auto-rx and saab

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Quick question, my new to me saab (used) runs synthetic. I want to do the auto-rx would like to run dino during the treatment phase, what weight should I use and have any SAAB owners gone dino for treatment or just kept synthetic.

Sean
 
Use the same viscosity as your synthetic oil.. Also you can clean using the synthetic oil and go to a Group 111 for rinse mode. No need to waste your current oil.
 
I have a 2001 Saab 9-3 SE, I use Rotella 5w40 (group III) for the clean phase and rinse phase, as advised by Frank.

My engine runs quieter, smoother and got rid of timing chain noise.

Sean, What year is your Saab? Have you dropped the oil pan or lifted the valve cover to see if you have any sludge in there ?
 
Boy, red warning flares go off when I read this post. Navydiesel, you'd better do some reading on this issue. The Saab 9-3 2.0L Turbo is a known sludger engine, model years 2000-2004. Another problem for them is the 2.3L Turbo, model years 1999-2004.

If you bought this car used, I would almost guarantee you have a sludge problem.

If you're mechanically inclined, you should get this valve cover off immediately. If it's severely sludged, you'll need to consider dropping the oil pan to hand-clean.

Saab, as with VW, are horrible about backing their customers on this known problem. You are pretty much on your own. Used Saab engines are outrageously expensive, when compared to other used engines. I've learned about these Saab problems as I am currently trying to help a friend with a 00 9-3 2.0L sludged up engine. Pan has been dropped & cleaned, as well as under valve covers. Currently doing the ARX heavily sludged treatment process. Oil filters are coming off his engine FULL of carbon like small particles.

Hate to say it, but odds are you are right there with my friend. Good luck - but get on it NOW!
 
Clearly pulling the valve cover and oil pan cover would be good for a visual inspection and also to wipe off any sludge on the valve cover and oil pan and oil pump screen. However if you won't get to that for awhile then I would start the Auto-Rx cleaning today with the oil you have in it (assuming it has some time left on it.) Then use what others have suggested, a Group III synthetic for rinse. Depending on mileage, you may want to do a second treatment. And if your vehicle is a sludger, then I would certainly use maint. doeses of Auto-Rx.
 
Sadly, I have a feeling that when he removes the valve cover, we won't be talking *wiping*, but rather scraping out the chunks with a putty knife or screwdriver.
 
Originally Posted By: Market525
Boy, red warning flares go off when I read this post. Navydiesel, you'd better do some reading on this issue. The Saab 9-3 2.0L Turbo is a known sludger engine, model years 2000-2004. Another problem for them is the 2.3L Turbo, model years 1999-2004.


Are you sure about the dates for the 2.0? I've certainly heard about the sludge problem in the Saab-designed B205 and B235 engines (I had one in my 9-5), but AFAIK Saab switched the 9-3 to the Ecotec-based motor when it did introduced the redesigned model for 2003. I have heard absolutely nothing about sludge in any Ecotec series engines.
 
You can click on link /www.saabcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=62943>

and get information plus photos, regarding sludge.

Or you can dial up http://www.cruil.com and type in auto-rx saab sludge
and get same information and photos.

The Cruil search engine is excellent plus you have available 7 years of information on Auto-Rx.
 
02Pilot, I am sure. Plenty out there to read about the problem, just google saab engine sludge.

Problematic engines for Saab:
99-03 Saab 9-5 w the 2.3 Turbo
00-02 Saab 9-3 with the 2.0 Turbo
00-03 Saab 9-3 convertible w/ the 2.0 Turbo
99 9-3 Viggen w/ the 2.3 Turbo

Multiple causes discussed, too small oil sump, dealers and owners using incorrect oil (non synthetic) neglect by owners - incorrect oil, long drain intervals, and running engines low on oil. Also a plugged PCV system. Once the sludge build-up starts, plugged turbo oil line, resulting in a destroyed turbo. On & on the list goes. Bottom line - very problematic engine.
 
There is plenty on Google about sludge,however there is no information I found on how to control the problem.People who have sludge issues are not too interested in how it happened just is there an inexpensive way to get it under control and save their engine.

Another alternative is a Saab Forum.
 
Here is more information on sludge.Including Saab.

Oil Sludge: The Silent Killer
Interesting video.
http://cbs11tv.com/investigators/oil.sludge.engine.2.497439.html

Oil Sludge: The Silent Killer
by Bennett Cunningham

(CBS 11 News) It's a silent killer and left unchecked, it will destroy your engine.

Oil sludge is as nasty as it sounds. What causes it and who's at fault is up for debate. North Texan Michelle Nickleberry remembers how she found out. "The engine was making a horrible noise, it sounded like clank - clank - clank - it was very loud." Then she brought it to the shop and that's when they told her, "there was sludge in the engine."

Sludge occurs when engine passages become clogged with oil resulting in a catastrophic engine failure. At that point, engine replacement is the only option.

Audi replaced Michelle's engine for free but she says she was still curious about the "sludge". "When I found out they were replacing the engine, I went on the internet and did some researching on my own and that is when I found out there are hundreds of people across the U.S. who are having this same issue."

Michelle's intuition was correct. Since 2004, the Center for Auto Safety, a consumer advocacy group, logged more than 1000 oil sludge complaints from consumers.

In the last few years, Volkswagen, which owns Audi, extended its engine warranty to eight years on certain model year Audi A4 and VW Passats. Toyota, Lexus (owned by Toyota), and Saab also extended their engine warranties to eight years on some of their vehicles. Daimler-Chrysler is treating problems on a case by case basis.

Some auto companies point out that the number of engines affected by sludge is incredibly small compared to the number of engines on the market.

Dallas mechanic Todd Davis says he's had a few cars in his shop with sludge problems. "Once you take that valve cover off, open the engine its nasty - looks like a sewer." Davis says he sees it more and more on high performance engines.

Car manufacturers deny sludge is an engine design problem. Some say it's the motorists fault by failing to regularly change their engine oil. But motorists are fighting back, several class action lawsuits were filed against Volkswagen. Toyota settled a lawsuit on certain model year cars, including the Toyota Camry.

There are no absolute indicators of oil sludge. You have to open up the engine to see it. Here's how to prevent it:

* Change oil at regular intervals [follow car owners manual]
* Take serious any Engine stall or oil lamp indicator-have car inspected
* Keep all receipts for oil changes


Some car manufacturers will replace your engine for free, but you must have all of your receipts proving that you changed your engine oil at regular intervals.

Toyota/Lexus
http://www.oilgelsettlement.com

* Toyota Camry 4 cyl. 1997-2001
* Toyota Camry 6 cyl. 1997-2002
* Toyota Solara 4 cyl. 1999-2001
* Toyota Solara 6 cyl. 1999-2002
* Toyota Sienna 6 cyl. 1998-2002
* Toyota Avalon 6 cyl. 1997-2002
* Toyota Celica 4 cyl. 1997-1999
* Toyota Highlander 6 cyl. 2001-2002
* Lexus ES300 1997-2002
* Lexus RX300 1999-2002


Policy: Toyota/Lexus will cover Engine repairs and incidental damages due to engine oil gel for eight [8] years from the date of first sale or lease of the vehicle with no mileage limitation, so long as the customer has made reasonable efforts to maintain the vehicle. If the customer has a problem, Toyota will either repair or reimburse the cost of the repair of the vehicle and pay or reimburse reasonable incidental expenses.


Saab

* Saab 9-3 2000-2003
* Saab 9-5 1998-2003


Policy: 8 Year Extended Warranty on Engine and No mileage restriction.

Daimler-Chrysler

* Chrysler Concorde 1998-2002
* Chrysler Sebring 1998-2002
* Dodge Stratus 1998-2002
* Dodge Intrepid 1998-2002


Policy: Any vehicle's engine can be the victim of 'oil sludge' if the appropriate oil change schedules are not followed. We at Chrysler Group have not witnessed wide-spread issues with the condition but will review claims on a case-by-case basis for our customers. Chrysler Group customers who think they have such issues should contact the company directly at 1-800-992-1997 to ensure the claim is researched appropriately.

Volkswagen

* Passat 1.8L Turbo 1998-2004
* Passat 1.8L Turbo/Wagon 1998-2004


Policy: 8 Year Extended Warranty on Engine and No mileage restriction.

Audi

* Audi A4 1.8L Turbo 1998-2004


Policy: 8 Year Extended Warranty on Engine and No mileage restriction.


Richone
Veteran Member

Posts: 59
Date: Thu Jan 31 15:27:02 2008
 
Originally Posted By: Market525
02Pilot, I am sure. Plenty out there to read about the problem, just google saab engine sludge.

Problematic engines for Saab:
99-03 Saab 9-5 w the 2.3 Turbo
00-02 Saab 9-3 with the 2.0 Turbo
00-03 Saab 9-3 convertible w/ the 2.0 Turbo
99 9-3 Viggen w/ the 2.3 Turbo

Multiple causes discussed, too small oil sump, dealers and owners using incorrect oil (non synthetic) neglect by owners - incorrect oil, long drain intervals, and running engines low on oil. Also a plugged PCV system. Once the sludge build-up starts, plugged turbo oil line, resulting in a destroyed turbo. On & on the list goes. Bottom line - very problematic engine.


The original poster has a 2004 9-3, which does not have a B205 or B235 series engine (the ones you mention). I am quite familiar with the problems in these engines, but he does not have one in his 2004 9-3.
 
As far as sludge goes and SAAB, I am fully aware of the sludge issue. Hence I bought a used 04 which has not had the sludge issues of the earlier models. Thanks for the concern but I would really like some info using auto rx and synthetic with my vehicle.

Frank, thanks for the note.

Sean
 
Originally Posted By: flynavydiesel
As far as sludge goes and SAAB, I am fully aware of the sludge issue. Hence I bought a used 04 which has not had the sludge issues of the earlier models. Thanks for the concern but I would really like some info using auto rx and synthetic with my vehicle.

Frank, thanks for the note.

Sean


Don't worry about using synthetic as long as it's group III, like Pennzoil Platinum, etc.
 
Originally Posted By: flynavydiesel
As far as sludge goes and SAAB, I am fully aware of the sludge issue. Hence I bought a used 04 which has not had the sludge issues of the earlier models. Thanks for the concern but I would really like some info using auto rx and synthetic with my vehicle.

Frank, thanks for the note.

Sean


Welcome to SAAB ownership! Yes, you have an outstanding engine n the Ecotec. Use a GM-LL approved oil and you can go 15k miles or so by the oil life monitor with spectacular UOAs. Search for posts from "Cosmic Flash." I think that was his name.

No sludge problems with this beaut. I would do as the previous poster recommended. Use a group III synth like Rotella T Synth. It's perfectly fine for the Auto-RX interval and even does fine in the sludger models! It also won't compromise the cleaning ability of Auto-RX.
 
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