Chevy kills the 45K base blazer trim .

[supton]

Its interesting though the selectivity of it.

Data centers use as much or more power than EV's as do large buildings but no one is at all in the slightest worried about their proliferation.

We all sit and click away without the slightest thought about whats behind it all.

Quite true. Our interconnectedness, and instant-now for the web, has a huge amount of power behind it. Computers don't work for free. Beats the alternative, maybe it's less energy than sending out newsprint and books, but it's still not free.

At least our computers aren't using vacuum tubes anymore. But sum total, the more efficient we make any computer or gizmo, the more of them we seem to now need. We used to hang a single 60W bulb in a room--and god forbid if you left it on after leaving the room. Now we install 10's of LED lights around the perimeter, light it to look like the outdoors, and think nothing of leaving the lights on, "they're LED, hardly any draw".

Jevons paradox - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

In 1865, the English economist William Stanley Jevons observed that technological improvements that increased the efficiency of coal use led to the increased consumption of coal in a wide range of industries. He argued that, contrary to common intuition, technological progress could not be relied upon to reduce fuel consumption.

 

[JavierH19]

Doubt. 84 and 96 mo loans make it possible.

Don't forget the brain damage either. But these need to be paid off. GM finances these things themselves most of the time and they're finding out the hard way right now. Repo's are through the roof. To make up for it the stealers are now asking for much bigger down payments and the rising rates are making it nearly impossible even for the stupid to make it work with 84-144 month financing . And if they make it work at first they'll definitely be underwater on the remainder when they try to trade it in and they will likely just roll that negative equity into the new loan.

 

[SammyChevelleTypeS3]

Its interesting though the selectivity of it.

Data centers use as much or more power than EV's as do large buildings but no one is at all in the slightest worried about their proliferation.

We all sit and click away without the slightest thought about whats behind it all.

Data centers and buildings.... TRUE. What can John Doe do about that except acknowledge that fact? What exactly is behind it all? Not trying to thow rocks. Really interested in your idea/facts many of us may be missing?

 

[E365]

I'm not sure your links show transparency.
I have not seen any financials that break out EV results, such as margins or even top line/bottom line numbers. Have you?

No.

But I’m not understanding how they’re trying to “hide” losses, as you claim. They’ve been saying it publicly for years - their EVs won’t make any profit until they reach much higher volume.

They even have said publicly that EVs under $40k likely won’t be profitable until well PAST 2025, maybe even 2030.

GM CEO says Tesla has the lead in electric cars, doesn't see profitable $30-40K EVs until end of decade

GM CEO Mary Barra says that she doesn’t see profitable electric cars in the $30,000 to $40,000 range until the...

electrek.co

 

[UncleDave]

Data centers and buildings.... TRUE. What can John Doe do about that except acknowledge that fact? What exactly is behind it all? Not trying to thow rocks. Really interested in your idea/facts many of us may be missing?

I think the big thing poeple arent picking up is that there a bunch of ways to make electricity, and we can control our own destiny in that regard.

What cannot be done is to create peace in the middle east and as long as our standard of living is based on somone else's decisions we aren't in control of our own destiny.

When we don't need anyones oil, or don't need it on the market to afford our own, we will be able to use and enjoy it without compromise to our own security.

I think the timelines set out by places like cali are ridiculous and mandates will fold as we cant replace trucks, and I despise being told what to do.

I also despise being beholden to people that would just as soon kill us as sell their product to us.

 

[JeffKeryk]

No.

But I’m not understanding how they’re trying to “hide” losses, as you claim. They’ve been saying it publicly for years - their EVs won’t make any profit until they reach much higher volume.

Transparancy comes through discrete numbers. Ford has reorganized itself into three business units, Ford Model e for electric vehicles, Ford Blue for vehicles with combustion engines and Ford Pro for commercial vehicles.

Ford reports financials broken out by BU. No one else does this. They are burying actual results in the bigger picture. How can the EV progress be measured? They have the numbers internally. I say, publish them just as Ford does.

 

[Torrid]

Kinda bizarre a Blazer RS AWD will be almost the same price as a LYRIQ Tech AWD ($60k vs. $62k) and with less range than a LYRIQ

That's rough. For a similar price I'd rather have the Cadillac badge anyway.

 

[zzyzzx]

True, but what happens if and when people wise up financially? Or someone offers a vehicle that makes sense?

Neither of which is likely to happen.

 

[Torrid]

New vehicles are rapidly becoming unaffordable to the average working man.

It's true. I know I don't make bad money, but I just have a hard time buying some of these vehicles. Trucks of the same trim I used to have go for $25k more than the one I bought new in '17. Prices are stupid and it's concerning. Even the small performance cars I like are getting dumb. Performance hatches used to be reasonable. Some are over $50k now.

 

[Torrid]

Working? Who does that anymore? Working is for chumps.

Gotta find a way to have "other people's money" pay for it. Mom and dad, the government, evil corporations, Youtube, whatever.

I can tell you how to make 6 figures starting tomorrow with no education past high school, but 80% that get hired quit in the first month. My schedule sucks, but my paycheck is hard to be mad at. Some weeks I only work 3 days, but most I work 5-6 days. My phone last night rang at 9:55pm to be to work at 11:55pm.

I think that's where the people don't want to work these days really comes into play. It's there, but people need to make some uncomfortable sacrifices.

 

[BMWTurboDzl]

They will be the first to come crying to the government/public to for special rules to protect them, or bail them out from their inefficient and/or bad business decisions though.
If the domestics can't or won't sell a reasonably priced vehicle, for 3/4+ of the market, then its not really in the majority of the public's interest to save them next time...
Toyota and Honda built their reputation from zero, by making their entry level cars half decent, and then people bought their more expensive models for the rest of their lives.
We'll see how it plays out I guess, abandoning the first time buyer market and then expecting them to plunk down 50-60-70k+ on their first purchase with your company sounds like a bad strategy to me, but we'll see.

It's cheaper for govt to provide bailout money which will be paid back rather than a direct bailout (ie. takeover) of pension plans for thousands of workers who vote.

 

[SammyChevelleTypeS3]

I think the big thing poeple arent picking up is that there a bunch of ways to make electricity, and we can control our own destiny in that regard.

What cannot be done is to create peace in the middle east and as long as our standard of living is based on somone else's decisions we aren't in control of our own destiny.

When we don't need anyones oil, or don't need it on the market to afford our own, we will be able to use and enjoy it without compromise to our own security.

I think the timelines set out by places like cali are ridiculous and mandates will fold as we cant replace trucks, and I despise being told what to do.

I also despise being beholden to people that would just as soon kill us as sell their product to us.

Me too! Unfortunately it seems like about 90% of the countries on the globe want our donations while at same time want our way of living and US destroyed! All so very disturbing and senseless. Way too much HATE in the world.

 

[IndyIan]

It's cheaper for govt to provide bailout money which will be paid back rather than a direct bailout (ie. takeover) of pension plans for thousands of workers who vote.

True, I suspect that the companies wanted control of those pension funds in the first place? But again, they don't want to manage the pension funds properly with no unfunded liabilities....
The pension fund should've been untouchable by the companies and managed by an independent board, in the interest of the employees, as its their money for their retirement.

 

[Cujet]

The latest nonsense:​

Electric Cars Aren't Affordable Because America's Workforce Is Underpaid​

Electric Cars Aren't Affordable Because America's Workforce Is Underpaid

Ford claims its EVs are too expensive for customers as the automaker makes record profits

jalopnik.com

 

[DwightFrye]

Spot on. Mortgage the house... Big payments forever. Cars are a depreciating asset; what will it be worth in 5 years and you still have 2 years of payments remaining?
Unless you are financially set, signing on the line is a crazy move, IMO.

I heard a news report yesterday about the amount of profit auto dealers are making on new car sales. While they are selling less cars than before the pandemic, the average profit per sale is almost double. I'm sure a lot of it has to do with their additional markup added to the sticker price or the old supply & demand factor where haggling down to just a couple of hundred dollars above invoice is a thing of the past.

Also, far too many people fall for the "how much can I afford in the way of a payment every month" trap and this is why we see 72 or 84 month payment plans. There are a lot of dumb people out there. I'll bet if they took a pad and pencil and accounted for where they spend their money every month there would be a lot of places they could make cuts rather than being in a perpetual auto loan program for the rest of their lives.

 

[UncleDave]

Transparancy comes through discrete numbers. Ford has reorganized itself into three business units, Ford Model e for electric vehicles, Ford Blue for vehicles with combustion engines and Ford Pro for commercial vehicles.

Ford reports financials broken out by BU. No one else does this. They are burying actual results in the bigger picture. How can the EV progress be measured? They have the numbers internally. I say, publish them just as Ford does.

Continuing on with your input -

Is Ford doing better than GM?
We don't know, but we do know exactly how Ford is performing here.
They made a tough choice and put themselves in the crosshairs of everyone - to let us all see so we can answer the question exactly.

The shareholders of GM have no idea nor does anyone as long as they put everything into a central bucket.
The GM management team isn't giving us the tools to observe their performance here like Ford is.
In the corporate world this is considered hiding.

 

[PF52]

I can tell you how to make 6 figures starting tomorrow with no education past high school, but 80% that get hired quit in the first month. My schedule sucks, but my paycheck is hard to be mad at. Some weeks I only work 3 days, but most I work 5-6 days. My phone last night rang at 9:55pm to be to work at 11:55pm.

LOL Which railroad is it?

 

[Torrid]

LOL Which railroad is it?

Pretty much any of the class 1s. I haven't worked for UP, but I haven't heard good things about them from the people I know that worked there. Without saying which one I work for now I'd recommend BNSF, CP, or CN. I think those the top pay wise at this time.

 

[E365]

Sounds like that $56,715 2LT AWD price includes the Convenience and Driver Confidence package (RPO code WPN) and Comfort and Convenience package (RPO code ZFT).

Base 2LT AWD is $53,195. 2LT FWD still has no price. Better, but still too expensive.

https://gmauthority.com/blog/2023/08/more-2024-chevy-blazer-ev-pricing-details-uncovered/

 

[buster]

* deleted.