Chlorinated paraffin theoretical questions ...

[CITYSLICKER]

1. Which Chlor/paras are extremely toxic ?

A. I have read that longer chain CP's are not prone to breakdown into toxic components . True ?

B. Assuming limited use ( and limited decomposition ) are some of them safe ?

B.1 What is it that breaks down CP's ? Heat or shear ?

B.2 How much ( insert answer to B.1 ) does it take ?

B.3 I have read that CP's excell at high heat , high load performance prior to breakdown . True ?



2. What composition are the CP's in various cutting oils ?
Long , Short , mixed ?



I am absolutely NOT considering adding cutting oil to my motor oil !
What I am pondering is whether CP's would be beneficial to a high temp , high momentary load , very short use interval light grease .
Some skin contact would be inevitable , I'd like to die from ( insert common and undreadful geriatric complication here )
and not cancer or poisoning by CP's.

If this is a really stupid idea feel free to point that out , I'm just tossing this around in my head .


Awsome forum ! Glad to know I'm not alone ...

 

[MolaKule]

What breaks down CP's are high temps and moisture. Each CP compound has different breakdown temps.

Alternatively, I would use a polyurea grease for impulse loads at high temps.

I hope this does not have anything to do with internal ballistics.

 

[CITYSLICKER]

Originally Posted By: MolaKule

I hope this does not have anything to do with internal ballistics.

No it doesn't have anything at all to do with internal ballistics , however the end product could very well have applications in lubricating mechanical devices which initiate ballistic events .

Polyurea ...

 

[Tempest]

Not a lube engineer but I have studied CP products for some time.

There are many gun lubes out there that are CP (or some type of chlor EP chem) based. Some are better than others, and all are long chain based as best I can tell. I use Weapon Shield (long chain).

The basic nature of grease makes CP much easier to use. Wilson/Protec lube is a light lithium CP based grease.

Long chain are considered safe. Short and medium chain are considered dangerous and must be reported.

CP can provide very high load levels and reduce friction via the EP films formed and the rolling out of surface asperities.

 

[bruce381]

1. Which Chlor/paras are extremely toxic ?

Short Carbon chain like C10-C13 and mid range C14 -C17


A. I have read that longer chain CP's are not prone to breakdown into toxic components . True ?

Yes NOT at this time not a carcinogen


B. Assuming limited use ( and limited decomposition ) are some of them safe ?


Yes Long chain are used in cutting oils and some lubes old style greaes and some of the old style EMD locomotove oils.


B.1 What is it that breaks down CP's ? Heat or shear ?

Heat greater than 300F or so starts decomposition in HCL etc.


B.2 How much ( insert answer to B.1 ) does it take ?

See above


B.3 I have read that CP's excell at high heat , high load performance prior to breakdown . True ?

Yes hotter they get the faster they react with metal surfaces


2. What composition are the CP's in various cutting oils ?
Long , Short , mixed ?


Most use long and some mid range to keep from having to label as a carcinogen THOUGH some cutting oisl still use Short both in USA and offshore they are cheaper.

Why do you want some to play with I can send you long chain if you want to try some typical treat rate to see a big improvement in load is about 1-2%.
bruce

 

[bruce381]

In a gun lube they may cause rust problems due to HCL formation this is limited by useing a high TBN CA or amine to reat with the HCL and forma salt I do not use them In my gun lubes to problematic Phos esters would be a better way to go.
bruce

 

[Dale_Knight]

Would 120 ppm's of chlorine in a motor oil indicate use of chlorinated paraffins. I posted this VOA of a PetroCanada oil the other day and was wondering about that element;

PetroCanada Duron-E Synthetic 0W40 VOA;

http://freepdfhosting.com/uploads/0f88d828bb.pdf

 

[MolaKule]

Yes.

Regarding internal ballistic initators,

I would use one of the new ashless and phosphorus-free AW/EP adds. Some of these also contain anti-oxidants.

 

[CITYSLICKER]

Sounds like 300 degree breakdown temp pretty much rules these out .

What would be some names of phos-free AW/EP adds ?

 

[Tempest]

300 degrees for how long? Guns simply do not see these temps for very long unless you are shooting a belt fed and even then you are talking about just minutes. Engines see elevated temps for tens of hours between oil changes.

http://www.doverchem.com/prelease6.aspx?menuid=1&itemid=8
The inhibitor packages for these things have improved greatly. Proper formulation is the key.

I too am interested the ashless AW/EP Molakule talked about.