activates special solenoids located under the intake open and allow oil to flow through special oil galleries to some of the lifters. That high pressure flow of oil is used to depress the pins that allow the lifters in the deactivated cylinders to compress on themselves. Vital part of how MDS works. It will not function properly or at all with heavier weight oils.


+ 1, I have a 2010 Hemi and the MDS seems to work best with 5W-20 syn.
 
My buddy has an 08, and has used 0W30 and 0W20. He claims it runs better with the 0W20.
 
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